Crisis in UK, Can Tories Save Liz Truss?

[Huehuecoyotl]

If the minority in the UK who don't like Boris take some solace from the pollsters that's ok.

But the silent majority never get sampled by those very same pollsters. The silent majority would never respond even if they were. The silent majority like me do take a stroll down to the ballot box with their mighty pen on election day.

And as you will see come the next election, the cross in the boxes for our Boris and the Tory party will exceed by far those for anyone else. Calm yourselves, Boris is going nowhere.

And yet more lies and bullshit from the poster that can't deal in anything else.

The majority don't like Boris. The fact that all the old farts in your local Conservative Club like him is NOT indicative of the wider population. Clearly you don't understand how polling works (along with a long list of other things beyond your understanding). And I guarantee you of this; there will be more people voting against Boris in the next election than for him. And as your signature proves, not voting for something is the same as voting against it. So you believe that Boris shouldn't be in charge to begin with.

It's a shame when your hypocrisy works against you, isn't it?

[DarkAmbient]

Dribbles is just playing a satirical character, it's best to simply read and chuckle instead of responding seriously.

[Iliena]

But the silent majority never get sampled by those very same pollsters. The silent majority would never respond even if they were. The silent majority like me do take a stroll down to the ballot box with their mighty pen on election day.

What percentage of this "silent majority" watch GB News?
Why if you are part of this "silent majority" are you not keeping quiet and just letting your pen do the talking on election day?

[Edge-]

No chance of that, the British public adore him so successful has he been.

But the silent majority never get sampled by those very same pollsters.

M8, you either believe polls or you don't.

[Iliena]

Now that it looks like Boris is going to get 2 more fines! They have entered panic mode and up steps Priti Patel with a great idea...!

Some asylum seekers will be flown to Rwanda to have their applications processed,
under new government plans Boris Johnson is set to unveil the plans on Thursday, before Home Secretary Priti Patel signs a migration deal with the African nation.

Sources told the BBC the partnership would see some asylum seekers, such as those who arrive in the UK on small boats, relocated to Rwanda.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61097114

You couldn't make this shit up!

I hope this get's blocked by parliament, what a waste of public funds and you can just smell the judicial enquiry down the road already!

[Edge-]

Now that it looks like Boris is going to get 2 more fines! They have entered panic mode and up steps Priti Patel with a great idea...!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61097114

You couldn't make this shit up!

I hope this get's blocked by parliament, what a waste of public funds and you can just smell the judicial enquiry down the road already!

So...pay more to send them down to Rwanda, cover some of the costs there, and then pay to bring them back?

But in his speech, Mr Johnson will argue that action is needed to stop "vile people smugglers" turning the ocean into a "watery graveyard".

Punishing asylum seekers does not in any way discourage others from making the attempt or the actual human smugglers who don't care about what happens to them after they've paid the fee for passage.

Mr Johnson will say that the number of people making the perilous crossing could reach 1,000 a day within weeks, after about 600 arrived on Wednesday.

Contradicting the mass increase seen recently. At least we know the conservative love of fantasy remains.

The measures are part of the government's long-term plan to "take back control of illegal immigration" after Brexit, Mr Johnson will say.

But...I thought that was already done and considered a "Brexit Benefit(TM)"?

Critics point to Rwanda's poor human rights record. At the UN last year, the UK demanded investigations into alleged killings, disappearances and torture.

Man, it's almost like...the cruelty is the point?

This sounds like a terrible plan unless the goal is simply to remove brown and Black asylum seekers to Keep Britain White. Which like, yeah, it probably is.

[Iliena]

To be fair we can't support too many more people, the vast majority of the infrastructure is still from the 1970's when the population was around 55 million. It's now nearly 68 million, normal people are really feeling the pressure with housing costs and availability (land is silly expensive) and it has got a lot worse since Covid.

I think it's more of a message: Don't come to the UK or we will send you to our version of Guantanamo for processing!

This is no way to handle it! fucking deplorable!

