Page 27 of 37 FirstFirst ...
17
25
26
27
28
29
... LastLast
  1. #521
    Quote Originally Posted by Mace View Post
    ....
    I want to clarify that all this although it sounds like a lot of things. It can actually be solved by making a Kaldorei zone. But that the content is positive instead of an insult.

    Ose would basically be a story of 4 towns that have to work together to become stronger. As we have already done with so many towns irrelevant to the lore.

    (Note something similar should also be done with Forsakens)

    Then use what you earn there from random troops in other expansions (That more or less works out well for blizzard)

  2. #522
    The problem here is fundamental:

    The Alliance fulfills one fantasy: The stalwart good boys.
    The Horde fulfills two fantasies: The bad boys and the tribal boys.
    "stop puting you idiotic liberal words into my mouth"
    -ynnady

  3. #523
    Gnomeregan and Gilneas should have been restored and reclaimed a long time ago, the fact that Blizzard keep things stagnating is really outdaded and frustrating. Show more of gnomish and worgen cultures, and give and develop more characters for these races.

    Also show the Azuremyst Isles truly become a home for the Draenei, see them building a true city and more settlements here with Draenei architecture, such as the ones we saw on AU Draenor, also show more of the interactions and issues between the pure Draenei, the Broken, Lightforged and purified Manari Eredars. Also develop the Draenei culture and tech and magic more.

    A bit more of exotism would have been welcome a long time ago in the Alliance, the allied races were a missed opportunity for this. I have always thought that the Arakkoas, whenever they are the ones from Outland or from AU Draenor, or Botanis, or one of the Sethrak tribes should have joined the Alliance.

    For the big strong allied race, I think that the Vrykuls of Stormheim, at least one clan, could have filled the role of the Kul Tiras humans allied race, gameplay wise, because in lore there was nothing to say or foreshadow Kul Tirans as bigger and stronger than other humans during Warcraft II, Warcraft III, WOW and the books until BFA.

    And as others and myself have saide before: stop making the Night Elves a punching-ball and allow some moral ambiguity and grayness in the story without having the Alliance doing things outright villainous à la Garrosh, some Bloodraven character for example, to be the leader of Stormwind warlocks could have been a great addition to the story.
    Last edited by Terrorthatflapsinthenight; 2022-08-02 at 09:16 PM.

  4. #524
    The Alliance already became more interesting when Turalyon became King of Stormwind in all but name, with Alleria Windrunner at his side.

    Whereas Anduin was an untested brat, Turalyon is a proven and capable administrator, who already oversaw the reconstruction of Stormwind as the Regent of a young Varian Wrynn.

    Of course, we cannot forget about Alleria Windrunner, who proved her leadership skills when she spearheaded an elven expedition into Draenor and then rescued and took over the leadership of the Ren'dorei group. I am sure she has done her part in securing Stormwind.

    With Turalyon as Regent (de-facto King) and Alleria as his chief advisor, Stormwind has entered into an age of peace and stability that has continued for several years after Shadowlands (timeskip of peace between Shadowlands and Dragonflight). We should consider this a major victory, for Stormwind in-universe (as the nation is currently in a period of unprecedented peace), and for us players who have been longing for more spotlight outside of the Wrynns. I expect to see a lot more Turalyon and Alleria in the future.

  5. #525
    Quote Originally Posted by Mace View Post
    Highborne leaders, the Shen'dralar were the wonder makers and architects of the kaldorei empire
    Right - time for the canon lore.

    Shen'dralar were NOT wonder makers and architects of the Empire. This is why they were revered, quote both in-game and in the lore:
    The Shen'dralar were Queen Azshara's most revered arcanists,charged with the storage and safekeeping of her most precious tomes

    So they were the queen's best librarians, for lack of a better word.

    Don't take "revered" out of context, because I could easily argue that the grand city of Vashj'ir, the revered City of Azshara were the makers and architects of the Empire.
    Last edited by Tanaria; 2022-08-03 at 11:52 AM.

