Poll: What do you think?

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  1. #901
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Supertoster View Post
    You keep changing topics on the fly and keep answering to wrong parts.
    I said that Dracthyr and Evoker are one in the same. You said that was false and "not the way it worked", and I pointed out that my viewpoint came from Ion.

    Where did the topic change?

    Sorry, but at this point we can all agree that your comments are pointless and there is no reason to argue with you cuz of your delusional state.
    Wouldn't a more delusional state be your position, where you ignore everything the developer has been saying about this concept and inserting your own opinions instead?

    Not realizing that Dracthyr and Evoker are one in the same being one such example.

  2. #902
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    If you honestly believe that “have issues” is the same as “dislike”, I don’t know what to tell you. Clearly you didn’t think it meant the same thing, since you voted for “yes, I LIKE the Dracthyr Evoker!” in the poll.
    I would on a general basis advise against trying to be the arbiter of what other posters mean or think, especially when they're there to set the record straight. You already do a good job of coming off as someone to not take seriously, no need to overkill it.

    And having a vocabulary means you can use different words and apply the same meaning behind them.

    Like how I can describe your posts as generally hogwash, nonsense or bull and have the same meaning.

  3. #903
    The Patient Supertoster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    I said that Dracthyr and Evoker are one in the same. You said that was false and "not the way it worked"
    False, you are just lying.
    I said that it does not matter if Dracthyr and Evoler are one in the same because people still can by all means judge them separately. And this is obvious, some people like one, but dislike another.
    This is people's opinion and for them it does not matter what Ion or whatever dev has been saying. People don't care about reasoning behind design. People don't care about excuses. People don't care about how devs call things.
    The only thing people care about is an end result which those people see with their eyes. You can repeat your idiotic mantra about "but Ion said that Dracthyr and Evoker are one thing" for thousands of times, but it will not change the fact that some people may like Dracthyr and dislike Evoker, or like Evoker and dislike Dracthyr.
    If you can't understand such elementary and obvious thing then there are some problems with your intellectual capabilities and you are clearly delusional.

  4. #904
    When Dracthyr inevitably get more classes, how neat would it be if all projectile casts shoot out of their mouths.

    Where it makes sense of course.

    Not asking for drac pallies to have judgment breath

  5. #905
    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    When Dracthyr inevitably get more classes, how neat would it be if all projectile casts shoot out of their mouths.

    Where it makes sense of course.

    Not asking for drac pallies to have judgment breath
    I've always wished that there was an option for casters to cast spells through their weapon.

  6. #906
    This might be asking for too much but....

    How neat would it be if dracthyr mogs would be separated by form.

    Since drac form will only show shoulders, belt and tabard, perhaps those pieces don't look without the rest of the mog the visage form has.

    So if the drac mog was separated we could make a mog for just those 3 slots and weapon, while the visage form has its own mog.

  7. #907
    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    This might be asking for too much but....

    How neat would it be if dracthyr mogs would be separated by form.

    Since drac form will only show shoulders, belt and tabard, perhaps those pieces don't look without the rest of the mog the visage form has.

    So if the drac mog was separated we could make a mog for just those 3 slots and weapon, while the visage form has its own mog.
    That'd be really nice, and I honestly wish it was already the case for worgen, at least optionally.

  8. #908
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    When Dracthyr inevitably get more classes….
    LoL! There’s nothing inevitable about that.

  9. #909
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    LoL! There’s nothing inevitable about that.



    Well blizz said it themselves in an interview.

    I can't imagine there wouldn't be an drac who would become interested in mortal classes after engaging in horde and alliance affairs for years to come.

    It only make sense.

    Maybe lore wise some drac are evoker runts and pursue the ways of the sword.

    I mean they even stated they don't want your race to limit what you play as and used that as justification for all races for mage rogue and priests, though some combos will be harder than others.

    They can't say that and have dracthyr be one class races forever....
    Last edited by Varx; 2022-05-16 at 09:45 PM.

