April 19 Tinker Reveal

[Nightshade711]

For the umpteenth time for those who are hard of hearing, or have trouble reading words: I am not talking about gameplay.

Gameplay & concepts revolving around gameplay > Concepts on theme

Nobody cares that the thematic concepts exist elsewhere except you
The gameplay doesn’t.

[Velerios]

rework it how? They need to completely remove engineering and make it a class and rename it to Tinker with a few extra abilities...

Nope, this removes another reason for having professions in the game; and there are too many things that are important to every class that engineering covers, not only the obsession of some people over a crappy class as tinkers; engineering needs far more love; heck, they could make it something like a side-class where you need to farm up to do it and make it a class that use expendables as a somehow extra class spec, but not remove engineering for a crappy class called tinker.

Engineering simply needs more love, nothing more and nothing less.

[Ielenia]

Holy Paladin and Holy Priest share the exact same themes for these two specs. Exact.

Do you need to be a priest to be a paladin, or vice-versa?

Because professions are in-game representations of knowledge and skill. If you don't know a given profession, then, lore-wise, you don't have the skill and knowledge associated with that field.

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Gameplay

I'm mot talking about gameplay.

[Nightshade711]

I'm mot talking about gameplay.

Then the point you’re attempting to make is moot

[Al Gorefiend]

Yeah if the next expac is Dragonflight I don't see Tinker arriving. Just wouldn't make sense, but they could go full fan-servicey so who knows.

[Velerios]

Well if the content leak that matches the name is right then Tinker is some kind of 1 spec class or shared 4th spec. So ... don't give up hope just yet I was only teasing!

The only thing that matches in this leak with the real thing will be the the name of it; he was the only one who luckily find the right name of the expansion, but the rest is like every mmo-champion-leak a pig pile of crap. Even a blind hen sometimes find a piece of corn.

[Nightshade711]

Yeah if the next expac is Dragonflight I don't see Tinker arriving. Just wouldn't make sense, but they could go full fan-servicey so who knows.

True.
I wouldn’t be surprised it it happened, but I’m anticipating a dragon based class.

[Al Gorefiend]

rework it how? They need to completely remove engineering and make it a class and rename it to Tinker with a few extra abilities...

Also this. My consensus is a.) They do nothing and let the inconsistency play out in people's heads or b.) scrap engineering. its a quarter the profession it used to be after they nerfed professions having combat benefits.

[Velerios]

Yeah if the next expac is Dragonflight I don't see Tinker arriving. Just wouldn't make sense, but they could go full fan-servicey so who knows.

Since many people (on mmo-champion even the majority) hates tinker, i doubt it; and a dragonsworn-class would take a lot more sense; maybe the races we have now with more dragon-like modifications such as a Dragon-Tail, Wings, Claws, Eyes and so on; this would make more sense for an expansion than having tinker in it.

Engineering needs more love and tinker belongs in the dustbin, period.

[Al Gorefiend]

True.
I wouldn’t be surprised it it happened, but I’m anticipating a dragon based class.

My personal least favorite outcome, I don't hate the idea just think the fan names/concepts didn't make it sound great.

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Since many people (on mmo-champion even the majority) hates tinker, i doubt it; and a dragonsworn-class would take a lot more sense; maybe the races we have now with more dragon-like modifications such as a Dragon-Tail, Wings, Claws, Eyes and so on; this would make more sense for an expansion than having tinker in it.

Yeah ehh, I just don't like it. Its like Demon Hunter but Dragons. Maybe if its more a long-ranged caster of dragon magic I'd like it more.

[cityguy193]

Nice, the chance of having a tinker-class right now decreased significantly. The "NO TINKER DAY" seems more and more possible!

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Don't make me more hopeful than i should be; there might still be a nasty surprise. But at least Tinker right now seems more and more unlikely, and that's the right direction!

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Yeah, would be good, but at least as long as it isn't tinker, everything is ok. If people really want to play a tinker, blizzard should overwork engineering, period.

This will age like milk

[m4Zzo928]

I'm completely welcome to a tinker class, I would even love it, but boy is it a hard sell for me. Since it's been speculated on since what Cata? If it doesn't happen this expansion, I really don't think Blizz want's to do it, and honestly you could have probably said that at an earlier expansion.

[Nightshade711]

My personal least favorite outcome, I don't hate the idea just think the fan names/concepts didn't make it sound great.

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Yeah ehh, I just don't like it. Its like Demon Hunter but Dragons. Maybe if its more a long-ranged caster of dragon magic I'd like it more.

Fair enough.
Not a major fan of most of the concepts as well, but I would genuinely be surprised if we don’t get a new class for a third expansion in a row.

[Auburst]

Nice, the chance of having a tinker-class right now decreased significantly. The "NO TINKER DAY" seems more and more possible!

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Don't make me more hopeful than i should be; there might still be a nasty surprise. But at least Tinker right now seems more and more unlikely, and that's the right direction!