  6. #526
    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    Right - time for the canon lore.

    Shen'dralar were NOT wonder makers and architects of the Empire. This is why they were revered, quote both in-game and in the lore:
    The Shen'dralar were Queen Azshara's most revered arcanists,charged with the storage and safekeeping of her most precious tomes

    So they were the queen's best librarians, for lack of a better word.

    Don't take "revered" out of context, because I could easily argue that the grand city of Vashj'ir, the revered City of Azshara were the makers and architects of the Empire.
    That was not all, and you know it, the first most common one for the Shen'dralar

    "The Shen'dralar were Queen Azshara's most revered arcanists, overseeing her top projects, often in secrets. You don't make a city of your most revered arcanists only to keep tomes. The Queen's top projects, her wonder works, the things that amazed the empire, which she relied on to keep the people adoring her and relying on her more than anyone else, she let others do the discovery and engineering works while she focused on the more important matter of gaining more power - tapping into the power of the well and off course fel, when she discovered it and the legion.

    That the Shen'dralar were tome keepers, makes them even more knowledgeable and powerful, because it means not only did they make the top projects of the empire, they also had the greatest accumulation of its knowledge too. We know Mordant Evenshade talks about the wonders of this age paling in comparison to the night elf one - which makes sense given that he is Shen'dralar and one of those tasked with making those wonders, but their penchant for knowledge keeps getting exaggerated too - the scrying on the world, the collection of all forms of knowledge, even trivia, obsession with arcane knowledge.

    This makes them highly highly sought after and capable, as scholars, academics, but also engineers, architects that use magic to make things.

    The Shen'dralar are what the Shen'dralar are - I didn't write the lore about them. Most revered arcanists, and you think all they did was keep tomes.. LMAO. I am aware you hate every night elven arcane exploit or dominance.. but everything about the Nightborne, the Moonguard, the Highborne, and the pre-sundering kaldorei civilization and it's magical excellence, Nar'thalas, Suramar, Zin'Azshari, Illidan, Azshara etc are all night elven.

    The high elves you love so much, come from night elves too, it was their magical expertise as night elves that allowed them to do the sunwell and Quel'Thalas even when transitioning to high elves. Give it up. You shouldn't be anti night elf - it shows you are more faction centric than elf centric. This is allowed, because it's how the developers have guided you. Despite the lore saying what it does, your world of Warcraft interaction has painted elves in light of either the horde or alliance. But if you played WC3 first, you would not have that perspective of them. You would see them through their own lens. It is much harder to hate blood elves if you're a night elf fan or hate night elves if you're a high/blood elf fan if you had that perspective. You'd be more annoyed at blizzard throwing them so deep into the horde/alliance conflict and how little it makes sense for horde allies to always matter every time, more than the future of their race.

    This is why I find your night elf problem a little ridiculous, you don't know where the elves you love come from. Or seem to be in denial, don't encourage silly things in game becuase that is the stance, the elven rivalry is so forced and doesn't fit their personality nor their history, THe blood elf/night lef conflict is unreasonable, and shouldn't be based on the past - given the lore of what happened. But we know this conflict was rcast and greatly forced in TBC when the blood elves went horde. Before TBC, I recall Tyrande and Kael'thass got on quite well, no where near the so called hatred the blood elves are later written to have, or the night elves.

    it's all engineered in the faction conflict spiciiing up, and it anti-thematic to the original foundation of the elves. I remember first seeing elves kill each other in TBC, and I'm like, thsi is the first time they've done that to each other. The original lore had expulsion for law violations not killing. And the only elves that had ever been killed bye lves was when Azshara turned evil in support of the legion and they alll fought her, every elven group around today that you can play either fought or is from ancestors who fought Azsahra. And now you are telling me they hate each other to the point of killing - just because one is horde and the other alliance. Please
    Last edited by Mace; 2022-08-03 at 12:16 PM.

