Why is mindlessly easy the default for wow?

[Elias1337]

That was never the case. WoW has ALWAYS been this way since original release. It was just more tedious.

No it really wasnt. Mobs actualy opposed threat. Then this uber entilted casuals came in complainig about it and Blizzard caved in in order to get their sub money. And in process of cuttering game for these so called casuals alianated rest of their core audience.

Yes mobs were not mechanicly challenging becouse you know 2004. But thats not excuse having world mobs with mechanics what hit like wet nuddle. Doing no dmg and dieing in 2 seconds. Its also reason btw why are zones over saturated by mobs. To compensate for fact game become easyer and faster.

[Lolites]

It might be me getting older but I'm growing increasingly sick of games trying to substitute a difficulty progression system with a time spent one.

as opposed to what period in wow? vanilla, where everything was easy enough for people after lobotomy, just took a LOOOONG time?
between m+ and mythic raids wow now have more difficult content than in the past, not less...

[NineSpine]

No it really wasnt. Mobs actualy opposed threat. Then this uber entilted casuals came in complainig about it and Blizzard caved in in order to get their sub money. And in process of cuttering game for these so called casuals alianated rest of their core audience.

Yes mobs were not mechanicly challenging becouse you know 2004. But thats not excuse having world mobs with mechanics what hit like wet nuddle. Doing no dmg and dieing in 2 seconds.

That's not what happened. The "I want the game to be a lobby for instances" crowd is who demanded the world content be dumbed down.

[Lolites]

TBC heroics were hard and subs grew, why is that?

people need to understand, players were leaving in DROVES back then too... and we KNOW that, bcs at some point in late cata (or early panda?) they said 100m people tried wow, yet it never reacherd 13m active subs, so in vanila-pandaria period over 87% who tried the game LEFT...
there just was enough new players to outweight that, but thats not possible forever...

also, TBC heroics were not really difficult if you knew what you are doing, its just back then a lot of people DIDNT know

[Kehego]

people need to understand, players were leaving in DROVES back then too... and we KNOW that, bcs at some point in late cata (or early panda?) they said 100m people tried wow, yet it never reacherd 13m active subs, so in vanila-pandaria period over 87% who tried the game LEFT...
there just was enough new players to outweight that, but thats not possible forever...

also, TBC heroics were not really difficult if you knew what you are doing, its just back then a lot of people DIDNT know

same with cata heroics.
people just refused to learn. No more wotlk zerg, boo hoo.

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Yeah, he's horribly wrong. It's a terrible idea. But I think the games fucked up for different reasons and so do you. I get it though.

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I don't know. You are the one flexing right now. You tell me the appeal of doing so.

Again, if they were easy, we wouldn't be having this conversation and Blizzard wouldn't have admitted they were hard. Difficulty is subjective, and that's why we base something like that on the experience of the entire player base not just Kehego because he's soooo amazing and soooo good at wow that this wasn't a challenge for him.

I just used hard CC.

Like, the only classes that don't have them are what, warriors and DK?

[Shadowferal]

people need to understand, players were leaving in DROVES back then too... and we KNOW that, bcs at some point in late cata (or early panda?) they said 100m people tried wow, yet it never reacherd 13m active subs, so in vanila-pandaria period over 87% who tried the game LEFT... there just was enough new players to outweight that, but thats not possible forever...

100 million??
Really?

[Kehego]

100 million??
Really?

that was a #of accounts created statistic years ago yeah

[Ghost of Cow]

It has always mostly been the default for MMOs. Of course they want to keep you doing something easy 10,000 times over doing something hard fewer times.

That way it's accessible to everyone and keeps you occupied much longer. There's a reason why you don't see the same concepts in single-player games.

[GreenJesus]

I can agree with this as long as making harder outdoor content not just damage sponges or ridiculously overtuned auto attacks that kill you in two unavoidable melee swings. Would that mean having to constantly dance around avoiding triangles and squares, and dodging telegraphed animation wings and memorizing specific mechanics for each rare in the world? I remember the part on timeless isle where The fire cows were on the other side of the bridge with those kilnmasters that would one shot you if you stood in the cone. Good times. Is that what you are asking for?

Another thing Blizzard needs to do is make mechanics on the ground stand out more. I know they like having mechanics look lore-accurate or whatever, but please have better outlines on where is good and where is bad. Enough of the vague swirlies. Put a dark outline around the edge of the swirly please for the love of god.