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Yeah, would be good, but at least as long as it isn't tinker, everything is ok. If people really want to play a tinker, blizzard should overwork engineering, period.

Why do you dislike Tinker so much? Just curious.

[ClassicPeon]

Fair enough.
Not a major fan of most of the concepts as well, but I would genuinely be surprised if we don’t get a new class for a third expansion in a row.

I see 10.0 being a complete shitshow if they dont bring in something new.

Could be a big revamp of several/all classes
4rth spec to classes
a new class

In a game where most of the gameplay revolves around your rotation it needs to be renewed once in a while.

[Triceron]

Do you need to be a priest to be a paladin, or vice-versa?

In the lore? Yes, you do. All Paladins are either Priests who took up arms or warriors that learned the powers of the Hoky Light through a Priest. Their lore is tied together, while their orders are what separates the two.

Their themes are undoubtedly tied together. Even Tauren Seers and Sun Priests share the same Druidic worship of the Sun. They all derived from the same source and share the same theme.

If you're not talking about gameplay, and you are talking about theme and lore, then Paladins use the same Holy magic and faith as all Priests of the same race and culture. There is no difference in the source and power they use, it's the exact same powers, manifested in the same ability to heal and protect with shields.

[Velerios]

This will age like milk

Maybe, but who knows; aged milk can be fermented into fine cheese, and even buttermilk is not bad at all; also there is durable milk that can age for a while and it still tastes like milk.
But really: no, it does not make sense to introduce a crappy class like tinkers into an expansion about dragons. Heck, even Dark Rangers makes more sense in the next expansion than Tinkers. But all in all, i still prepare for the "no tinker day" on april 19th!

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Why do you dislike Tinker so much? Just curious.

Because we have engineering
Because it's a crappy class concept
There are many more reasons to dislike it, especially now that we really have bigger issues than adding tinkers into the game; this could be a concept on an expansion that fits like an expansion about undermine, there tinkers makes at least sense; and even then i would rather have blizzard adding more love into engineering rather than removing it; and yes, why can't there be a profession that is good in combat with their gadgets?

We need more love into professions rather than removing another profession and putting down a class from the scraps of it.

[Nightshade711]

Because we have engineering
Because it's a crappy class concept
There are many more reasons to dislike it, especially now that we really have bigger issues than adding tinkers into the game; this could be a concept on an expansion that fits like an expansion about undermine, there tinkers makes at least sense; and even then i would rather have blizzard adding more love into engineering rather than removing it; and yes, why can't there be a profession that is good in combat with their gadgets?

We need more love into professions rather than removing another profession and putting down a class from the scraps of it.

Overhauling engineering to make it “good in combat with gadgets” would be OP, and is specifically the reason why that’s not a thing because you’d have your normal class stuff on top of whatever “overhauled engineering” items you’re thinking about.
I already see the “+15 link engineering” groups in group finder.
You can’t use items in rated PvP, and it’ll stay that way because it’ll be OP. I can just imagine RMP comps getting made more OP.

Do agree that the concept for tinker wouldn’t fit the mold of new classes having to fit the theme of the expansion they’re added in though.
I don’t see blizzard breaking that and adding Tinker into a dragon expansion unless they somehow can stretch it into fitting.
Or unless blizzard decides they need another success like Legion and the main way to do that is to add one of the most current requested classes.

[Velerios]

Overhauling engineering to make it “good in combat with gadgets” would be OP, and is specifically the reason why that’s not a thing because you’d have your normal class stuff on top of whatever “overhauled engineering” items you’re thinking about.

That's only the case if the items engineering produce are totally overpowered (they could simply make them scale with AP/SP to bring them in line with other abilities) and if the items they create are only usable for engineers. Another balancing of it could be that some items are ok, and some are really overpowered, but extreme expensive in materials. Yes, we know that this will not affect the asmongolds, but most of the rest of the players; even more, it would be a good reason to make professions more desireable again; especially if it needs stuff from them too.

All in all i think that this can be done without making them vanilla-overpowered, but also not as bad as everything we had after vanilla.

EDIT: and oh yes, adding drawbacks to it could also be a good reason not to use them on cooldown.

[Nightshade711]

That's only the case if the items engineering produce are totally overpowered (they could simply make them scale with AP/SP to bring them in line with other abilities) and if the items they create are only usable for engineers. Another balancing of it could be that some items are ok, and some are really overpowered, but extreme expensive in materials. Yes, we know that this will not affect the asmongolds, but most of the rest of the players; even more, it would be a good reason to make professions more desireable again; especially if it needs stuff from them too.

All in all i think that this can be done without making them vanilla-overpowered, but also not as bad as everything we had after vanilla.

If they’re even useful in combat at all it would be op and would probably be mandatory for higher end content.
Making them expensive to use would just piss everyone off further and it’ll turn that part of the game very P2W. (Buy WoW tokens, sell for gold, use gold to buy the useful engineering items or at least the mats for it)

Having to balance engineering items on top of classes would be atrocious. Some classes (I suspect rogue being one of them) would benefit from these items way more than others for one.