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  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by Grimoires View Post
    We are customers. We pay money for products. We want good products.

    That said, as humans we also value humans and we'd like to hope that the company creating the products we pay for are upstanding companies and treating their employees well. However, many of us have first hand experience working for companies that claim "inclusivity" and "diversity" but end up silencing one group to appease another.

    If some of us are "the most awful people" then what are the upstanding folks like yourself actually doing to make things better?
    Unfortunately, I think the concept of "diversity hires" is one of those things that's best described by the saying, "The road to Hell is paved with good intentions." It's similar to Affirmative Action in a way, where the end result is just fighting racism using racism. Ultimately, the question that should be asked is why are you doing such an action and is the action itself part of the problem. I've seen the arguments that it's for having more diverse experiences and opinions/perspectives, but that's assuming that just because my skin is a certain color or I have certain genitalia between my legs, I'm a monolith with anyone who has those same physical properties... also, when you delve into the minutia and supposed explanations, it's basically just 'socially accepted racism/sexism/etc.' at the end of the day. If you're hiring based upon someone's race, religion, gender, etc., that's probably a problem (unless the job specifically needs one of those things).

    Despite some of the posts I've seen, the main thing that will gain the trust of the customers back has nothing to do with the social stuff... it's the products. I'm sure there's a bunch of people in this thread who have iPhones, Nikes, etc., and it's no secret the social stances and conditions in which these products are made, yet people are happy to be loyal customers. While some people will make a stand based on social issues, realize that you are in the vast minority. At the end of the day, most customers do not care what the employees are doing to each other or what the employees are subjected to in terms of working conditions. Customers want the products they paid for, and the only time they may care about the social stuff is if they see a direct link to said stuff and them not getting the product they want, when they want, for the price they want.

    This isn't to dissuade people to make decisions based upon their morality, quite the opposite actually. If you don't want to be a customer to a company that you think does something immoral, that's absolutely fine. That being said, it's getting sliiiightly hard to do so when companies keep merging and businesses become larger conglomerates or essentially monopolies. Making a moral stand is much easier when there's a viable alternative, and it's much harder when there's no alternate. Such is the way of humanity, and all of us are guilty of looking the other way on some level just to get the result we want.

    I could put this in a more philosophical perspective as to demonstrate why there's a rift in people about this topic, and it's about what people fundamentally believe. If you believe that humans are fundamentally good, you will likely believe that things such as forced diversity hiring is a good thing (as it's ultimately about external factors being evil, not the humans). If you believe that humans are fundamentally flawed/broken, you'll likely believe that things such as forced diversity hiring are just the same evil as it's trying to replace, leading to the same outcome that you're trying to fix (as it's ultimately about humans being humans, and the external factors are just exposing what was already there).
    “Society is endangered not by the great profligacy of a few, but by the laxity of morals amongst all.”
    “It's not an endlessly expanding list of rights — the 'right' to education, the 'right' to health care, the 'right' to food and housing. That's not freedom, that's dependency. Those aren't rights, those are the rations of slavery — hay and a barn for human cattle.”
    ― Alexis de Tocqueville

  2. #82
    The Patient Chilela's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alipeve View Post
    I'm seeing so many comments that say "We don't care about any of this, just make the games better." You're all so far off the mark.

    Making games is work, and having a functioning, welcoming, workplace at blizzard will result in better games. The passion and reverence that used to make blizzard games so great has been gone as a result of these corporate nightmares.

    Mend Blizzard's culture, and the good games will result from hard working employees that love what they do.

    I hope Microsoft's meddling is limited besides getting leadership on the right track (Removing Kotich for starters). It might be a long shot, but I hope Blizzard can become the game studio it was pretending to be for all these years.
    Unfortunately, fixing Blizz's culture doesn't change the fact that a number of the controversial changes made over the past few months in particular were actively pushed by the devs themselves, wholly independent of player concerns. Barring a massive sweep of the dev team, I don't see this changing, doubly-so given that Blizz, on every level from corporate to developer, has been eager to push the very principles that causes said changes to begin with. There's inevitably some people who are 100% on board with this sort of mindset, but I can't call myself one.

    EDIT: 10/10 post right above mine.

  3. #83
    The Lightbringer Dr Assbandit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkguyver2020 View Post
    Fuck all this diversity crap. Just make good games again instead of shoving this woke virtue signalling leftie drivel down our throats!
    Glad it's triggering you lot so much.

    At this point I hope they continue this trend of social wokeness because we all know that "go woke get broke" hasn't been true in any capacity so righties can simply just cry about all this social equality in abject rage .
    "It's time to kick ass and chew bubblegum... and I'm all outta ass."

