Poll: What do you think?

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  1. #801
    Looks like people just want a gargoyle, so that they can complain later than its just a reskinned gargoyle

  2. #802
    Quote Originally Posted by Stormxraven View Post
    Looks like people just want a gargoyle, so that they can complain later than its just a reskinned gargoyle
    No I want a slightly bulkier drackthyr but I guess you guys want them with male draenei proportions so you can blame the people who only wanted them slightly beefier.

  3. #803
    Quote Originally Posted by Syegfryed View Post
    anyone can se it proven anything.
    Glad we agree!

  4. #804
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    You're comparing a cooldown to a permanent form.
    Does not matter.
    Like I said, we'll see soon enough. However, if the race remains on the slender side, the reasons I mentioned account for that decision.
    All we will see is a lack of any changes and improvements and Blizz will just release Dracthyr as they is.
    And the only reason behind it will be them ignoring feedback, just like all the time before. Nothing else behind it.
    Your reasons are not reasons, they are excuses based on unnecessary limitations and artificially created problems.

    There is no need to be an oracle or whatever to see how it will end.

  5. #805
    Quote Originally Posted by Calfredd View Post
    No I want a slightly bulkier drackthyr but I guess you guys want them with male draenei proportions so you can blame the people who only wanted them slightly beefier.
    Yeah first page has multiple options, most of them are only slightly bulkier (Between blood and night elf level of proportions/definition) and only one looks like a gorilla. The rest of the things quoted are not proposals on Dracthyr at all but Draconid art (Either fan or the tons of Draconid art from the TCG and Hearthstone)

  6. #806
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    I would be fine with that too. I simply don't think it's going to happen. I believe that concept goes against what Blizzard wants to do.
    That def. seems to be the case, but it's unfortunate they are leaning to strongly towards only one angle since there's such a huge player-demand for big and imposing.

    For those interested in playing on the frontline as a dragon-man, or just wanting to look big and imposing, it would also make sense to introduce 2 new classes in 1 expansion for the first time. The Evoker as their black/white mage backline class, as well as the berserker/defender frontline class (dragon knight archetype).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Yeah first page has multiple options, most of them are only slightly bulkier (Between blood and night elf level of proportions/definition) and only one looks like a gorilla. The rest of the things quoted are not proposals on Dracthyr at all but Draconid art (Either fan or the tons of Draconid art from the TCG and Hearthstone)
    Let those that want to be gorilla-esque dragonmen be gorilla-esque dragonmen, and let those that want to be salamander-esque dragonmen be salamander-esque dragonmen.
    One option does not exclude the other.

    Blizzard thinks the gecko/salamander dragonman fits the Evoker class, but a big portion of the playerbase wants to be gorilla-esque, and thus Blizzard should give that option aswell, and could even create a new frontline class to fit with the gorilla dragonmen if they wanted to tie that option in more neatly.
    Last edited by Ghanir; 2022-05-12 at 03:14 PM.

  7. #807
    Quote Originally Posted by Ghanir View Post
    Let those that want to be gorilla-esque dragonmen be gorilla-esque dragonmen, and let those that want to be salamander-esque dragonmen be salamander-esque dragonmen.
    One option does not exclude the other.

    Blizzard thinks the gecko/salamander dragonman fits the Evoker class, but a big portion of the playerbase wants to be gorilla-esque, and thus Blizzard should give that option aswell, and could even create a new frontline class to fit with the gorilla dragonmen if they wanted to tie that option in more neatly.
    And honestly, given they are not letting you wear any armor, the base form needs as much customization as it can get.

  8. #808
    They should just make a playable drakonid that can be multiple classes, and leave evoker alone.

    But I realize I'm firmly in the minority being content with how dracthyr look - so, I hope whatever choice Blizzard makes, they find a way to appeal to their broader audience without rushing a new model and leaving us with a messy hack-job like Cataclysm worgen.

  9. #809
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mutineer View Post
    They should just make a playable drakonid that can be multiple classes, and leave evoker alone.