  7. #527
    Quote Originally Posted by Mace View Post
    That was not alll, I don't know where you got that quote from, but the most common one was

    "The Shen'dralar were Queen Azshara's most revered arcanists, overseeing her top projects, often in secrets. You don't make a city of your most revered arcanists just to keep tomes, that's insanity and stupid. The Queen's top projects, her wonder works, the things that amazed the empire, which she relied on to keep the people adoring her and relying on her more than anyone else, she let others do the discovery and engineering works while she focused ont eh more important matte rof gaining more power - tapping into the power of the well and off course fel, when she discovered it and the legion.

    The Shen'dralar are what the Shen'dralar are - I didn't write the lore about them. Most revered arcanists, and you think all they did was keep tomes.. LMAO. I am aware you hate every night elven arcane exploit or dominance.. but everything about the Nightborne, the Moonguard, the Highborne, and the pre-sudnering kaldorei civilization and it's magical excellence, Nar'thalas, Suramar, Zin'Azshari, Illidan, Azshara etc are all night elven.

    The high elves you love so much, come from night elves too, it was their magical expertise as night elves that allowed them to do the sunwell and Quel'Thalas even when transitioning to high elves. Give it up. You shouldn't be anti night elf - it shows you are more faction centric than elf centric. This is allowed, because it's how the developers have guided you. Despite the lore saying what it does, your world of Warcraft interaction has painted elves in light of either the horde or alliance. But if you played WC3 first, you would not have that perspective of them. You would see them through their own lens. It is much harder to hate blood elves if you're a night elf fan or hate night elves if you're a high/blood elf fan if you had that perspective. You'd be more annoyed at blizzard throwing them so deep into the horde/alliance conflict and how little it makes sense for horde allies to always matter every time, more than the future of their race.
    Not quoted. Plus, the sentence finishes with being charged with the storage and safekeeping of her most precious tomes.

    That's all it was and the quote I got is from the recent version of Chronicles and in-game itself.

    So let's go further - The Shen'dralar were just a sub-faction of Zin-Azshari Highborne as they were tasked, by the Queen to set up Eldre'Thalas in the misty jungles of South Western Kalimdor
    However the Queen's Elite were comprising of the Elite Circle Highborne and the Queen's Royal Guard as well as others like the Highborne of Xavius - those based in Zin-Azshari. It was these Highborne who were her absolute. Before the WoTA, she didn't even tell the Shen'dralar what was going on...so much for being the best of the best, I suppose...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mace View Post
    it's all engineered in the faction conflict spiciiing up, and it anti-thematic to the original foundation of the elves. I remember first seeing elves kill each other in TBC, and I'm like, thsi is the first time they've done that to each other. The original lore had expulsion for law violations not killing. And the only elves that had ever been killed bye lves was when Azshara turned evil in support of the legion and they alll fought her, every elven group around today that you can play either fought or is from ancestors who fought Azsahra. And now you are telling me they hate each other to the point of killing - just because one is horde and the other alliance. Please
    No it wasn't.

    Night Elves expressed disgust of Blood Elves through quests at Auberdine and groups of High Elves and Blood Elves had joined Legion-based organisations around Kalimdor.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mace View Post
    but their penchant for knowledge keeps getting exaggerated too - the scrying on the world
    Stop this lie.

    Nowhere does it states that the shen'dralar were scrying on the world.

    Find the source or admit your lying.
    I'm getting sick to death of you stating this and never actually being able to confirm where this stated, because it isn't in-game, nor is it in any lore source material.
    Last edited by Tanaria; 2022-08-03 at 12:17 PM.

  8. #528
    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    Not quoted. Plus, the sentence finishes with being charged with the storage and safekeeping of her most precious tomes.

    That's all it was and the quote I got is from the recent version of Chronicles and in-game itself.

