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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by THEORACLE64 View Post
    Tbh I can’t see them going any further than Wrath. Classic - Wrath is what’s really considered as “classic” WoW before they started making the huger changes.
    They will churn them out until it stops working. So far just about every release is a huge spike, even if just temporary, for very very little labor or time sunk into it. It is like getting an expansion release without most the over head. Now do I think Cata is when the downturn will certainly start to happen? Probably a with the odds assessment to say so. I could see interest in MoP again though because it has started to get more a cult following these days as it has aged and "I hate pandas" lost its way. But you never know.. MoP was utterly hated now a lot of people want to play it again. It might happen with more expansions in the future as the distance between them and live increases. It seems to be a thing. Trust me I got no desire to play WoD Classic but I also have no doubt some people might and that might be enough.

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Low Hanging Fruit View Post
    They will churn them out until it stops working. So far just about every release is a huge spike, even if just temporary, for very very little labor or time sunk into it. It is like getting an expansion release without most the over head. Now do I think Cata is when the downturn will certainly start to happen? Probably a with the odds assessment to say so. I could see interest in MoP again though because it has started to get more a cult following these days as it has aged and "I hate pandas" lost its way. But you never know.. MoP was utterly hated now a lot of people want to play it again. It might happen with more expansions in the future as the distance between them and live increases. It seems to be a thing. Trust me I got no desire to play WoD Classic but I also have no doubt some people might and that might be enough.
    MoP was vocally hated by a bunch of people who never played it I think. It was much more than just pandas and asia.

    WoD though, that thing can't even get a following on pservers.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by FanaticDreamer View Post
    That's good news.

    But they really should stop after WoTLK. Or if they plan to go on, they should completely retool Cataclysm. Have the ability to rewind entire zones pre-Cataclysm available by NPCs, don't butcher the talent trees, don't only add 5 levels (dumb decision), add back in the cut content (like the water raid), etc. But anything except how Cata was. It truly was the beginning of the fall.

    Let the players vote on the stuff that is included / changed.
    Ehm, no? Cata is one of the best expansions ever made after mop and i'm not trolling... Would never touch it with your ideas.
    That said, it should definitely stop after wotlk...

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    Nah, I hope they bring out classic cata and mop at least, not going to say no to going further, but really would like a legit way to replay those two like I do illegally.
    Cata actually had a really cool launch experience. The initial design of the 5mans was great, the raids were both cool and the minor patch with ZG was also a treat.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Onikaroshi View Post
    MoP was vocally hated by a bunch of people who never played it I think. It was much more than just pandas and asia.

    WoD though, that thing can't even get a following on pservers.
    I mean you can look at its player numbers decline pretty steadily. I personally really like MoP as an expansion. But I know that first patch when it was "dailycraft" was pretty widely hated. But once you got though that wall the expansion was honestly amazing. The patches were really good. Most the raids were really great. PVP was fun. Over all it was a great game with a bad release (to a lot of people, it didn't bother me). Then you had the whiners like you said were just people crying about China and Pandas.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by tomten View Post
    Ehm, no? Cata is one of the best expansions ever made after mop and i'm not trolling... Would never touch it with your ideas.
    That said, it should definitely stop after wotlk...
    If you're ranking Cata higher than Wrath or BC...I'm not sure I trust your judgment on my ideas.

    Cata was truly the first C grade expansion we received after several A+s. The cut content, fewer raids/dungeons than previous expansions, the stupid 5 levels thing, ruined tanking / healing for the start of the expansion until several patches in, endgame content was meh, poor difficulty scaling which destroyed the PUG experience, a whole year of Dragon Soul, etc. etc.

    It simply wasn't a good expansion. I will say that Cataclysm looks a lot better than some of the recent expansions we've gotten, but even then a lot of the problems we have today started with Cataclysm.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by FanaticDreamer View Post
    But they really should stop after WoTLK. Or if they plan to go on, they should completely retool Cataclysm
    No - They should continue going for as long as people are willing to play, keeping the game as it was at the time**. I'm keen to replay Cataclysm & Mists, because those were actually very amazing raiding expansions.

    ** I'm very much in the camp of #MoreChanges but mostly around quality of life changes, not gameplay. Bringing in Void Storage sooner, absolutely, reworking all of Cataclysm to basically and fundamentally change what the expansion was like, no.
    Last edited by ResentfulUK; 2022-04-10 at 12:38 PM.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by FanaticDreamer View Post
    If you're ranking Cata higher than Wrath or BC...I'm not sure I trust your judgment on my ideas.

    Cata was truly the first C grade expansion we received after several A+s. The cut content, fewer raids/dungeons than previous expansions, the stupid 5 levels thing, ruined tanking / healing for the start of the expansion until several patches in, endgame content was meh, poor difficulty scaling which destroyed the PUG experience, a whole year of Dragon Soul, etc. etc.

