Dark Ranger Customizations (Coming in 9.2.5)!!!

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Of course they're natural. Ice is natural in very cold regions. Plant life is natural on fertile regions. I honestly don't think you're thinking it through with your argument, here.

What is your point here? That either everything is natural or everything in unnatural? Well, clearly "unnatural/supernatural" exists since we have the sentence "supernatural cold" used to describe death knights in the lore. But if "magic and its effects are natural" like you like to claim it is, then the whole idea of "supernatural cold" does not exist, because it's created by magic, therefore it's "natural".

So ice is Natural, something from the effects of the elements, Planet life is natural, Something from the effects of Spirit magic on the elements, So the effects of magic are in fact Natural if those things are as they only happen due to the effects of magic.

And no everything being natural/unnatural only applies if we go with your idea that all magic and it's effects are unnatural instead of going with what chronicles say's which is that some magic's are innate to the great dark while others only come into it by bleeding over from different realms.

Chronicles tells us that Elemental, Nature(spirit) and arcane are all part of the great dark that void and light clashing created them and every thing in the great dark are made up of them and are a result of them, The Ice, and plant life, the Sun all of them are from the effects of there magic (natural)

Light Void Fel and death all exist outside of the great dark in there own realm's and are not part of the great dark and are held out unless certain event's let them cross over(super natural).

[wowrefugee]

So ice is Natural, something from the effects of the elements, Planet life is natural, Something from the effects of Spirit magic on the elements, So the effects of magic are in fact Natural if those things are as they only happen due to the effects of magic.

And no everything being natural/unnatural only applies if we go with your idea that all magic and it's effects are unnatural instead of going with what chronicles say's which is that some magic's are innate to the great dark while others only come into it by bleeding over from different realms.

Chronicles tells us that Elemental, Nature(spirit) and arcane are all part of the great dark that void and light clashing created them and every thing in the great dark are made up of them and are a result of them, The Ice, and plant life, the Sun all of them are from the effects of there magic (natural)

Light Void Fel and death all exist outside of the great dark in there own realm's and are not part of the great dark and are held out unless certain event's let them cross over(super natural).

This has absolutely nothing to do with the topic.

[pacotaco]

Short answer? We don't fucking need them.

Technically, we don't NEED anything from WoW.

[Triceron]

This has absolutely nothing to do with the topic.

You'll find that's the case with 99% of the threads in this forum.

[Alanar]

This has absolutely nothing to do with the topic.

Been like this for a while.. there is nothing to discuss really so this happends. Also in other threads, its kinda normal these days. But I agree.

Anyway, sure I want to stay positive and hope for more, but sadly it seems that slowly some things just end up being something else. Slimesaber and now the music both are linked to other things.

Red eyes for hunter is also kinda meh tbh as the san"layn or darkfallen in general are not just rangers, but also mages, rogues and dk as shown in icc for example and mages specifically mentioned in the book. But the stuff being hidden is the only thing we can hang on at this point which is not much. It just seems weird an allied race would be hidden like this, again we have to wait and see and I would be thrilled if darkfallen happen, but it doesnt seem likely to be fair.

[TheRevenantHero]

So ice is Natural, something from the effects of the elements, Planet life is natural, Something from the effects of Spirit magic on the elements, So the effects of magic are in fact Natural if those things are as they only happen due to the effects of magic.

And no everything being natural/unnatural only applies if we go with your idea that all magic and it's effects are unnatural instead of going with what chronicles say's which is that some magic's are innate to the great dark while others only come into it by bleeding over from different realms.

Chronicles tells us that Elemental, Nature(spirit) and arcane are all part of the great dark that void and light clashing created them and every thing in the great dark are made up of them and are a result of them, The Ice, and plant life, the Sun all of them are from the effects of there magic (natural)

Light Void Fel and death all exist outside of the great dark in there own realm's and are not part of the great dark and are held out unless certain event's let them cross over(super natural).

Dude, he is incapable of admitting when he's wrong. Just ignore him and get back to the topic of the thread.

[Triceron]

Bellular jumped on the speculation train too now

[wowrefugee]

I enjoy all of the major content creators getting on board with the hype/speculation. Puts more pressure on Blizzard to deliver *something* even if the foundation of the speculation is shaky.

[Ielenia]

So ice is Natural, something from the effects of the elements, Planet life is natural, Something from the effects of Spirit magic on the elements, So the effects of magic are in fact Natural if those things are as they only happen due to the effects of magic.