    I'm a British gay Muslim Pakistani American citizen, ask me how that works! (terribly)

  4. #84

  5. #85
    "We’re measuring our executive and management teams directly against culture improvement. This means their (and my own) success and compensation will directly depend on our overall success in creating a safe, inclusive, and creative work environment at Blizzard."

    Ah cool, cause you are sure as heck not measuring them for the quality of the game.

    So glad I'm out as of 10.0

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by UnifiedDivide View Post
    You say "we" an awful lot. I think it's cute you think you can speak for anyone but yourself.

    I'll give you a novel idea, as a customer. If a company isn't making a product that you think is good/worth your money, stop giving your money to them and go elsewhere.
    Immature viewpoint. You're allowed to have a viewpoint and express it. It's like saying instead of disagreeing with him you should have just not responded and moved on. It's equally stupid, if you're incapable processing negative comments that is a flaw you have, not them.

  7. #87
    I refuse to play games from companies whose main goals are: "Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion".

    US Woke culture should not be encouraged. It is destroying rational thought, wisdom, fairness and justice in everything it touches... and apparently creativity, customer satisfaction and soul too if Blizzard's games are any indication recently.
    Last edited by Muhammad; 2022-01-21 at 04:17 AM.

  8. #88
    The Patient Meow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muhammad View Post
    I refuse to play games from companies whose main goals are: "Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion".

    US Woke culture should not be encouraged. It is destroying rational thought, wisdom, fairness and justice in everything it touches... and apparently creativity, customer satisfaction and soul too if Blizzard's games are any indication recently.
    When a company or a government keeps claiming something, they are actually something it never fulfilled.

  9. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by exsanguinate View Post
    Liar, liar, liar. He somehow proved unworthy for his position.
    Huh? Are you just a negative person who makes up stuff with every post?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiev View Post
    You don't just have to deliver on a more regular basis, you have to deliver `better` content. Shadowlands had so much promise and failed so hard to deliver on that promise.
    They need to fix the in house issues first before they can even do that. 90% of the reason quality has suffered is because you have employees who do not feel safe or are not happy with how the company is doing things.

    Fix that issue first and I can garuantee quality will improve.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Julmara View Post
    as long as abusers and enablers like bobby kotick arent removed there is no real progress
    also didnt the new co leader leave cause she was underpaid in comparison to mike even so they where literary covering the same spot ?
    Yes she did but mike was literally one of the people since day 1 on the boards asses to pay her the same wage as him.

    Also if we go with the reports they were in the process of writing up a new contract to increase her pay. A prospect that can take months sometimes due to legal reasons. You cant just write a new contract when their is a fully legal one already. Do not know if it is true or not, not going to get intk that debate.

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by Lumy View Post
    Originally Posted by Blizzard (Blue Tracker / Official Forums)

    • a Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DE&I) leader solely focused on our progress across multiple efforts in this area
    - Mike "Qwik" Ybarra
    It's almost like he WANTS a class action lawsuit for discriminatory hiring practices. All based on Neo-Marxist BS. Being racist "but, like, in a positive way, brah!" is why California is a vile Commie cesspit.

  11. #91
    Quote Originally Posted by Daedius View Post
    Useless mouthpiece "leader" roles to be paid a lot to be so... Good luck attracting me back with that nonsense.
    You are not the intelligent are you?

  12. #92
    Just make the game better ffs or all other efforts will be in vain. Might need to put a bit more emphasis on the people who supply your paychecks, the players! As for internal strife, treat your internal peers with respect, it shouldn’t be that difficult. And finally, don’t go overboard trying to look overly inclusive and diverse, ie, this fruit bowl BS. Anyone who finds paintings in a 16 year old game offensive shouldn’t play or work on a game where you kill animals, blow shit up and slaughter your enemies. How long before that becomes offensive?

  13. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Vowrawn View Post
    It's almost like he WANTS a class action lawsuit for discriminatory hiring practices. All based on Neo-Marxist BS.
    What the actual fuck are you talking about. Are you one of "those" people.

    I will make this extremely clear to you. So even someone with such a small brain can understand. The statement was saying they will be hiring based on if you are best for the job not for what your race, sex, religion or gender identification is. I also have news for you so you can understand this. Currently the gaming msrket is dominated by white males. Not because they have the skills or the knowledge, only cause they are white and a male. This is just a fact. And for you to even come on here a spew that crap is hypocritical bs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beet View Post
    I don’t give a flying fuck about them trying to be more diverse with their workforce. Just give us better games. Be like old blizzard. Because todays Blizzard hasn’t given us a solid hit in fucking years. Hearthstone being the only game that is still strong. Most fans contrary to popular belief don’t give a shit about the inner workings of the company and don’t even know about them. We do know however when a game sucks ass.

    And before anyone jumps down my throat for being uncaring, ask yourself if you buy from WalMart, Target, or Amazon. Congrats you’re supporting companies far worse than Blizzard ever was.