    But I realize I'm firmly in the minority being content with how dracthyr look - so, I hope whatever choice Blizzard makes, they find a way to appeal to their broader audience without rushing a new model and leaving us with a messy hack-job like Cataclysm worgen.
    In another thread "Do you like the Dracthyr" the majority of voters said they like it. So, you're more than likely not in the minority.

  10. #810
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    In another thread "Do you like the Dracthyr" the majority of voters said they like it. So, you're more than likely not in the minority.
    Wasn't that poll asking whether or not people like the "dracthyr evoker?" I know dracthyr and evokers are currently one in the same, but opinions on the race's model itself seems pretty hotly divided to me. I'm sure a decent chunk of voters are interested in the class, but have reservations about the race.

    In this poll, the people who think it's fine make up about 30%, another 16% want dracthyr to be replaced by scaly tauren, and the remaining ~54% think dracthyr need some significant tweaks.

  11. #811
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    And honestly, given they are not letting you wear any armor, the base form needs as much customization as it can get.
    Lots of people like fantasy, and dragons are very prominent within that genre, so giving us more options when they finally let the PC be a dragonman will be welcomed with open arms.

  12. #812
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    In another thread "Do you like the Dracthyr" the majority of voters said they like it. So, you're more than likely not in the minority.
    This is good to hear, As I aswell do not want another Worgen fiasco, hence why I'm hesitant to the change these people want.

    It's like those asking for the Skinny version of the Kultirans and they never got them instead the Kultirans are the fat people.

  13. #813
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mutineer View Post
    Wasn't that poll asking whether or not people like the "dracthyr evoker?" I know dracthyr and evokers are currently one in the same, but opinions on the race's model itself seems pretty hotly divided to me. I'm sure a decent chunk of voters are interested in the class, but have reservations about the race.

    In this poll, the people who think it's fine make up about 30%, another 16% want dracthyr to be replaced by scaly tauren, and the remaining ~54% think dracthyr need some significant tweaks.
    3rd spec options aside I really like the Evoker at a first glance. The race that goes along with it is another discussion.

  14. #814
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    In another thread "Do you like the Dracthyr" the majority of voters said they like it. So, you're more than likely not in the minority.
    It is not a specific question. A lot of people truly like the overall idea of Dracthyr and Evoker. But this poll does not represent what exactly they like, while poll in this thread is mostly about visual stuff.

  15. #815
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    Do note that it is very difficult to pin down every thought every individual person have about any given thing within something as limited and subjective as a person-made poll on a forum. Lots of people could agree with any of the 3 options given in this poll and still feel like it's not quite the right answer because of x, y or z.

  16. #816
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mutineer View Post
    Wasn't that poll asking whether or not people like the "dracthyr evoker?" I know dracthyr and evokers are currently one in the same, but opinions on the race's model itself seems pretty hotly divided to me. I'm sure a decent chunk of voters are interested in the class, but have reservations about the race.

    In this poll, the people who think it's fine make up about 30%, another 16% want dracthyr to be replaced by scaly tauren, and the remaining ~54% think dracthyr need some significant tweaks.
    It’s vague either way. I don’t view the people who like the overall package to be in the minority, because typically the majority are those who are wisely taking a “wait and see” approach. In addition, once the Evoker gets play-tested by people outside the developer circle, the overall opinion is going to improve dramatically.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyrexia View Post
    This is good to hear, As I aswell do not want another Worgen fiasco, hence why I'm hesitant to the change these people want.

    It's like those asking for the Skinny version of the Kultirans and they never got them instead the Kultirans are the fat people.
    Yeah, I wouldn’t worry too much about it. Blizzard has a very specific design goal in mind. They’re not going to radically change it because of a mob who hasn’t even played it yet. See what happened with Pandaren for example. Despite the loud outcry, Blizzard pretty much stuck to their guns.

  17. #817
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyrexia View Post
    This is good to hear, As I aswell do not want another Worgen fiasco, hence why I'm hesitant to the change these people want.