I'll repeat what I said before because you either still don't understand this, or don't want to:
• River flowing downhill: natural.
• River flowing uphill: supernatural.

• Ice melting under the hot summer sun: natural.
• Ice forming under the hot summer sun: supernatural.

• Rain happening outside during a heavy cloudy day: natural.
• Rain happening indoors during an open sky day: unnatural.

Meaning death knights having access to "supernatural cold" only means they have access to ice magic, not that their magic is "not natural".

[Atrea]

Bellular jumped on the speculation train too now

Why do these people always post their videos with their big ugly dumb heads taking up a huge portion of the thumbnail?

Yeesh, I wouldn't do that if I looked like this clown.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

I'll repeat what I said before because you either still don't understand this, or don't want to:
• River flowing downhill: natural.
• River flowing uphill: supernatural.

• Ice melting under the hot summer sun: natural.
• Ice forming under the hot summer sun: supernatural.

• Rain happening outside during a heavy cloudy day: natural.
• Rain happening indoors during an open sky day: unnatural.

Meaning death knights having access to "supernatural cold" only means they have access to ice magic, not that their magic is "not natural".

Your the one who doesn't understand, River's don't exist without magic, Ice doesn't exist without magic, Rain doesn't exist without magic, Same with fire same with plants same with every thing else.

All of theses and all of there functions are brought about by magic in warcraft they literally would not exist without the native magic's of the great dark.

[Ielenia]

Your the one who doesn't understand, River's don't exist without magic, Ice doesn't exist without magic, Rain doesn't exist without magic, Same with fire same with plants same with every thing else.

All of theses and all of there functions are brought about by magic in warcraft they literally would not exist without the native magic's of the great dark.

Then every single little thing in the Warcraft franchise is "natural" meaning Blizzard "objectively lied" when they said the death knights are imbued with "supernatural cold" because there is no such thing as "supernatural" since you say "everything is magic" and "magic is natural".

No. You're wrong.

Rivers can and do exist without magic. So does rain. Rain does not need magic to happen naturally. Fire does not need magic to happen naturally.

By your logic, you can not only kill but completely erase someone out of existence by casting "dispel magic" on them.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Then every single little thing in the Warcraft franchise is "natural" meaning Blizzard "objectively lied" when they said the death knights are imbued with "supernatural cold" because there is no such thing as "supernatural" since you say "everything is magic" and "magic is natural".

No. You're wrong.

Rivers can and do exist without magic. So does rain. Rain does not need magic to happen naturally. Fire does not need magic to happen naturally.

By your logic, you can not only kill but completely erase someone out of existence by casting "dispel magic" on them.

Yes Blizzard "objectively lied" Because they don't agree with you because only you can be right any one who doesn't agree with you are wrong or if they are the arbitor of a universe they are just "objectively lying" to hide the truth of your rightness.

It's not like they made a book which lays out the role of magic in creating every thing, which magics are Innate to which realm's and which are not, said book wouldn't cover how the elements make up every thing in the great dark or how all life is bound by Spirit. Alas if only such a book existed preferably something with a catchy name that Started with C or something.

[username993720]

clicked around the various citations, Necromancy does have frost/the chill of death.

Death Coil - not a Frost spell.

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/The...c_-_Necromancy

Rather you want to say it comes from the shadowlands or not it does come form necromancy.

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Necromancer

I wouldn’t say they do both have those properties. Fel drains life to create more Fel which destroys the life utterly, death corrupts life and changes twisting it but not destroying it. Neither of these are any thing touch of the grave by the way.

For more info about how Fel and death you should read chronicles where they go over them both and all other magic

Then, you're not familiar with Drain Life, Siphon Life or Phantom Singularity, which drain the life of the enemy, dealing damage and healing the caster.

This is not Mana Tap. The draining of magic sources for more magic (mana). This is clearly for the purpose of draining the vitality out of someone to rejuvenate oneself - a clear necromantic characteristic.

they are necromancers in the same way sunwalkers are paladins, they fall into a same group but a necromancer is the Azeroth way of doing things while Necrolyte’s are the orc way of doing it.

And what differentiates them from priest or Nat is that Nat looked into there teachings but didn’t just copy them she added the void into the mix instead of just sticking with death magic.

Huh? They're the Orcs' version of Necromancers? Orcs didn't have Necromancers? You do realize Necromancers on Azeroth appeared way after the Orcs came into Azeroth, right? What's Azerothian about Necromancers? You mean Scourge? Because the origin of Necromancers in in Maldraxxus.

that’s kinda what happens when we are interpreting sparse lore, we both do so in different ways and come to different conclusions.