    It simply wasn't a good expansion. I will say that Cataclysm looks a lot better than some of the recent expansions we've gotten, but even then a lot of the problems we have today started with Cataclysm.
    I never played vanilla, so can't really speak for the hype and honestly joined halfway into BC.
    Nah, it was great. It was first time they modernize the world and talent systems, which was much needed. Cut content happens in every single expansion. Quality over quantity and all the dungeons were amazing, specially with the tuning early on. I've always hated leveling, its shit, so I really welcomed only 5 levels, was the first time ever I had 3 active raid characters (tank, healer and dps). Tanking was at it's best, what are you even talking about? Healers had it very rough with the mana and coming from the gogogo mentality but it was just an adjusting issue, again, i liked that tuning, ironically it would have worked a lot better in todays retail with normal, heroic, m0 etc. Yeh, dragon soul lasted bit too long but nothing too extreme in comparison to other tiers or expansions and I really loved dragon soul except spine...

    And for me personally (and this matters way more than you think) I played with a group of friends which had an atmosphere and fun setting I can only ever dream to find again, which is surely painting it in a better light... But still, I really liked cataclysm as a whole and I reaaally loved the mop raids and how most classes worked in terms of skill ceiling and rotations. Ghostcrawler will forever be remembered as the god of rotations and depth....

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by ResentfulUK View Post
    No - They should continue going for as long as people are willing to play, keeping the game as it was at the time**. I'm keen to replay Cataclysm & Mists, because those were actually very amazing raiding expansions.

    ** I'm very much in the camp of #MoreChanges but mostly around quality of life changes, not gameplay. Bringing in Void Storage sooner, absolutely, reworking all of Cataclysm to basically and fundamentally change what the expansion was like, no.
    Yeh, MOP raids was and still is on a different level

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by tomten View Post
    I never played vanilla, so can't really speak for the hype and honestly joined halfway into BC.
    Nah, it was great. It was first time they modernize the world and talent systems, which was much needed. Cut content happens in every single expansion. Quality over quantity and all the dungeons were amazing, specially with the tuning early on. I've always hated leveling, its shit, so I really welcomed only 5 levels, was the first time ever I had 3 active raid characters (tank, healer and dps). Tanking was at it's best, what are you even talking about? Healers had it very rough with the mana and coming from the gogogo mentality but it was just an adjusting issue, again, i liked that tuning, ironically it would have worked a lot better in todays retail with normal, heroic, m0 etc. Yeh, dragon soul lasted bit too long but nothing too extreme in comparison to other tiers or expansions and I really loved dragon soul except spine...

    And for me personally (and this matters way more than you think) I played with a group of friends which had an atmosphere and fun setting I can only ever dream to find again, which is surely painting it in a better light... But still, I really liked cataclysm as a whole and I reaaally loved the mop raids and how most classes worked in terms of skill ceiling and rotations. Ghostcrawler will forever be remembered as the god of rotations and depth....

    The world modernization was a great idea but poor execution. Not allowing people to switch it back to the old areas was bad. Getting rid of iconic quest chains / items was bad. I'd also argue that not updating *all* areas was also bad.

    I'll disagree 100% about the talent system change. They ruined a lot of what made making a character fun and what made playing diverse.

    Cut content happens in every expansion, yes. I wouldn't say otherwise. But Cata had THE MOST cut before launch at that point, which started a bad trend. And I didn't really see a major difference between Cata dungeons and past expansion dungeons so I can't say quality > quantity.

    It's fine if you hate leveling but that's a huge part of the game and the leveling experience suffered due to the level cut. Even Blizzard in a rare moment of clarity realized they made a mistake doing it.

    Tanking and healing go together. Healing was in SUCH a bad state that it was awful to heal + awful to be a tank at that time. I was main healer for the entire expansion and it was *terrible* for the first several patches. My tank was so stressed as well. Your "adjusting" issue lasted much longer than it should have.

    Spine was awful, period.

    I also played with a group of friends. I had a whole guild in Wrath that had over 200 players. By mid-to-end of Cata, it had less than 100. People were leaving because of all the issues in the game. Rotations were good, I will consent that. But overall? Cata really was the beginning of the decline. MoP was a temporary reprieve.

  10. #30
    eh not shocking to expect WotLK announcement on the 19th.. Heck, even the store had new WotLK items that were previously only on the china store up for a brief moment but were out of stock, including a new frostmourne replica. Cool for those that enjoy it, but even if it was peak wow for me I wont play it, it won't be the same and will just make me best some of the best years of both my WoW and non-WoW life.
    Member: Shadow Lands Alpha Club, Member since 4/9/2020

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Gimlix View Post
    Pretty sure this fact was surfing the internet since forever though? They said the big ICC drought caused it and only because of Cataclysm announcement u saw a boost in subscribers just before quarter call. So it remained at 12M.
    12 million.

    How much did MoP have again?
    How joyous to be in such a place! Where phishing is not only allowed, it is encouraged!

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Ringthane View Post
    12 million.

    How much did MoP have again?
    As long as it gives them profit beyond the spending to the level they want they could go with it even if it's way less popular than Wrath. Less money than more money is still money.

    Even being less popular it still has its fans, so maybe? I'm hoping but wouldn't mind if we just don't get it. At least I got TBC and will get Wrath. Nostalgia fulfilled.

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