    - - - Updated - - -



    I won’t. I’ll cheer for it. I want the people who have been making the games the last seven or so years gone. Just get new blood in at this point. They can’t do any worse than this generation of shitters.
    You mean old blizz that had the actual sexual preditors and are the main reason this happened.

    You are smart.

  14. #94
    I’m all for diversity, equity and inclusion. I think it’s a great thing to strive for.

    But once again, all this is, is more promises. And I think ALL of us know how much a Blizzard promise is worth these days. THAT is the real problem inherent in the company… not just shitty treatment of its employees, but a total lack of respect for its players.

    Remember, WoW retail fans: ONE CONTENT UPDATE IN FOURTEEN MONTHS. ALMOST FIFTEEN.

    One.

    In a game we must subscribe to, to play.

    You want us to trust Blizzard again, Mike? Don’t just fix your HR issues, which yes, you certainly do need to do that. But also, fix the broken product supply chain within your company. That’s the main reason players are jumping ship.
    Last edited by damonskye; 2022-01-21 at 05:07 AM.

  15. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by vincink View Post
    I wish you were right. Unfortunately, that is not how it works. Quite to the contrary. Workplace diversity looks like this:

    - If you recommend a person for hire, you get $2500 kickback. If that person is a "diversity" hire, you get a $8500 kickback. The kickback scales with the position.
    - If you have a corporate board and you're headquartered in California, you must have a certain percentage of diversity representation on your board. Or you face fines. Other cities and states are following suit.
    - Complete diversity training, or face a pay cut. Or termination.
    - Use inclusive language. Or face a pay cut or termination if you don't.
    - Use prefered pronouns. Or face a pay cut or termination if you don't.

    How do I know this? Because I work at a large, global tech company where these very policies are in effect. I would happily take a job at place that holds the policies you describe as workplace diversity. In a heartbeat.
    That is not how it works at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by damonskye View Post
    I’m all for diversity, equity and inclusion. I think it’s a great thing to strive for.

    But once again, all this is, is more promises. And I think ALL of us know how much a Blizzard promise is worth these days. THAT is the real problem inherent in the company… not just shitty treatment of its employees, but a total lack of respect for its players.

    Remember, WoW retail fans: ONE CONTENT UPDATE IN FOURTEEN MONTHS. ALMOST FIFTEEN.

    One.

    You want us to trust Blizzard again, Mike? Don’t just fix your HR issues, which yes, you certainly do. But also, fix the broken product supply chain within your company.
    Ok and? I dont care about the content delays and neither do any of my guildies or the 5 other guilds I play with or the people I talk to daily.

    The people who care about it are the fakes who just want instant gratification.

    Honestly I wish patches would last a full year and they'd put up 3 or 4 patches so one expact would last 3 or 4 years. This would give more times to develope the story and future content.

    People want stuff right away and than wonder why the quality has dropped.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Goat7 View Post
    All I read was

    BLAH BLAH BLAH microsoft please dont fire my ass when the deal closes nobody is gonna hire my army crawlin, puss grabbin, shitty game making butt.
    I like how you are so blind with stupidity that you are blaming someone who literally has nothing to do with what is currently happening at blizzard. Smart you are not.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Garretdejiko View Post
    They are all gone


    <Mod Edit: Please do not post images that contain character/server names by which other players may be identified. Thanks>


    A patch per year.

    And is only the first sentence lmao. People love corpotalk
    I play monk and I would have just laughed at him.

    Than id either do one of the following

    1. Out heal them
    2. Out dps them
    3. Kill them in pvp
    4. Tell them that they should seek councelling and than block them.

    I should whisper this person and mess with them.. for fun, harmlessly of course nothing mean.

    Perhaps drop them an in game mail on my fresh monk.

    Simply saying

    "Enjoying playing my monk. It is a fun class. To bad you can not enjoy all this fun"

    Than send them an ingame mail everytime I dig with just the words

    Monk dinged 5
    Monk dinged 6
    Monk dinged 7

    And so on. Lmao.
    Last edited by Venara; 2022-01-21 at 02:51 PM.

  16. #96
    Quote Originally Posted by Utrrabbit View Post
    What the actual fuck are you talking about. Are you one of "those" people.

    I will make this extremely clear to you. So even someone with such a small brain can understand. The statement was saying they will be hiring based on if you are best for the job not for what your race, sex, religion or gender identification is. I also have news for you so you can understand this.
    Bullshit. The fact that "you people" have to crawl out of the woodwork in order to run defense for what, many rightly suspect, to be Commie BS, is telling. "Diversity, Inclusion, and Equity" is Commie speak for "racial and sexual quotas", as well as enforcing SJW ideology on the company. They do the same thing at College campuses as they do at corporations.