The only difference what the two of us are doing is that I’m cross referencing the sparse lore with other instances of similar things happening and the following effects (see pit lord on path of glory), while your not.

What's with the PitLord on the path of Glory?
You're just claiming my examples are the exception instead of the rule.

It could be. Blizzard even describes them so in the WC3 manual after all.

They describe almost every unit that way (see: Beastmaster, Demon Hunter, etc...)

Like having both Night Warrior as a customization and a new class.

Night elves had a blindfold face option since vanilla. Did it prevent the Demon Hunter from being added?

Which has what to do with 11.0?

Hinting.
Haven't you seen my cinematics analysis thread?

Because none of them followed Arthas or Illidan, while your theory is Sylvanas still leads these new Dark Rangers and created them after her redemption.

This is how you are explaining it. I asked you how it would work, and this is what you've presented so far.

None of them? You follow Arthas until you break free when you create a Death Knight.
You follow Illidan all the way through. He's still the Illidari leader and you're still part of it.

I don't know what you're on about, really....

And we don't have playable Dreadlords do we?

How is this relevant?

What implies they have a choice? They are supernatural beings animated by necromancy. You expect them to start using Druidism or something?

So, why are you expecting the same for Dark Rangers?
Demon Hunters have a choice. Do you see them getting Lightforged because they're good guys now?

The entire theme of Banshee and Torment is based on Sylvanas' own torment. It is an expression of her character. That is what makes Dark Ranger more unique and different than Death Knights or Demon Hunters, who are effectively sourcing borrowed power; DKs through channeled runeblades and DH through their fel-powered souls. Dark Rangers who use Banshee powers were literally explained as Banshees who reclaimed their bodies. That can't really happen with the NE in the maw. They have no bodies.. They burned with Teldrassil. Those warriors which we knew who died fighting were already raised by Sylvanas, and to our knowledge, not as Banshees reclaiming their bodies.

So the origin of what you want represented and what you're explaining in your theory are conflicting. It makes no sense. So are you going to make sense of it?

First of all, i already gave you the Nathanos example, whose body turned to ash once he replaced it with that of his uncle.

Second of all, not all Dark Rangers would be Night elves. We're expecting High\Blood elves as well. And, if possible, other races such a Humans and Forsaken. These will have nothing to do with the Burning of Teldrassil, but other causes of Death. You think they really give a deep thought on where Death Knight bodies come from? No. They just said a race encountered the Scourge, died, and was raised into a Death Knight. So, why are you giving so much thought into the process?

I am open to the possibility. It simply remains a very low one that has no compelling, realistic theory to how it would happen.

I remain open to the possibility of Bards and Runemasters. How they get added is anyone's guess too, right? And I don't expect them to be their own standalone classes. If someone started arguing that Bards and Runemasters should be playable classes, I would then ask how they actually think a new class would be realistically plausible, as I asked you here.

So far you've provided nothing realistically worth discussing. Nothing actually makes sense in regards to what you actually want.

We're currently talking Dark Rangers. Not other classes.
And you still haven't answered if the way other dark, Hero classes were added is okay with you in terms of Dark Ranger addition.

Right now it's Mawsworn Kyrians raising NE from the maw to follow Sylvanas and all become Dark Wardens and Dark Rangers under her command. I mean, how realistic would this happen? I get Danuser is a massive Sylvanas simp, but even this is a stretch.

These are options. You really take it too seriously, like i'm responsible for writing this story and like Blizzard isn't coming with new things and ways every single expansion.

If not the Mawsworn, then Sylvanas. Or any other powerful being with Necromancy powers.
It can literally be any corpse. Maw Night elves are not the only option.
Why wouldn't it happen? Didn't Arthas raise new Death Knights? Didn't Bolvar? Didn't Illidan train new Demon Hunters? What makes this case so incredibly different?

[Sarkli83]

Because they are waiting for the next patch... Shhh don't spoil it for everyone

[Ielenia]

Yes Blizzard "objectively lied" Because they don't agree with you because only you can be right any one who doesn't agree with you are wrong or if they are the arbitor of a universe they are just "objectively lying" to hide the truth of your rightness.

It's not like they made a book which lays out the role of magic in creating every thing, which magics are Innate to which realm's and which are not, said book wouldn't cover how the elements make up every thing in the great dark or how all life is bound by Spirit. Alas if only such a book existed preferably something with a catchy name that Started with C or something.