    It's like those asking for the Skinny version of the Kultirans and they never got them instead the Kultirans are the fat people.
    The thread Teriz is referring to polls if people liked the EVOKER class, not necessarily the race itself (I know I voted yes because I do like the class but I do not like the current rendition of Dracthyr for example)

    Teriz does that, tweaking factoids a lil' bit and presenting his opinions as facts themselves.

  18. #818
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gigantique View Post
    The thread Teriz is referring to polls if people liked the EVOKER class, not necessarily the race itself (I know I voted yes because I do like the class but I do not like the current rendition of Dracthyr for example)

    Teriz does that, tweaking factoids a lil' bit and presenting his opinions as facts themselves.
    Dracthyr and Evoker are one in the same. Ion said as much.

  19. #819
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    See what happened with Pandaren for example. Despite the loud outcry, Blizzard pretty much stuck to their guns.
    See also: Kul Tiran humans and mechagnomes, but all three examples were from the era of, "You think you do, but you don't." Lately, Blizzard is playing at listening to player reception and being more nimble in responding to concerns, so it remains to be seen if that will extend to altering their art direction.

    Does anyone reading this have any familiarity with the challenges behind altering a model's proportions? Can they use the same animations or would they have to adjust those to match the new body shape? How difficult is it to tweak animations if they do have to adjust them?

    Again, my biggest interest is in avoiding another Cataclysm. Completely revamping the whole design of something they've been working on for years, and shipping it in a matter of months, has to be a pretty significant undertaking, right? Whether or not you like the design, there's a lot of attention to detail in the dracthyr animations we've seen - even down to animating individual toes in their dance.

    Cataclysm's pre-release worgen were a lot more expressive than the models they ultimately shipped, who were forced into permanently scowling at everything no matter what they were doing, and had a lot of odd bugs that only really got resolved years later, or only when they got an entirely new model altogether.

  20. #820
    Quote Originally Posted by Mutineer View Post
    See also: Kul Tiran humans and mechagnomes, but all three examples were from the era of, "You think you do, but you don't." Lately, Blizzard is playing at listening to player reception and being more nimble in responding to concerns, so it remains to be seen if that will extend to altering their art direction.

    Does anyone reading this have any familiarity with the challenges behind altering a model's proportions? Can they use the same animations or would they have to adjust those to match the new body shape? How difficult is it to tweak animations if they do have to adjust them?

    Again, my biggest interest is in avoiding another Cataclysm. Completely revamping the whole design of something they've been working on for years, and shipping it in a matter of months, has to be a pretty significant undertaking, right? Whether or not you like the design, there's a lot of attention to detail in the dracthyr animations we've seen - even down to animating individual toes in their dance.

    Cataclysm's pre-release worgen were a lot more expressive than the models they ultimately shipped, who were forced into permanently scowling at everything no matter what they were doing, and had a lot of odd bugs that only really got resolved years later, or only when they got an entirely new model altogether.
    I would say it's both easier than you'd think but more work than you'd expect. If the base is strong enough you can alter it pretty well by just dragging or changing variables in the model making software, but I'm more familiar with say, Skyrim or Oblivion than I am WoW's engine. For all I know, you could move a vector by .5 and it freaks an animation out so badly that the dracthyr's arm suddenly turns into its leg.

    Though I agree dodging the issue with Worgen is partially why I'm content with what we have, I would rather have a race that looks good even if it's not what was envisioned (I would have been fine with ultra beefy drakonid), than have a rush-job redo based on feedback that might or might not be the vocal minority that ends up making it look like hot garbage for 8+ years.

    They said we'd be getting a post with Dracthyr model stuff soon nearly 2 weeks ago, part of me wonders if they might not be adding bulkier body shapes based on the initial feedback here and elsewhere. All I can hope for with that is that they keep it as a choice, instead of making them buff at the expense of giving us the option for skinny, because options are better than forcing choices.

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