    So let's go further - The Shen'dralar were just a sub-faction of Zin-Azshari Highborne as they were tasked, by the Queen to set up Eldre'Thalas in the misty jungles of South Western Kalimdor
    However the Queen's Elite were comprising of the Elite Circle Highborne and the Queen's Royal Guard as well as others like the Highborne of Xavius - those based in Zin-Azshari. It was these Highborne who were her absolute. Before the WoTA, she didn't even tell the Shen'dralar what was going on...so much for being the best of the best, I suppose...
    .
    So you selectively leave out information about the Shen'dralar just to diminish them - which is silly. You may have missed my edit, but i'll repeat it here.

    This is why I find your night elf problem a little ridiculous, you don't know where the elves you love come from. Or seem to be in denial, don't encourage silly things in game becuase that is the stance, the elven rivalry is so forced and doesn't fit their personality nor their history, THe blood elf/night lef conflict is unreasonable, and shouldn't be based on the past - given the lore of what happened. But we know this conflict was rcast and greatly forced in TBC when the blood elves went horde. Before TBC, I recall Tyrande and Kael'thass got on quite well, no where near the so called hatred the blood elves are later written to have, or the night elves.

    it's all engineered in the faction conflict spiciiing up, and it anti-thematic to the original foundation of the elves. I remember first seeing elves kill each other in TBC, and I'm like, thsi is the first time they've done that to each other. The original lore had expulsion for law violations not killing. And the only elves that had ever been killed bye lves was when Azshara turned evil in support of the legion and they alll fought her, every elven group around today that you can play either fought or is from ancestors who fought Azsahra. And now you are telling me they hate each other to the point of killing - just because one is horde and the other alliance. Please.
    Queen's most Revered arcanists - is exactly that. Queen's most Revered arcanists - no b/s. I am not going to go into a debate on how civil leadership and power mongering works, who lis likely to be in Zin'Azshari and why. How a monarch gets as powerful as Azshara did amongst such an intelligent and englightened people, and what it takes and who she has on her side. How Xavius is in the capital and not Eldre'thalas, becuase of his level of power and reverence that a queen as powerful as her cannot displace him. Or do you think the type of court that crafty witch had was all out of love when they got corrupted.?


    Handled her top projects in secrets is exactly what it says, Azhsara's top projects were her wonder works, the things she used to amazethe night elvne civilziation that drew them more to the arcane than anything else, in itself creating an imbalance in society.. when all your talented nature magic users or would be priests are instead drawn to the arcane because it's popular and amazing, those arts get either left behind or have fewer acolytes, causing what would once have beena balanced society to heavily skew one way.

    Those works must have been incredible - and you need your top people on the job to make such an impact, especially if you want to spend all your time delving into the well for more power - realising that power sources or at least believing that power source is the most important thing, especially if you want to compete with Elune for the people's affection, you'd likely need to eventually out power a goddess infused priesthood, which were still pretty damn influential, even after she had managed to have the Highborne displace them as the highest caste.


    Now does the lore out right state it that way? No, but name one thing I have said about that age that is incorrect, and tell me why or how the things I have deduced from the information they have given me are definitely wrong. They may be wrong, but not definitely wrong They are deduced based on the fine.


    Maybe you also missed my edit on the tomes.
    That the Shen'dralar were tome keepers, makes them even more knowledgeable and powerful, because it means not only did they make the top projects of the empire, they also had the greatest accumulation of its knowledge too. We know Mordant Evenshade talks about the wonders of this age paling in comparison to the night elf one - which makes sense given that he is Shen'dralar and one of those tasked with making those wonders, but their penchant for knowledge keeps getting exaggerated too - the scrying on the world, the collection of all forms of knowledge, even trivia, obsession with arcane knowledge.

    This makes them highly highly sought after and capable, as scholars, academics, but also engineers, architects that use magic to make things.
    The information about the Shen'dralar just keeps making them even more prominent and remarkable. Blizzard in keeping the Shen'dralar and Farondis have effectively ensured the night elves can not only recover the best of their civilization, but also supercede, as the former at least have an extra 10,000 years of knowledge and research, we have not seen. Nor have we seen the best of what they were capable of in the pre-sundering civilization.