Dude, you're the one saying "nothing is supernatural because magic is natural". So when Blizzard says something supernatural exists, either they're wrong, or you're wrong. Guess what which one of the two is more likely to be wrong in that case? Here's a hint: it's not Blizzard.

The origin of the Warcraft universe doesn't matter one iota here. It doesn't matter at all if the whole universe was created through magic. Because Because we're talking about natural processes right now. And the effects of magic are simply not natural, and I gave several examples of that. Examples you keep trying to brush under the rug.

But for you, apparently all a farmer has to do to seed his field is say 'abracadabra' and he'd immediately have his fields ready for harvest. All a mason has to do to build a new house is to say 'alakazam' and a house is built in a second. All a blacksmith has to do to forget a new piece of armor is to wave a small, thin wooden wand in the air and there's a new piece of armor on the table, no materials required. Apparently.

[Triceron]

They describe almost every unit that way (see: Beastmaster, Demon Hunter, etc...)

Yes, which shows how ambiguous definitions these words are in the lore. You ask ambiguous questions that have no clear definition, what do you expect an answer of?

Night elves had a blindfold face option since vanilla. Did it prevent the Demon Hunter from being added?

No, and neither does having Dark Ranger Hood transmog that is already in the game.

Considering I never said anything prevents anything, I don't see why you even bother asking stupid questions that neither if us agree with. You know where my position is, you just want to project a bullshit argument that you know I am not making.

Hinting.
Haven't you seen my cinematics analysis thread?

Yes. It yielded zero factual prediction in retrospect, and was full of confirmation bias from the beginning.

This is what also led you to falsely believe Night Warrior would be playable, as well as all the Shadowlands races.

None of them? You follow Arthas until you break free when you create a Death Knight.
You follow Illidan all the way through. He's still the Illidari leader and you're still part of it.

Make a consistent theory then. Because DK and DH comparisons just conflict with what you propose.

So, why are you expecting the same for Dark Rangers?
Demon Hunters have a choice. Do you see them getting Lightforged because they're good guys now?

Dark Rangers need a story and setting to fit. Sylvanas novel pretty much solidified them as being the very same Dark Rangers we already know of, who are getting some facetime in 9.2.5.

I have no reason to expect a DH/Illidari style introduction from the past involving Sylvanas. We already have Dark Rangers origins explained.

First of all, i already gave you the Nathanos example, whose body turned to ash once he replaced it with that of his uncle.

A ritual that still required a body, as well as Val'kyr.

Where are the NE in the Maw all going to find new Night Elf bodies? I mean if you want NE Dark Rangers, we already have plenty since BFA. Not sure why you're theorizing it this way even.

You think they really give a deep thought on where Death Knight bodies come from? No. They just said a race encountered the Scourge, died, and was raised into a Death Knight. So, why are you giving so much thought into the process?

The Lich King had the power himself to raise the dead.

Sylvanas does not unless we're talking about the time she had Val'kyr under her service.

We're currently talking Dark Rangers. Not other classes.
And you still haven't answered if the way other dark, Hero classes were added is okay with you in terms of Dark Ranger addition.

Yes I have answered. Multiple times. I can't help it if you ignore my responses when it's convenient for you

Let me ask you - do you think I am saying Dark Rangers are not possible?

If you know my answers, this and the rest should easily be understandsble to you.

Didn't Arthas raise new Death Knights? Didn't Bolvar? Didn't Illidan train new Demon Hunters? What makes this case so incredibly different?

Because Illidan and Arthas had the power to raise and train new DKs and DHs that do what they do.

Sylvanas does not have the power to create or train new Dark Rangers who have Banshee powers and Night Warrior powers as you so desire. That is the difference.

And none of your explanations for how and why new Dark Rangers would be made make much sense. How would any of them satisfy your own concept of a Dark Ranger at all? There aren't even Blood Elf Sylvanas loyalists in the maw in great number.

[Zoreyai]

Dark ranger shouldve been a spec for hunters years ago

[Lorgar Aurelian]

Dude, you're the one saying "nothing is supernatural because magic is natural". So when Blizzard says something supernatural exists, either they're wrong, or you're wrong. Guess what which one of the two is more likely to be wrong in that case? Here's a hint: it's not Blizzard.

No you are the only who one made the claim that either every thing has to be natural or nothing is, I’ve already laid out how blizzard divides the great dark from other realms and how the magics that pervade the great dark are natural to it while the ones in other realms aren’t as laid out in chronicles.

But according to you blizzard is just lying when they explain Warcraft’s existence because there explanation doesn’t agree with you.

- - - Updated - - -

Death Coil - not a Frost spell.