  10. #910
    High Overlord Ghanir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    Well blizz said it themselves in an interview.

    I can't imagine there wouldn't be an drac who would become interested in mortal classes after engaging in horde and alliance affairs for years to come.

    It only make sense.

    Maybe lore wise some drac are evoker runts and pursue the ways of the sword.

    I mean they even stated they don't want your race to limit what you play as and used that as justification for all races for mage rogue and priests, though some combos will be harder than others.

    They can't say that and have dracthyr be one class races forever....
    They kinda can open up more options for the vanilla, and/or older races, to get more class options while keeping the newer ones restricted.
    There's no point in them saying that all races will get access to warrior, rogue, mage and priest while not giving it to the Dracthyr unless they were referring to all as in all the older races.
    At least for now that seems to be the case. As I can imagine any corporation will cave in to player feedback if it's large enough.
    Last edited by Ghanir; 2022-05-16 at 10:03 PM.

  11. #911
    Quote Originally Posted by Ghanir View Post
    They kinda can open up more options for the vanilla, and/or older races, to get more class options while keeping the newer ones restricted.
    There's no point in them saying that all races will get access to warrior, rogue, mage and priest while not giving it to the Dracthyr unless they were referring to all as in all the older races.
    Yeah, but regardless it has to happen as lore progression anyway.

    Like how can someone think that some dracthyr won't want to pursue mortal classes after joining the horde and alliance and being involved in their affairs.

    It's only natural.

  12. #912
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    Well blizz said it themselves in an interview.

    I can't imagine there wouldn't be an drac who would become interested in mortal classes after engaging in horde and alliance affairs for years to come.

    It only make sense.

    Maybe lore wise some drac are evoker runts and pursue the ways of the sword.

    I mean they even stated they don't want your race to limit what you play as and used that as justification for all races for mage rogue and priests, though some combos will be harder than others.

    They can't say that and have dracthyr be one class races forever....
    That’s just Blizzard blowing smoke up our butts. There’s some pretty significant technical reasons why Dracthyr could never be other classes. Namely their inability to wear armor or equip weapons in dragon form.

    Also it makes zero sense lorewise. The Dracthyr don’t choose to be Evokers, they ARE Evokers. It’s not a job they choose. If they pick up a sword and wear plate armor, they still have the ability to fly around and use magical breath abilities. Wrathion training to be a Rogue wouldn’t change the fact that Wrathion is still a fire-breathing dragon.
    Last edited by Teriz; 2022-05-16 at 10:10 PM.

  13. #913
    High Overlord Ghanir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    Yeah, but regardless it has to happen as lore progression anyway.

    Like how can someone think that some dracthyr won't want to pursue mortal classes after joining the horde and alliance and being involved in their affairs.

    It's only natural.
    If any mortal warfare tactics seem inferior to the abilities the Dracthyr possesses then I don't see any particular reason for why they would choose to degrade themselves to such. If they were locked in their mortal vestiges, sure. But since they can transform and breathe fire then not particularly, no.

  14. #914
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    That’s just Blizzard blowing smoke up our butts. There’s some pretty significant technical reasons why Dracthyr could never be other classes. Namely their inability to wear armor or equip weapons in dragon form.

    Also it makes zero sense lorewise. The Dracthyr don’t choose to be Evokers, they ARE Evokers. It’s not a job they choose. If they pick up a sword and wear plate armor, they still have the ability to fly around and use magical breath abilities.
    I mean if it's the word of god you can't just claim their straight up lying.

    Also why would they give them racial abilities if you think evokers are just one huge OP assortment of racial.

    And again some could be runts, you never know. Or maybe they choose to forgo their evoker abilities to learn the ways of the arcane, shamanism, druidism, etc.

    And they're lack of armor doesn't mean anything.

    Blizz said they're thinking of allowing combat in visage form and no armor in dragon form doesn't mean anything, I mean look at druids.