[Lolites]

100 million??
Really?

yes, but i had wrong time, it was late panda, not early

https://www.polygon.com/2014/1/28/53...ounts-lifetime

[GreenJesus]

that was a #of accounts created statistic years ago yeah

That 100 million includes the millions and millions of gold farming bots.

[Celement]

https://web.archive.org/web/20110113...n/blog/2053469

This wonderful blog post, which was deleted after it prompted probably the biggest exodus of the playerbase in the game's history.


I don't disagree, this was proven with the limited interest in Challenge Modes in MOP. I don't even think people want the 'best' gear to be honest, I think they want gear that makes their job easier. The harder you make the content, the less content players will be with what they have. I mean, you see that in the expectations on gearscore, achievements etc that people ask for in LFG.

We don't have numbers past mop but mop was the largest drop...

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You are actively paying for a video game you feel like makes you do chores. That is not the fault of the video game. That is a fault of the perception you have of the video game. You know what most people do when they feel like something isn't "respecting their time"? They stop paying for it. They don't go on forums and argue for 20 pages about how their perceived vision would be better for the game.

True but it is a relatively new development. Again it's in the first post you quoted but clearly didn't read. WoW enjoys the success it does because what it does so well no one else in the market is doing well yet.

[Shadowferal]

That 100 million includes the millions and millions of gold farming bots.

There were a lot of those mfers.

[Soon-TM]

Another thing Blizzard needs to do is make mechanics on the ground stand out more. I know they like having mechanics look lore-accurate or whatever, but please have better outlines on where is good and where is bad. Enough of the vague swirlies. Put a dark outline around the edge of the swirly please for the love of god.

I don't know why can't WoW bosses be more like PoE or even !@#$ing D3 ones, where it's quite clear what you need to do in order to not get killed from the very beginning, instead of having to do your homework for every. Single. Freaking. Boss /sigh

[Lolites]

That 100 million includes the millions and millions of gold farming bots.

so? even if half of that was bots that still mean 50m, and wow never reached 13m (with bots included ofc, ALL player statistics include them)
so aprox 40 of 50m left in that period, thats still 80%...

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There were a lot of those mfers.

and they are included in all statistics, even in wows "peak" of subs, so it still shows wow was loosing shitloads of players since begining, and the point still stands

[Jessicka]

We don't have numbers past mop but mop was the largest drop...

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Over the two years maybe, though it also had some recovery. Cataclysm dumped a huge chunk of players within the first 3 months.

[Shadowferal]

so? even if half of that was bots that still mean 50m, and wow never reached 13m (with bots included ofc, ALL player statistics include them) so aprox 40 of 50m left in that period, thats still 80%... - - - Updated - - - and they are included in all statistics, even in wows "peak" of subs, so it still shows wow was loosing shitloads of players since begining, and the point still stands

I think that it only highlights the fact that wow has sucked hard for a long time.
After MoP it all went to hell...

[Celement]

so? even if half of that was bots that still mean 50m, and wow never reached 13m (with bots included ofc, ALL player statistics include them)
so aprox 40 of 50m left in that period, thats still 80%...

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and they are included in all statistics, even in wows "peak" of subs, so it still shows wow was loosing shitloads of players since begining, and the point still stands

I think the question isnt what was the most popular as an aging game with ever increasing competition will never be as popular as it was during its prime with no competition. The question should be what are wows strengths and how does it court it's more stable population of players?

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I think that it only highlights the fact that wow has sucked hard for a long time.
After MoP it all went to hell...

I feel like people only recall mop from throne of thunder onwards. Early mop crashed and burned and had one of the steep drop off.

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Over the two years maybe, though it also had some recovery. Cataclysm dumped a huge chunk of players within the first 3 months.

Last tier too with the release of lfr... I think people only select data they believe supports their argument.

[Kehego]

I think that it only highlights the fact that wow has sucked hard for a long time.
After MoP it all went to hell...

since vanilla launch, tbh

but if you know the game sucks, why is you still here?

[Lolites]

I think that it only highlights the fact that wow has sucked hard for a long time.
After MoP it all went to hell...

if you go by retention, or "players lost" only, sure, since begining...
i know people point to cata as where they started to loose subs but thats simply innacurate, its not when they started to loos subs, its when the count of new players coming in was no longer higher than those of leaving

its absolutely possible in vanila-wrath they lost more of those 100m players than in cata-pandaria, wouldnt be anything unusual, since huge amount of people would come and check the game simply due to being new and/or well known, found out its not for them and left...
that type of customers is always most common in newer products and dies down over time, people like that probably dont exist anymore (at least not in noticeable numbers) so they dont inflate the metrics in either way