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Necromancer

I don’t know why your linking the necromancer page or citing death coil. said pages uses the ingame book as a reference and the ingame book cites the chill of death as one of the powers necromancy has and that would be where there frost powers come from not arcane.

Then, you're not familiar with Drain Life, Siphon Life or Phantom Singularity, which drain the life of the enemy, dealing damage and healing the caster.

This is not Mana Tap. The draining of magic sources for more magic (mana). This is clearly for the purpose of draining the vitality out of someone to rejuvenate oneself - a clear necromantic characteristic.

warlock drain life’s turns said life into Fel to power spells we have multiple lore examples of this in multiple books, the in game effects of spells doesn’t always line up with with how they actually work in the lore and this is one example we age plenty of lore uses to point to.

Huh? They're the Orcs' version of Necromancers? Orcs didn't have Necromancers? You do realize Necromancers on Azeroth appeared way after the Orcs came into Azeroth, right? What's Azerothian about Necromancers? You mean Scourge? Because the origin of Necromancers in in Maldraxxus.

sign… this is why I used sun walker and paladins as an example. Sun walkers aren’t actually paladins in the lore they use the same power but use it in different ways and have different cultural practices.

On dreanor the study of death magic in the orc society lead to Necrolyte’s, on Azeroth it lead to necromancers, they both use death magic but the cultural differences leads to them approaching it form different ways. The shadowlands necromancers are the same thing they share the name with the one on Azeroth but are totally different in practice and approach again because of the different cultures in the shadowlands lead by the Primus.

So if you were looking to classify them in the same ways the wow classes are they would all fall into necromancers even if each is distinct in there own ways, just like how Prelates sun walkers vindicators ect all fall into paladins even though they aren’t the same and just use the same power source.

I how ever wouldn’t bother going for a class esc designation

Death Coil - not a Frost spell.

https://wowpedia.fandom.com/wiki/Necromancer

I don’t know why your linking the necromancer page or citing death coil. said pages uses the ingame book as a reference and the ingame book cites the chill of death as one of the powers necromancy has and that’s where there frost powers come from not arcane.

Then, you're not familiar with Drain Life, Siphon Life or Phantom Singularity, which drain the life of the enemy, dealing damage and healing the caster.

This is not Mana Tap. The draining of magic sources for more magic (mana). This is clearly for the purpose of draining the vitality out of someone to rejuvenate oneself - a clear necromantic characteristic.

warlock drain life’s turns said life into Fel to power spells we have multiple lore examples of this in multiple books, the in game effects of spells doesn’t always line up with with how they actually work in the lore and this is one example we age plenty of lore uses to point to.

Huh? They're the Orcs' version of Necromancers? Orcs didn't have Necromancers? You do realize Necromancers on Azeroth appeared way after the Orcs came into Azeroth, right? What's Azerothian about Necromancers? You mean Scourge? Because the origin of Necromancers in in Maldraxxus.

sign… this is why I used sun walker and paladins as an example. Sun walkers aren’t actually paladins in the lore they use the same power but use it in different ways and have different cultural practices.

On dreanor the study of death magic in the orc society lead to Necrolyte’s, on Azeroth it lead to necromancers, they both use death magic but approach it from different cultural ways. Same with the shadowlands necromancers although they share a name with the ones on Azeroth there approach is different due to the culture of the shadowlands.

So just like sunwalkers prelates and Norma paladins If you wanted to give them a class esc designation they would fall into necromancer even though they all approach it form different cultures and just use the same powers.

I personally wouldn’t bother with lumping them together though and would just call them Necrolyte’s.

What's with the PitLord on the path of Glory?
You're just claiming my examples are the exception instead of the rule.

The Pitlord on the path of glory dies on thousands of skeletons and none are raised and other pit lords die on body’s and none are raised.

So then the question why did that one Pitlord raise a undead? It’s not something that’s innate to Fel blood as the other Pitlord don’t do the same when they die, it’s not something innate to that one Pitlord and his as he dies again on the broken shore where there are plenty of body’s and none are raised.

So if it’s not something Fel blood does and it’s not that one Pitlords own powers that leaves two options, it’s something to do with Fel on dragons, or it’s something to do with the dead scar which is already full of necromatic energies and is already raising undead all on its own.

[Kiriastrasza]

i voted no, why? because i can.

Tired of seeing mostly elves reskins on both sides on my server.

I feel sorry for people like you who get angry or upset because people play a race they enjoy...

I'm trying to hold my anticipation to a minimum for the pre order bonus's.