    And who says they can't equip weapons? Or course they can. Blizz even said evoker weapons are everything shaman can use plus swords.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Ghanir View Post
    If any mortal warfare tactics seem inferior to the abilities the Dracthyr possesses then I don't see any particular reason for why they would choose to degrade themselves to such. If they were locked in their mortal vestiges, sure. But since they can transform and breathe fire then not particularly, no.
    You make it seem like evoker are gods. There is no proof that an evoker is any more powerful than a seasoned warlock, or mage.

    Or again, maybe a drac could be a evoker runt and wants to pursue an alt path.

    Or maybe melee combat fascinates them, who knows. They're not a hive mind.

  15. #915
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    I mean if it's the word of god you can't just claim their straight up lying.
    Except they never said they’re definitely doing it, they said they’re “looking into it”, which means in the process of “looking into it”, they will easily reach a decision not to do it.

    Also why would they give them racial abilities if you think evokers are just one huge OP assortment of racial.
    To make them feel like an actual race.

    And again some could be runts, you never know. Or maybe they choose to forgo their evoker abilities to learn the ways of the arcane, shamanism, druidism, etc.
    Which makes no sense, because Evoker is what they are. You might as well say a human cuts off their arms and legs to learn how to be a jellyfish.

    And they're lack of armor doesn't mean anything.

    Blizz said they're thinking of allowing combat in visage form and no armor in dragon form doesn't mean anything, I mean look at druids.
    Yeah, the difference is that the Bear, Cat, and Moonkin form are the class abilities, not the race. It’s why Worgen wear armor and gear in wolf form. You need armor and weapons for all classes except Druids wear your weapons and armor are replaced by the animal form.

    And who says they can't equip weapons? Or course they can. Blizz even said evoker weapons are everything shaman can use plus swords.
    They can equip weapons, but you can’t see the weapons in dragon form. Just like Wrathion doesn’t have a gigantic sword hanging from his side when he turns into a dragon.

  16. #916
    Quote Originally Posted by Supertoster View Post
    Totally agree. But there is a problem: no matter what people say, rig or animation - they are both right, because Blizz usullly reuse both of them. There are tons of models in the game with the same rig as well as exactly the same animations. For sake of convenience, lets call it as "base".
    For example, a lot of elementals reuse voidwalker base. Slim Kul-Tirans reuse female undead base. Vulperas reuse goblin base. Dark Iron Dwarfs, Lightforged, Void Elves and Maghar are literally just reskins.

    It is sad not only because it looks lazy. It is sad because previously it was different. In the past, Blizz actually created new models with new rigs, skeletons and animations for new races.
    You mean in the days when they didn't even make females for new races?
    The most difficult thing to do is accept that there is nothing wrong with things you don't like and accept that people can like things you don't.

  17. #917
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Except they never said they’re definitely doing it, they said they’re “looking into it”, which means in the process of “looking into it”, they will easily reach a decision not to do it.



    To make them feel like an actual race.



    Which makes no sense, because Evoker is what they are. You might as well say a human cuts off their arms and legs to learn how to be a jellyfish.



    Yeah, the difference is that the Bear, Cat, and Moonkin form are the class abilities, not the race. It’s why Worgen wear armor and gear in wolf form. You need armor and weapons for all classes except Druids wear your weapons and armor are replaced by the animal form.



    They can equip weapons, but you can’t see the weapons in dragon form. Just like Wrathion doesn’t have a gigantic sword hanging from his side when he turns into a dragon.
    I mean when they're trying to make races not be as limited to class choices as possible I doubt they wouldn't include dracthyrs in that. Either you do or you don't.


    Dracthyr are dracthyr. Evokers are just them channeling their natural chromatic abilities further. Like monks use their abilities to further use their natural limbs lol.

    Think of it like a lightforge. They're beings of light, yet not all of them are paladins or priests. Same concept can be applied to dracthyrs.

    The point is you don't need visible armor to function in combat.