    They can effectively make the night elves incredible beyond anyone (except possibly the Draenei) when it comes to both the arcane and nature because of this. But when I think about the DRaenei, i think techno magic wonder - so futuristic sci-fi, when I think about the night elves I think pure magical wonder - one in in a civilization setting, and the other in a deep forest setting which is the dual "best of the dark elf and forest elf themes" they were intentionally created to be. Not my words, the people who created them.

  9. #529
    @Darth-Piekus @geco
    We're kidding ourselves if we think the playerbase has no effect on the direction. There are quite clearly two major groups of Horde fans, those who prefer the Evil Horde and those who prefer the WC3 Horde. Blizzard has swung between pleasing both of them at the others' expense. Why? Because it generates publicity and thus revenue. Yes, plenty of players from both sides left in disgust, the WC3 Horde fans at seeing the Horde revert to Legion style killing machines and the Evil Horde fans at beloved Garrosh Derpboots and the Maggot Queen losing. That doesn't matter.

    Corporations these days are almost entirely driven by the short term, by what nets the most return this quarter and next. If something fails, the executives get to leave and call it experience, while the boots on the ground do the suffering. Thus, they keep swinging the Horde back and forth between the two groups to generate publicity. You can bet your next rent/mortgage payment that at some point in the future, the Council will either go bloodthirsty or be overthrown by the newest dictator, and there WILL be Horde fans cheering.

    @Mace
    He's scared to death at the idea of the Night Elves gaining anything, because his beloved Blood Elves might lose something for that to happen. "Screw the other players, I got mine."
    Quote Originally Posted by Alex86el View Post
    "Orc want, orc take." and "Orc dissagrees, orc kill you to win argument."
    Quote Originally Posted by Toho View Post
    The Horde is basically the guy that gets mad that the guy that they just beat the crap out of had the audacity to bleed on them.
    Why no, people don't just like Sylvie for T&A: https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...ery-Cinematic/

  10. #530
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA-US
    Posts
    40,826
    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    Nowhere does it states that the shen'dralar were scrying on the world.

    Find the source or admit your lying.
    I'm getting sick to death of you stating this and never actually being able to confirm where this stated, because it isn't in-game, nor is it in any lore source material.
    It's not directly stated, but it's heavily implied that the Shen'dralar were scrying the modern world for information, or barring that, had agents in the modern world collecting and returning secret information and lore to their libraries within Dire Maul. This would be the only way for them to have tomes such as "The Light and How to Swing It" about Paladins, when Paladins didn't exist until the Second War (well after the Shen'dralar went into seclusion within Eldre'thalas). They also had books about Garona the Half-Orc, tales penned by Lady Sevine, and even a book written by Drek'thar himself. Prince Torthreldrin himself knew about the Ashbringer and possibly its current whereabouts, the Ashbringer being a sword created during the First War. Given their hunger for knowledge and their reclusive ways, it's obvious the Shen'dalar remained interested in modern Azeroth and its goings-on and had some kind of access to the world at large - via spying or scrying or a bit of both.
    WHAT CAN THE HARVEST HOPE FOR, IF NOT THE CARE OF THE REAPER MAN?. - Terry Pratchett, Reaper Man

  11. #531
    Quote Originally Posted by Mace View Post
    Handled her top projects in secrets is exactly what it says, Azhsara's top projects were her wonder works, the things she used to amazethe night elvne civilziation that drew them more to the arcane than anything else, in itself creating an imbalance in society.. when all your talented nature magic users or would be priests are instead drawn to the arcane because it's popular and amazing, those arts get either left behind or have fewer acolytes, causing what would once have beena balanced society to heavily skew one way.
    Top projects is only selective as all Highborne sectors had their expertise.