[Huehuecoyotl]

To be fair we can't support too many more people, the vast majority of the infrastructure is still from the 1970's when the population was around 55 million. It's now nearly 68 million, normal people are really feeling the pressure with housing costs and availability (land is silly expensive) and it has got a lot worse since Covid.

I think it's more of a message: Don't come to the UK or we will send you to our version of Guantanamo for processing!

This is no way to handle it! fucking deplorable!

If you want to have a conversation about population, then just talking about immigrants is pointless. You need to talk about births, and deaths. You need to talk about the demographics. You need to talk about what cutting off immigration would do to that demographic, and how you would manage it moving forwards. It might involve alterations to retirement dates, and things like that.

It would need to be an adult discussion, covering all aspects. It would need planning and good management. But that isn't what the Tories do; they are lazy, greedy and feckless. They don't plan or design, or put the work in. They just break things, and figure out ways they and their mates can make money out of what they've broken.

This plan is a dead cat, designed to distract from Boris breaking laws. It's probably illegal, and it will be facing challenge in the courts, I have no doubt. Their track record on trying illegal things and getting slapped down is pretty poor. So this may well go the same way. At which point they'll direct the anger of their racist base towards the "out of touch judges" that are stopping them from doing what they want.

All pretty transparent. All pretty sad. This is what the Tories have sunk to, reactionary, populist, racist policies that make the invocation of Godwin's Law inevitable. I'm pretty sick of what's happened to my country the last few years.

[dribbles]

Now that it looks like Boris is going to get 2 more fines! They have entered panic mode and up steps Priti Patel with a great idea...!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-61097114

You couldn't make this shit up!

I hope this get's blocked by parliament, what a waste of public funds and you can just smell the judicial enquiry down the road already!

Classic example of the brilliance in leadership shown by our Boris, cementing his position in No 10 and making the world a better place.

Look at the context behind this. Thousands of refugees reach the EU and fail to find their happy place so take the often perilous decision to swim the English Channel seeking sanctuary in the sunny uplands of Brexit Britain. If the EU had secure borders this would not happen, the British electorate decided to secure theirs and find a solution.

So this win win idea from Boris is great. It's a win for Rwanda, and a fantastic opportunity for the refugees, as they need young migrants, and a win for Britain who can't take everyone who wants to come in the vast numbers that are fleeing the EU.

Some friendly advise eurochums in that if you are headed for London for a weekend jolly, Europe's best city after all, make sure your paperwork is in order or you might find yourselves on a one way journey to somewhere else!

[Ivanstone]

So this win win idea from Boris is great. It's a win for Rwanda, and a fantastic opportunity for the refugees, as they need young migrants, and a win for Britain who can't take everyone who wants to come in the vast numbers that are fleeing the EU.

What does Boris have to say about Rwanda:
1 Conduct transparent, credible and independent investigations into allegations of extrajudicial killings, deaths in custody, enforced disappearances and torture, and bring perpetrators to justice.

2 Protect and enable journalists to work freely, without fear of retribution, and ensure that state authorities comply with the Access to Information law.

3 Screen, identify and provide support to trafficking victims, including those held in Government transit centres.

Sound's like a swell place. I wonder how much Russian oligarch money Boris used to bribe Kagame to agree with this scheme?

[Iliena]

All pretty transparent. All pretty sad. This is what the Tories have sunk to, reactionary, populist, racist policies that make the invocation of Godwin's Law inevitable. I'm pretty sick of what's happened to my country the last few years.

Agreed, my political views used to be pretty middle of the road, now I'm decidedly in the Labour camp, not because I have had any great shifts in personal beliefs but the political landscape has shifted to the right around me. I blame the populist right wing rags for a lot of this shortsightedness and wilfulness, they always need somebody to blame for the countries woes and its always the little guy's fault! like immigrants, unemployed, disabled, NHS and public sector problems are always the staffs fault.