    Wrathion isn't a dracthyr and he isn't a bipedal creature, unlike dracs, who have more use of arms and weapons than a typical dragon would. I promise you drac will have melee weapon animations.

    As for sheathing animations for two handers. Maybe they could use draconic magic to materialize them from thin air. Like a keyblade lmao.
    Last edited by Varx; 2022-05-16 at 10:44 PM.

  18. #918
    Over 9000! Kithelle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Au-burn View Post
    Prolly I shouldn't but I genuinely can't believe someone in art department approved of this soystain. WTF.
    Luckily for us the Blizzard art department doesn't have a muscled dragon man kink..
    #WithoutRespectWeReject

  19. #919
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    I mean when they're trying to make races not be as limited to class choices as possible I doubt they wouldn't include dracthyrs in that. Either you do or you don't.
    They're expanding the races to more classes in 10.0. The Dracthyr is entering during that expansion, and they're not a part of it. Blizzard is explicitly advertising the fact that the Dracthyr Evoker is WoW's first race/class combination. They're a feature, and it's doubtful that Blizzard would ever unravel that feature.


    Dracthyr are dracthyr. Evokers are just them channeling their natural chromatic abilities further. Like monks use their abilities to further use their natural limbs lol.
    Incorrect. Ion said specifically that Dracthyr are Evokers and Evokers are Dracthyr in the deep dive video.


    The point is you don't need visible armor to function in combat.

    Wrathion isn't a dracthyr and he isn't a bipedal creature, unlike dracs, who have more use of arms and weapons than a typical dragon would. I promise you drac will have melee weapon animations.
    Dracthyr are dragons in playable form, so all the rules that apply to dragons also apply to the Dracthyr. Further, Ion made it clear that Dracthyr are designed not to be melee fighters, which is why they have the bodies that they have. You're not going to be seeing visible weapons on them outside of Visage form.

    Like I said, Blizzard is blowing smoke up your butt. Making Dracthyr available to other classes goes against their clear design goals.

  20. #920
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    They're expanding the races to more classes in 10.0. The Dracthyr is entering during that expansion, and they're not a part of it. Blizzard is explicitly advertising the fact that the Dracthyr Evoker is WoW's first race/class combination. They're a feature, and it's doubtful that Blizzard would ever unravel that feature.




    Incorrect. Ion said specifically that Dracthyr are Evokers and Evokers are Dracthyr in the deep dive video.




    Dracthyr are dragons in playable form, so all the rules that apply to dragons also apply to the Dracthyr. Further, Ion made it clear that Dracthyr are designed not to be melee fighters, which is why they have the bodies that they have. You're not going to be seeing visible weapons on them outside of Visage form.

    Like I said, Blizzard is blowing smoke up your butt. Making Dracthyr available to other classes goes against their clear design goals.
    I don't expect dracthyr to get additional classes at launch but in future expansions, earliest would be the final 10.x patch.

    At that point the dracthyr would be situated enough to want to learn new ways of combat.

    I wouldn't call it a feature. It's just a highly specialized class for a new race. Yeah it makes sense that lore wise dracthyr are all evokers. But it also makes sense for some dracthyr to want to learn how to be a war going forward after fighting alongside orcs and humans.

    Blizz is no stranger to saying no. If they don't want them to be other classes then they'd say so. And even if they do enough fan feedback would change their mind. I mean look at cross factions and (h)velves.

    Well yeah when you can only be one class and that one class can be only played by you then yeah that logic applies, for the moment.

    But as long as a lightforge draenie can be a warrior over a paladin or priest then it make sense for a drac to be a war over an evoker.

    What? No man, dracthyr are not your average dragon so no not all rules apply. Wrathion can't hold a weapon same way a drac can because he's not bipedal.

    And its evokers are not meant to be melee fighters, not dracthyr. You wanna go by all rules apply then you should know just how well adapted dragons are to melee combat.

    If gnomes and walking corpses can be wars then a drac would have zero problems.
    Last edited by Varx; 2022-05-16 at 11:16 PM.

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