    The Zin-Azshari lot were her most skilled and Elite as it was these who crafted a portal between the Nether and the Well of Eternity.
    Suramar were the best at the collecting and using powerful artifacts.
    The Shandaral - not recorded prior to WoTA. Crystal magic after WoTA.
    Dath'Remar's Highborne - after WoTA, protective forms of arcane magic through the Runestones of Quel'Thalas. Powerful enough to keep Dragons and Fel Orcs weakened and make demons unaware.
    Shen'dralar - tome collection and safe storage. After WoTA - creating pylons to imprison the Demon and not gain any visible side affects like the Orcs and Blood Elves did.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    It's not directly stated, but it's heavily implied that the Shen'dralar were scrying the modern world for information, or barring that, had agents in the modern world collecting and returning secret information and lore to their libraries within Dire Maul. This would be the only way for them to have tomes such as "The Light and How to Swing It" about Paladins, when Paladins didn't exist until the Second War (well after the Shen'dralar went into seclusion within Eldre'thalas). They also had books about Garona the Half-Orc, tales penned by Lady Sevine, and even a book written by Drek'thar himself. Prince Torthreldrin himself knew about the Ashbringer and possibly its current whereabouts, the Ashbringer being a sword created during the First War. Given their hunger for knowledge and their reclusive ways, it's obvious the Shen'dalar remained interested in modern Azeroth and its goings-on and had some kind of access to the world at large - via spying or scrying or a bit of both.
    We have seen Highborne in various places like Naxx, but scrying is never directly stated and never has been implied by the Shen'dralar Ancient herself.

    The Shen'dralar traveled as we saw in Lordaeron. And if they were scrying, they did a pretty terrible job of it.

  12. #532
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Good god, the reason people don't care about the Alliance is not because the Alliance is not also genocidal hypocrits like the Horde.
    arent they?
    wiped tauren tribe in barrens, purged dalaran, burning vulpera caravans and zuldazar, bcs burning people is soooooooo much moraly different and better than using plague... and thats just from top of my head, they have more on their hands...

    as for hypocricy, nelfs shun belfs for using magic but wellcome nelfs using it... alliance shun forsaken as abominations but wellcomes worgen... belfs and nightborne are too power hungry for alliance but void elfs literaly tainted with one of "worst" types of magic bcs they were looking for power? theyll fit right in!
    yep, totaly not hypocrites...

    cant speak for others but i used to play aliance, i switched to horde bcs when aliance does something bad its swept under the rug, horde commits war crime? only the leader is punished, seems unfair right? but when aliance comits war crime the leader responsible is PROMOTED...
    Last edited by Lolites; 2022-08-03 at 12:55 PM.

  13. #533
    Quote Originally Posted by Feanoro View Post
    @Mace
    He's scared to death at the idea of the Night Elves gaining anything, because his beloved Blood Elves might lose something for that to happen. "Screw the other players, I got mine."
    We know your racist against the Horde and it's got nothing to do with the Blood Elves.

    It's about speaking factual and with the information we have at hand.
    I don't like it when people pass off their own "well it's likely that..." when their is no source for it.

    Keep it to "my opinion" and don't pass it off as canon lore.

    You will never find me ever doing that for Blood Elf lore at all. I stick to what is confirmed.

    EDIT: Guess what - I would give the Shen'dralar credit for studying the Void; however that confirmed piece of lore is completely useless and completely irrelevant because it comes at a time when we have Void Elves, the Ren'dorei. Studying the void would have been great without the Void Elves, who have mastered the Void.
    And I do give the Shen'dralar credit because they are the ONLY ones who have tapped into fel-based magic and not had any visible side affects. Unlike Orcs, Nightborne, Draenei and Blood Elves
    Last edited by Tanaria; 2022-08-03 at 12:56 PM.

  14. #534
    Quote Originally Posted by Feanoro View Post
    @Mace
    He's scared to death at the idea of the Night Elves gaining anything, because his beloved Blood Elves might lose something for that to happen. "Screw the other players, I got mine."
    So true, you can see it in every post he makes, the thought of blood elves losing anything or being obviously sub par in anything elven terrifies him Even thought night elves are elves - he patrols the forums here, on the official forums, on reddit and others, shooting down and trying to fix night elves only as primitive savages that only know nature magic, so the blood elves he loves can be the best at the arcane magic, and pretty elven things, high civilization he loves most about them.