    If it was REALLY based on just hiring people, regardless of race or sex, it wouldn't require an ideological term to be blurted out, nor would it require the constant trumpeting of racial/sexual "statistics" in order for Commies to justify being bigots. You can be racist against white people, you can be sexist against men. Making a codified thing in hiring is not getting rid of bigotry, but making it worse.
    Currently the gaming msrket is dominated by white males. Not because they have the skills or the knowledge, only cause they are white and a male. This is just a fact. And for you to even come on here a spew that crap is hypocritical bs.
    "Dominated by white males", another Commie lie. You do know that demographics are not by choice, right? You will never have your perfect Commie utopia, you will never get 50% of every single category imaginable, and forcibly hiring/firing people based on your Leftist bigotry is not "progress", you are just creating white racists by giving them a reason to be spiteful towards those who are given jobs when they have equal qualifications, but tick the "diversity" boxes while the evil "white male" doesn't.

  17. #97
    The Lightbringer Dr Assbandit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Vowrawn View Post
    -Nonstop walls of pure rubbish-
    That poor poor white persecution complex.

    You're way too obsessed with nonexistent "commies" mate. May I suggest you go out and touch some grass?

    Or you know keep on spouting the same rubbish you already are, it's quite enjoyable.

    I'm happy they are being mindful about hiring practices and am glad its a trend catching on in general no matter how much you lot cry about it.
    "It's time to kick ass and chew bubblegum... and I'm all outta ass."

    I'm a British gay Muslim Pakistani American citizen, ask me how that works! (terribly)

  18. #98
    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Vowrawn View Post
    Bullshit. The fact that "you people" have to crawl out of the woodwork in order to run defense for what, many rightly suspect, to be Commie BS, is telling. "Diversity, Inclusion, and Equity" is Commie speak for "racial and sexual quotas", as well as enforcing SJW ideology on the company. They do the same thing at College campuses as they do at corporations.

    If it was REALLY based on just hiring people, regardless of race or sex, it wouldn't require an ideological term to be blurted out, nor would it require the constant trumpeting of racial/sexual "statistics" in order for Commies to justify being bigots. You can be racist against white people, you can be sexist against men. Making a codified thing in hiring is not getting rid of bigotry, but making it worse.

    "Dominated by white males", another Commie lie. You do know that demographics are not by choice, right? You will never have your perfect Commie utopia, you will never get 50% of every single category imaginable, and forcibly hiring/firing people based on your Leftist bigotry is not "progress", you are just creating white racists by giving them a reason to be spiteful towards those who are given jobs when they have equal qualifications, but tick the "diversity" boxes while the evil "white male" doesn't.
    I mean, you just...I'd say doubled down, but more like quadrupled down on it.

    The fact that you think it's about 50% or some even split even shows that you're not actually looking into it. And I'm genuinely not sure where you're getting this whole red scare agenda from either.

  19. #99
    Quote Originally Posted by Utrrabbit View Post
    Ok and? I dont care about the content delays and neither do any of my guildies or the 5 other guilds I play with or the people I talk to daily.

    The people who care about it are the fakes who just want instant gratification.
    LOL… whatcha smoking over there, buddy?

    If you don’t realize that the VAST majority of the player base of WoW is sick of Korthia dailies and Maw invasions, and desperately wants 9.2 to come out… well, you must be smoking something really good, then. Because you’re wrong. You don’t even have to leave MMOC to realize it. Just literally read this forum for five minutes. I mean… half of them are so sick of Shadowlands completely that they’re even already over 9.2 and can’t wait for 10.0 just to see if they’re right that it’s Dragon Isles or whatever.

    I mean, talk about reading the room wrong.
    Last edited by damonskye; 2022-01-21 at 05:31 AM.

  20. #100
    Quote Originally Posted by Jester Joe View Post
    I mean, you just...I'd say doubled down, but more like quadrupled down on it.

    The fact that you think it's about 50% or some even split even shows that you're not actually looking into it. And I'm genuinely not sure where you're getting this whole red scare agenda from either.
    Then what is it about? If it isn't about hiring people solely because of their race and sex, then why does it need to be pushed? Because, all you get out of it is people being put into positions solely for "muh Diversity", where they are incapable of being promoted or going anywhere, and eventually they just quit because they were never hired for their skills, just for a "feel good" percentage increase. It happens a lot in Hollywood, mind you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr Assbandit View Post
    That poor poor white persecution complex.

    You're way too obsessed with nonexistent "commies" mate. May I suggest you go out and touch some grass?

    Or you know keep on spouting the same rubbish you already are, it's quite enjoyable.

    I'm happy they are being mindful about hiring practices and am glad its a trend catching on in general no matter how much you lot cry about it.
    So, you're just a racist, then? That's good to know, bigot.

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