While not addressing the bigger issues like tax avoidance and abusing vat deductibles (this has gone thru the roof since working from home has become more mainstream) you wanted a big new 4k TV during lockdown? Hook it up to your laptop and use it as a monitor, then claim half the vat back! ( this is intended for stuff like a mobile phone that is for both personal and work use) https://sumup.co.uk/invoices/dictionary/deductible-vat/

This gets little more than a shrug of the shoulders and mutterings from newspapers like: well its legal, what can we do? They will just leave and the tax paying people they employ will lose there jobs and nothing to do with the fact they themselves would end up paying more tax if the loopholes were closed. While average Daily Mail reader Jim Dumbfuck (you know who you are) is happy we have taken back our boarders! and is now paying 1p on the pound less tax, then complaining 10 minutes later how broken the country is when he cant see his GP this week or find a new NHS dentist. Bloody immigrants taking all the appointments!

[DarkAmbient]

This policy of sending asylum seekers to Rwanda is like something from Monty Python. You can imagine that they might have been brainstorming how to dissuade people from coming here and someone joked "just send them to some shithole in Africa lol" and Pritti Low IQ was like "holy shit that's genius"... and then actually did it.

I just hope these people don't win again in 2024. I'm so fed up with their bullshit. Imagine actually voting for them after everything they've done.

[dribbles]

This policy of sending asylum seekers to Rwanda is like something from Monty Python. You can imagine that they might have been brainstorming how to dissuade people from coming here and someone joked "just send them to some shithole in Africa lol" and Pritti Low IQ was like "holy shit that's genius"... and then actually did it.

I just hope these people don't win again in 2024. I'm so fed up with their bullshit. Imagine actually voting for them after everything they've done.

The reason British people will vote for Boris again and again is that they support him. His Rwanda plan for example...

Voters back plan to send asylum seekers to Rwanda by two to one, poll reveals.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...g-critics.html

Why were the fringe yet vocal minority moaning about it again on here?

Every time our Boris makes a policy decision, the rest of the world follows a few weeks or months later. Whether it's a position on Ukraine, Covid, the EU, or illegal immigrants our UK leader of the free world decides how best to respond with the innovative solutions first. It is a piece of cake for him.

He is going nowhere, the UK is lucky to have him and the fantastic Conservative team that surround him, is truly a great leader the whole world needs right now. Imagine the current circumstances if Corbyn had prevailed? I fear those that wish Boris failure in 2024 are going to be sadly disappointed...

[Huehuecoyotl]

The reason British people will vote for Boris again and again is that they support him. His Rwanda plan for example...

Voters back plan to send asylum seekers to Rwanda by two to one, poll reveals.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...g-critics.html

Why were the fringe yet vocal minority moaning about it again on here?

Every time our Boris makes a policy decision, the rest of the world follows a few weeks or months later. Whether it's a position on Ukraine, Covid, the EU, or illegal immigrants our UK leader of the free world decides how best to respond with the innovative solutions first. It is a piece of cake for him.

He is going nowhere, the UK is lucky to have him and the fantastic Conservative team that surround him, is truly a great leader the whole world needs right now. Imagine the current circumstances if Corbyn had prevailed? I fear those that wish Boris failure in 2024 are going to be sadly disappointed...

Dribbles, dribbles, dribbles. You've told us enough times; if you aren't "for" something, you're "against" something. That poll shows that 47% support this, which means that 53% are against it. That's a mandate that outdoes even Brexit! So clearly we can't do it, with such strong numbers against it.

Once again, your "logic" and hypocrisy comes back to bite you on the arse.

Mind you, you've also told us repeatedly that you don't believe in polls. Or facts. Or the version of reality that you live in. I'm not sure what point I'm trying to make here, but I'm pretty sure your opinion isn't going to hold much weight with anyone in full possession of their faculties.

All this is moot, anyway. This will get kicked out by the courts as illegal, which Boris knows full well. But we've already seen that Tories (and especially Tory Brexiteers) don't care about laws, treaties, rules or convention. They'll piss all over them all to feed a bit of red meat to the racists propping them up. Tory grandees of the past must be spinning in their graves to see what their party has come to. A bunch of brainless idiots feeding the ego of a narcissistic man-child, while they wreck the country around them.

I can't wait to see what the county says to them in May. A pretty loud "fuck off" is my prediction.

[Pann]

The reason British people will vote for Boris again and again is that they support him. His Rwanda plan for example...

Voters back plan to send asylum seekers to Rwanda by two to one, poll reveals.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...g-critics.html

Why were the fringe yet vocal minority moaning about it again on here?

Every time our Boris makes a policy decision, the rest of the world follows a few weeks or months later. Whether it's a position on Ukraine, Covid, the EU, or illegal immigrants our UK leader of the free world decides how best to respond with the innovative solutions first. It is a piece of cake for him.

He is going nowhere, the UK is lucky to have him and the fantastic Conservative team that surround him, is truly a great leader the whole world needs right now. Imagine the current circumstances if Corbyn had prevailed? I fear those that wish Boris failure in 2024 are going to be sadly disappointed...

That's interesting phrasing in the polled question but it does serve to highlight the disconnect between what Twitter thinks and what Country actually thinks. I do wonder how much the results would have differed had the question been accurate reflection of the proposed policy, I suspect that people just want something done - whatever it is - and would therefore guess it would not change by much. To be honest I would not be at all surprised if senior Tories are hoping that our friendly Kimono wearing, baseball wielding QC clubs it down, in the courts, like a fox on a Boxing day morning, which would allow them to point out that they had tried to deal with the issue whilst not actually doing anything and shift the blame to courts.

I agree that Johnson is going nowhere, at least for the foreseeable, mainly due to there not being a suitable replacement (especially now Rishi has blown his chances). I also don't think a massive defeat in the locals will make much material difference to the current Tory leadership and a strong Labour showing might well be the kick up the arse the Tories need and end up being the worst outcome for Starmer. But time will tell.

[Kronik85]

That's interesting phrasing in the polled question but it does serve to highlight the disconnect between what Twitter thinks and what Country actually thinks. I do wonder how much the results would have differed had the question been accurate reflection of the proposed policy, I suspect that people just want something done - whatever it is - and would therefore guess it would not change by much. To be honest I would not be at all surprised if senior Tories are hoping that our friendly Kimono wearing, baseball wielding QC clubs it down, in the courts, like a fox on a Boxing day morning, which would allow them to point out that they had tried to deal with the issue whilst not actually doing anything and shift the blame to courts.

I agree that Johnson is going nowhere, at least for the foreseeable, mainly due to there not being a suitable replacement (especially now Rishi has blown his chances). I also don't think a massive defeat in the locals will make much material difference to the current Tory leadership and a strong Labour showing might well be the kick up the arse the Tories need and end up being the worst outcome for Starmer. But time will tell.

I'm intrigued by what you would want from the Conservative party moving forward? I can't wrap my head around why Centre Right Conservatives wouldn't vote for Centre Right Kier Starmer in the light of just how utterly devoid of....well everything. The modern Conservative party is made of human simulacra like Patel and Raab, the Brexit fantasist mob like Barclay and the plain stupid like Nadine.

What exactly can they offer policy wise that a very sensible Centre Right Kier Starmer wont be giving you?

Illuminate me.

[Huehuecoyotl]

I'm intrigued by what you would want from the Conservative party moving forward? I can't wrap my head around why Centre Right Conservatives wouldn't vote for Centre Right Kier Starmer in the light of just how utterly devoid of....well everything. The modern Conservative party is made of human simulacra like Patel and Raab, the Brexit fantasist mob like Barclay and the plain stupid like Nadine.

What exactly can they offer policy wise that a very sensible Centre Right Kier Starmer wont be giving you?

Illuminate me.

He's basically just said that if Labour do well in the May elections, it will be bad for them. I'm guessing he would say exactly the same thing if Labour didn't do well in the May elections. It's pretty clear where he's standing.

But most likely he will respond with nit-picking of your post, and a suggestion that you're seeing things that simply aren't there. "Conversations" with Pann tend to follow a well worn route.

[Pann]

I'm intrigued by what you would want from the Conservative party moving forward? I can't wrap my head around why Centre Right Conservatives wouldn't vote for Centre Right Kier Starmer in the light of just how utterly devoid of....well everything. The modern Conservative party is made of human simulacra like Patel and Raab, the Brexit fantasist mob like Barclay and the plain stupid like Nadine.

What exactly can they offer policy wise that a very sensible Centre Right Kier Starmer wont be giving you?

Illuminate me.

I'm not sure I understand what you're getting at. I haven't stated an opinion on what I want I have simply stated what I think might happen (obviously I could be completely wrong) but I do realise that some, especially on these forums, struggle with the concept that what someone thinks might happen is not the same as what they want to happen.

For the record I have not decided who I will vote for in the upcoming Locals, let alone the next GE, both parties' candidates (the Lib Dems are still furloughed from what I can gather) look lacklustre from where I'm sitting and I am struggling with complete apathy towards our political parties so I am leaning towards not bothering, if you're really interested.

[Huehuecoyotl]

I'm not sure I understand what you're getting at. I haven't stated an opinion on what I want I have simply stated what I think might happen (obviously I could be completely wrong) but I do realise that some, especially on these forums, struggle with the concept that what someone thinks might happen is not the same as what they want to happen.

For the record I have not decided who I will vote for in the upcoming Locals, let alone the next GE, both parties' candidates (the Lib Dems are still furloughed from what I can gather) look lacklustre from where I'm sitting and I am struggling with complete apathy towards our political parties so I am leaning towards not bothering, if you're really interested.

Anyone in the UK who is apathetic about voting in the face of what the Tories are currently doing has no right expressing any opinion on politics. Full stop.

Either you are on board with sending immigrants to a country still struggling with human rights abuses, despite it likely being illegal under UK law, or you aren't. Either you accept that our PM can ignore his own laws and refuse to resign, or you don't. Either you are happy to let water companies pump raw sewage into our rivers and seas or you aren't. Either you accept the laughable incompetence of the Tories effort to fix the damage of Brexit, or you don't. Either you are happy with the monumental waste of taxpayer money during the Covid pandemic, or you aren't. Cost of living. The investigation into Russian involvement in our politics not being published. The failure to tax those companies and people that have made fortunes during the last few years. And on, and on, and on.

And that's the tip of the shitberg with this bunch currently pretending to run the country. If you're sitting there saying you're apathetic at this point, what you really mean is you're happy with what they're doing, but you're slightly ashamed so you aren't going to admit it. But I'm sure you'll be trying to put me straight about what you really mean any minute now.

[dribbles]

That's interesting phrasing in the polled question but it does serve to highlight the disconnect between what Twitter thinks and what Country actually thinks. I do wonder how much the results would have differed had the question been accurate reflection of the proposed policy, I suspect that people just want something done - whatever it is - and would therefore guess it would not change by much. To be honest I would not be at all surprised if senior Tories are hoping that our friendly Kimono wearing, baseball wielding QC clubs it down, in the courts, like a fox on a Boxing day morning, which would allow them to point out that they had tried to deal with the issue whilst not actually doing anything and shift the blame to courts.

I agree that Johnson is going nowhere, at least for the foreseeable, mainly due to there not being a suitable replacement (especially now Rishi has blown his chances). I also don't think a massive defeat in the locals will make much material difference to the current Tory leadership and a strong Labour showing might well be the kick up the arse the Tories need and end up being the worst outcome for Starmer. But time will tell.

I won't be voting in the local elections, never have and am quite happy with how my bins are collected. I reserve that mighty pen for the GE.

I agree that it is possible the Rwanda thing might be stopped by the courts and others, who by and in what timescale, it won't be stopped by the Tories after all? Couple of years perhaps? Excellent timing for the next General Election. The Tories will say what they would do and have tried to do, the UK public (not most on this forum obvs) seem to give broad support and perhaps it will be a manifesto pledge. What will Labour do to counter? Have they even got any alternative? Seems an excellent vote winning Tory trap for Labour and the Lib Dem to me.

When the housing crisis gets worse, how do you argue for unfettered illegal immigration creating the equivalent of a new city every year and the housing demand that goes with that.

The makings of a next Tory policy general election victory is being born before our very eyes. And those that advocate against the shipping of refugees to Rwanda for processing are enabling it.

The Tories can't lose this argument.