    He subverts, revises, re-interprets night elf history and iconic figures to diminish or remove any element that shows that part of them, he does it every single time. We can't even explore potential scenarios of a different future, woe betide the blood elves aren't anything but super amazing and on the horde or - it's like you've stabbed him in the chest, rather than actually exploring a scenario and what its effects might be.

    AFter a while, I give up. The night elf story is quite clear about the race, who they are, their diversity, what they have in them, and what continues. To him, it's like he tries hard to pretend they have no city, have no capable magic users,and never did or something, it's all blood elven now. When the reality is that blood elves have htier own type, night elves have their own, that is what the devs have done.

    But you know what jealous selfish fans are like, they want the other team to be terrible and rubbish, while there's is the best at the things they like, even when it's clearly not the case. GIve them the chance and they remake/retell everything

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    We know your racist against the Horde and it's got nothing to do with the Blood Elves.

    It's about speaking factual and with the information we have at hand.
    I don't like it when people pass off their own "well it's likely that..." when their is no source for it.

    Keep it to "my opinion" and don't pass it off as canon lore.

    You will never find me ever doing that for Blood Elf lore at all. I stick to what is confirmed.

    EDIT: Guess what - I would give the Shen'dralar credit for studying the Void; however that confirmed piece of lore is completely useless and completely irrelevant because it comes at a time when we have Void Elves, the Ren'dorei. Studying the void would have been great without the Void Elves, who have mastered the Void.
    He still nailed you 100% though
    Last edited by Mace; 2022-08-03 at 01:00 PM.

  15. #535
    Quote Originally Posted by Mace View Post
    He still nailed you 100% though
    No he didn't.

    You just like what says because you don't like it when I speak about canon facts and the canon lore that Blizzard has given.

    Again - find me the source that directly states the Shen'dralar were scrying on the world. I've asked for it lots of times and each time, the answer has changed. First, it was "in-game. Speak to the NPCS." Then it was "it was in a book." Then, "it was at a blizzcon." How can you expect me to believe this when the story keeps changing. I have gone out of my way to find this source and it seemingly doesn't exist.

    So I can only deduce that it's been made up.

    Mace - have you ever considered that I just know more night elf lore than you do? I mean, everything I say is confirmed in the lore.
    Last edited by Tanaria; 2022-08-03 at 01:01 PM.

  16. #536
    Ya know. I came back to the forum thinking "Maybe the people here have something cool to say about things" like my brain remembered (perhaps falsely) about my visits here years ago.

    But thread after thread, threads that on the surface sound kinda interesting, I keep seeing an overwhelming negativity just flood the place. People take the game way too seriously, elitism in abundance and people cant say anything without it turning into some kind of argument. When people tend to say that the wow fandom is currently toxic this place kinda defines that these days. This is a thread about how to make alliance more popular, for Thrall's sake. Even Reddit is more positive and upbeat. It appears this is the place people go to in order to complain and whine for days on end.

    My small 5c into the discussion. I've been alliance since vanilla, played a dwarf paladin the whole time. I just find fun things to do. I dont feel like alliance is in some place where it needs any kind of real help except perhaps when it comes to BG's (But I dont really do those so personally I am not affected). I just log on and find that both Stormwind and Orgrimmar have cool things going on. Sure Stormwind shows its age but it feels like a town to me. Both factions are cool. Just relax.

    Go have fun, for the alliance/horde.

  17. #537
    Quote Originally Posted by talmir View Post
    Ya know. I came back to the forum thinking "Maybe the people here have something cool to say about things" like my brain remembered (perhaps falsely) about my visits here years ago.

    But thread after thread, threads that on the surface sound kinda interesting, I keep seeing an overwhelming negativity just flood the place. People take the game way too seriously, elitism in abundance and people cant say anything without it turning into some kind of argument. When people tend to say that the wow fandom is currently toxic this place kinda defines that these days. This is a thread about how to make alliance more popular, for Thrall's sake. Even Reddit is more positive and upbeat. It appears this is the place people go to in order to complain and whine for days on end.

