They should just add one EXTRA 10man gametype (on different dungeons).

[epigramx]

I think it is objectively wrong to replace 20man with 10man (on current mythic mode instances) because the game has 12 (unique) classes so it REQUIRES a gametype with more than a dozen of players to reach its full potential and it must be the same size per instance to keep the competition on equal ground.

However: because of the SAME reason: 5man is too limited because the metas are extreme (noticed how all world records have a frost mage lately?) so: a new 10man (on their unique dungeons) might be good.

PS practical consideration about it: because life is short: they should reduce 5mans a little in order to do that; for example: instead of 10 dungeons have 8 and have the other 2 be 10man.

[Relapses]

The game has too many difficulty levels already. A fifth raid difficulty won't help.

[thunderdragon2]

The game has too many difficulty levels already. A fifth raid difficulty won't help.

wince we share the thought of too man difficulties atm which would you get rind off id remove either hc or normal and just fal the remaining 1 flex, also i agree we just dont need anymore difficulties

[Relapses]

wince we share the thought of too man difficulties atm which would you get rind off id remove either hc or normal and just fal the remaining 1 flex, also i agree we just dont need anymore difficulties

Normal seems redundant to me, imo. Remove normal, make raid encounters become progressively more difficult the further into the raid you go (more than what we have currently).

[thunderdragon2]

Normal seems redundant to me, imo. Remove normal, make raid encounters become progressively more difficult the further into the raid you go (more than what we have currently).

not gona happen as it seems blizzard don't know what a difficulty curve is the current mythic raid is proof of that, id just combine normal and hc into 1 raid

[Temp name]

PS practical consideration about it: because life is short: they should reduce 5mans a little in order to do that; for example: instead of 10 dungeons have 8 and have the other 2 be 10man.

You want a raid, why should they take away dungeons for raids?
Why not instead of 3 tiers of 20 man, you get 2 tiers of 20 man and a tier of 10 man?

Or, you know.. Not take away other content and just add it on top

[epigramx]

You want a raid, why should they take away dungeons for raids?
Why not instead of 3 tiers of 20 man, you get 2 tiers of 20 man and a tier of 10 man?

Or, you know.. Not take away other content and just add it on top

First of all you can't have no 20man at all for a tier and have 10man instead (if that's what you meant) because some may only play one of them (let alone 10man is the lesser of the two balance-wise since the game has 12 classes).

I suggested a reduction of 5mans because most or many PvErs do all of that content and 5mans has limitations because it's a game of 12 clases (so it produces extreme metas (like the frost mage being in all world records)).

I don't have strong feelings on that part in general; but I'm pretty sure a lot would say "I don't have time for this"; 5mans dungeons are literally a lot while they are the most problematic balance-wise.

[Dom]

It's never going to happen until Cata/MoP classic embarrasses retail. Ion and Morgan think class representation and class specific boss mechanics are more important than actually being able to attempt the raid.

Maybe if we give them another decade they'll be able to make a better raid than Throne of Thunder or stop class stacking.

[deenman]

It's never going to happen until Cata/MoP classic embarrasses retail. Ion and Morgan think class representation and class specific boss mechanics are more important than actually being able to attempt the raid.

Maybe if we give them another decade they'll be able to make a better raid than Throne of Thunder or stop class stacking.

you cant stop class stacking,unless they somehow force it not to work for some reason

as long as a class is better in a specific situation,or evern 1% stronger than others,you will always have class stacking

ofc this is only really a problem for top progression,and the tryhard larpers

your averege player including mid tier mythic guilds will never need to class stack,unless its some crazy situation like nefarian in cata,but that was nerfed anyways

[Mysterymask]

What is y'all's obsession with "there's a few hoops to jump through in this you know what we need MORE HOOPS"

[epigramx]

"MORE HOOPS"

What hoop? People genuinely want to do 10man hard mode. At the same time: you can't bundle it in the 20man hard mode dungeons because people will be flamewaring all day about what was the 'hardest' (as it happened in the 10man+25man era); on top of that you fix the problem of having a big amount of 5mans for little reason; 5mans are fine to an extend by they are objectively the worst of the 3 gametypes because the game has 12 classes and 5man only gets 3 specs which creates extreme metas (e.g. all world records lately had a frost mage).

[Arai]

Totally agree. 20 man mythic was one of the worst decisions Ion came up with for WoD. It killed of many guilds and players that no longer could participate in this type of content. As a Mythic full clear raider from HFC - Uldir, i can tell you that 20 man is one of the worst comps you can get. Your guild is always struggling to get players ready as you need so many and you will always have many people that are annoying or just bad and get carried since you need 20 man.
10 man gives a much better environment where you can actually do the hardest content with friends and people you like, while also feeling impactful in a raid since you don't in 20 man.

The dumb reason from Ion for specific class centered boss designs have been nothing but a let down and disappointment. Often enough you either don't have the class in your roster up to gear or the player is on the low end skillfloor costing you a lot of time and nerves. Always nice to carry someone through a raid that doesn't belong there just because we need their class for a specific boss. Terrible design.
But as we know Blizzard and especially Ion are completely blind to those things and continue with "no plans to change 20 man". The incompetence of the higher ups is often mind boggling. Hey Ion how about we go back to 40 man so we get that epic feeling back huh? Yea thats what i thought.
I would immediately return to WoW and Mythic raiding if there was a 10 man option. But ofc Mr. Ion is to stubborn and proud to change anything. That change was probably one of the worst decisions in the history of WoW and killed of a LOT of guilds and players and therefore profit. Me included as Ive quit since January 2021 as the game besides Mythic raiding has very little to offer.