    My small 5c into the discussion. I've been alliance since vanilla, played a dwarf paladin the whole time. I just find fun things to do. I dont feel like alliance is in some place where it needs any kind of real help except perhaps when it comes to BG's (But I dont really do those so personally I am not affected). I just log on and find that both Stormwind and Orgrimmar have cool things going on. Sure Stormwind shows its age but it feels like a town to me. Both factions are cool. Just relax.

    Go have fun, for the alliance/horde.
    Alliance story needs more than just Humans and Night Elves to make it interesting.

    Just giving Humans and Night Elves the "I win" button, for being Humans and Night Elves is not the way to go about this.
    Indeed, both races need to be ousted from the narrative for a while and let others shine - like Void Elves, Dark Irons and Draenei.

  18. #538
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA-US
    Posts
    40,826
    Quote Originally Posted by Tanaria View Post
    We have seen Highborne in various places like Naxx, but scrying is never directly stated and never has been implied by the Shen'dralar Ancient herself.

    The Shen'dralar traveled as we saw in Lordaeron. And if they were scrying, they did a pretty terrible job of it.
    Highborne != Shen'dralar, and there's nothing linking Tarsis Kir-Moldir (the Highborne Mage in the Classic Naxxramas instance) to the Shen'dralar specifically. Prior to the Shen'dralar leaving Dire Maul en masse due to the death of Tortheldrin, the only known Shen'dralar outside Dire Maul was Azj'Tordin, who fled rather than be sacrificed to keep Immol'thar imprisoned.
    WHAT CAN THE HARVEST HOPE FOR, IF NOT THE CARE OF THE REAPER MAN?. - Terry Pratchett, Reaper Man

  19. #539
    Quote Originally Posted by Aucald View Post
    Highborne != Shen'dralar, and there's nothing linking Tarsis Kir-Moldir (the Highborne Mage in the Classic Naxxramas instance) to the Shen'dralar specifically. Prior to the Shen'dralar leaving Dire Maul en masse due to the death of Tortheldrin, the only known Shen'dralar outside Dire Maul was Azj'Tordin, who fled rather than be sacrificed to keep Immol'thar imprisoned.
    I've heard many people linking him to the Shen'dralar simply because that holdout group and him are the only known Highborne around on both continents.
    For all we know - he could have been a hermit back when the land that would be known as Lordaeron, fell under the Kaldorei Empire.

    But we also know of people who have traveled to Dire Maul to tell the Prince of their stories as well.

    So - we could imply that the Elves were scrying on Lordaeron, as the Night Elves were aware of Lordaeron's fall, hence how they knew of the Paladin's book, but that doesn't indicate scrying on the world. The latter part of this claim, does require a statement from Blizzard because it is quite the bold claim and I personally think that the Shen'dralar Ancient herself, would have made mention of it.
    Such as her stating that her people were aware of the natives of Quel'Thalas and Lordaeron's fall and the Orcish Wars in the Southern areas of the East. Kalimdor might be easier for them, so it's entirely possible that they saw things like the War of the Shifting Sands. With this, we'd have far more material to work with, but we don't.

  20. #540
    It's not even Horde or Alliance overall population, that is still fairly balanced. The issue is a larger one, that over time realms have become very much Alliance or Horde. As the years of wow have passed, players realized that a lot of things are easier if you're on the more populated side. So many players shifted to playing on the more heavily populated faction. Daily quests are a whole lot easier when more mobs are tagged for your faction, for example. Guilds are much easier to join too when there are a lot more of them. And players are more likely to be playing with more of their friends on the more populated faction side.

    So now regardless of whether the overall population of wow is 55/45 horde-alliance, many realms are now very much 90/10 populations either direction. And that's not fun for either side, with the few remaining minority faction players left to wonder if they should transfer off too, and the majority side left with no meaningful wpvp.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •