ONLY 4 new dungeons for M+ initially

[kaminaris]

?????????????

Do you not see the contradiction here? Seriously is this just blowing over your head?

No, because im pretty advanced in mathematics and statistics.

[Alroxas]

no . you are missing the point - just like almost all people here miss it.

blizzard is multi billion $ company .

instead fighting for how to split it players should openly demand

8 new dragonflught dungeons first seaosn

8 new dragonflight dungeons 2nd season

and maaaybe maybe 3rd season could be some combo of season 1 and 2 dungeons and old ones.

why do you people settle for less ?

A multi-billion company does not mean they can make whatever they want. The company is beholden to shareholders to make a profit. Also dungeon design is not something you can just Thanos snap into existence.

Additionally, sure let's say that Blizzard could make 16 total new dungeons... But it would take them double the time, are you willing to wait? More specifically are you willing to pay a sub fee each month while you continue to wait?

It's probably a calculation by Blizzard that if they want to hit a specific quarter release timeframe, they only have enough resources to do X amount of work. So what is X? How is X divided up into dungeons, raids, environment design, story/quest lines, etc etc.

And considering the brain drain that's been happening at Blizzard, I think we would be lucky to see DF released in the first half of 2023.

[crusadernero]

Entry curve is pretty much the same, old dungeons are known, routes can be downloaded and prepared in advance. For anyone that even remotely plays M+ seriously, jumping at any time, getting KSM would be zero issue, regardless of how big pool would be.

So, then in effect - it doesnt matter what Blizzard does with m+. Cause serious m+ players already got it mapped out long before anyway.

You havent said whats wrong about m+ in SL yet either. You only mentioned other things.

[Khaza-R]

Entry curve is pretty much the same, old dungeons are known, routes can be downloaded and prepared in advance. For anyone that even remotely plays M+ seriously, jumping at any time, getting KSM would be zero issue, regardless of how big pool would be.

I mean, high level players always adapt faster than the regular player. But I doubt that's who the change is kept in mind for.

[kaminaris]

So, then in effect - it doesnt matter what Blizzard does with m+. Cause serious m+ players already got it mapped out long before anyway.

You havent said whats wrong about m+ in SL yet either. You only mentioned other things.

It absolutely does, the whole process would be a lot less boring.

And I already said what went wrong. Entire change to itemization turned M+ dungeons into "earn your entry lottery ticket" checklist.

And now on top of terrible weekly bingo, i would have half of dungeons that i ran multiple times (its pretty absurd how many times i did all wow dunegons, leveled every class on pure dungeons).

[crusadernero]

It absolutely does, the whole process would be a lot less boring.

And I already said what went wrong. Entire change to itemization turned M+ dungeons into "earn your entry lottery ticket" checklist.

The lottery ticket like TF & WF?

[kaminaris]

The lottery ticket like TF & WF?

Nope, TF did not constrict the attempts, you could try as much times as you liked.

[crusadernero]

Nope, TF did not constrict the attempts, you could try as much times as you liked.

So playing the lottery without limitations

[kaminaris]

So playing the lottery without limitations

So like this game always worked, just with more items. TF was nothing more than having 3x as many items in dungeon loot pool.


Instead with weekly bingo, doing timegated checklist to earn bingo lottery. There is a fundamental difference between dropping items from content vs dropping content from magical weekly box.

[Rayr]

I have this bookmarked: https://philosophy.stackexchange.com...t-like-it-move
in case of terrible arguments like this.

What’s funny is the thing you linked isn’t even applicable. It’s about literally leaving an area if you don’t like something about it, when the reason this is a bad argument is because there’s reasons to stay you just dislike something about it.

This is different. This is a video game that you are going out of your way to discuss when you have ALREADY decided that you are quitting. You aren’t living on this forum, you aren’t living in the wow universe. You are choosing to come here and discuss something you just told everyone that you have no intentions of playing.

I find it hilarious that the people who are arguing against this thing are so clueless and uneducated.

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No, because im pretty advanced in mathematics and statistics.

Now that’s a good one lol

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So like this game always worked, just with more items. TF was nothing more than having 3x as many items in dungeon loot pool.


Instead with weekly bingo, doing timegated checklist to earn bingo lottery. There is a fundamental difference between dropping items from content vs dropping content from magical weekly box.

What about when that content is locked to only being completed once a week? What’s the difference then?

[crusadernero]

So like this game always worked, just with more items. TF was nothing more than having 3x as many items in dungeon loot pool.


Instead with weekly bingo, doing timegated checklist to earn bingo lottery. There is a fundamental difference between dropping items from content vs dropping content from magical weekly box.

Now I get it; you used to do the math & statistics on how many run you and your friends had to do to get TF proccs. Now you cant. THats what annoys you. You cant farm the same dungeon 5000 times to force the loot to you.

Its not really about m+ at all. Its just about how gear is obtained. Fair enough, but thats not what you have talked about much. It was m+ itself you disliked.

[kaminaris]

What’s funny is the thing you linked isn’t even applicable. It’s about literally leaving an area if you don’t like something about it, when the reason this is a bad argument is because there’s reasons to stay you just dislike something about it.

This is different. This is a video game that you are going out of your way to discuss when you have ALREADY decided that you are quitting. You aren’t living on this forum, you aren’t living in the wow universe. You are choosing to come here and discuss something you just told everyone that you have no intentions of playing.

I find it hilarious that the people who are arguing against this thing are so clueless and uneducated.

Of course its is applicable, if you don't like me arguing against terrible system you can leave this thread.
Also funny you mention education, kinda ironic.

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Now I get it; you used to do the math & statistics on how many run you and your friends had to do to get TF proccs. Now you cant. THats what annoys you. You cant farm the same dungeon 5000 times to force the loot to you.

Its not really about m+ at all. Its just about how gear is obtained. Fair enough, but thats not what you have talked about much. It was m+ itself you disliked.

I didn't. I did not chase TFs, I simply ran plenty of M+ and enjoyed gettin upgrades from time to time.

Now its a checklist and even worse RNG as in: if it fucks me, i can't do shit about it. While guildmates gettin weapon in first weekly bingo, i get braces 3 times in a row.

And again, read my posts fully because you clearly don't. I do enjoy M+ BUT i do not enjoy running same dungeon 3x per week, even worse when the pool of dungeons is half of dungeons i ran multiple times, it will be only SLIGHTLY different experience as skin stays and M+ template is applied.

[Rayr]

Of course its is applicable, if you don't like me arguing against terrible system you can leave this thread.
Also funny you mention education, kinda ironic.

I literally just explained to you word for word why it isn’t. Those two aren’t comparable. Just saying they are doesn’t magically make it so.

[Lolites]

I literally just explained to you word for word why it isn’t. Those two aren’t comparable. Just saying they are doesn’t magically make it so.

you are wasting your time, dont you know you should never argue with lunatics?

[Finlandia WOAT]

Its not going to help, you have 8 dungeons in pool, with 4 of them people did 100 times already (yes at easier level but still).

The only way to alleviate that is to expand M+ dungeon pool. No other pseudo solution (that is literally cash grab) is going to work.

How many players in the current player base have run every wrath-wod dungeon 100 times as current content, to such an extent that the suggestion of doing the Nexus or Deepholm or Stormstout Brewery as M+ for a season is a breaking point?

Safe bet its small to the point of irrelevance. The people in this thread seem like they're digging their heels in and arguing for the sake of arguing more than they actually have a strong point. And some of us (like me) are intrigued at running old dungeons as M+.

The tradeoff is worth it. I'd much rather have a rotation and wait on the 4 out dungeons than have the same 8 dungeons for 2 years.

16 dungeons?? 8 added in the second patch?? WoW has never done that many. The most added over the course of an expansion is 4 over the course of Wrath (3 of which were in the ICC patch, spiritually the final patch of WoW's initial story). And since you're so against re-using old dungeons, you're advocating adding 16 dungeons that will then never be used again lest Blizz get accused of lazily rehashing old content.

If this becomes the norm, it incentivizes Blizz to invest more in dungeons, since they're now permanent fixtures of the game rather than expac specific content.

[kaminaris]

I literally just explained to you word for word why it isn’t. Those two aren’t comparable. Just saying they aren’t doesn’t magically make it so.

You clearly forgot what you wrote:

Why are you even here if you already made your decision then? If you already made your decision not to play, then just don’t play. Your reasons are silly enough to the point to where I’m not buying what you’re saying for a second lol.

I am here to give a feedback about terrible system, and according to your terrible argument, this option is non existent, thus the link I posted is absolutely applicable. You are tying to imply i should "move".

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How many players in the current player base have run every wrath-wod dungeon 100 times as current content, to such an extent that the suggestion of doing the Nexus or Deepholm or Stormstout Brewery as M+ for a season is a breaking point?

Safe bet its small to the point of irrelevance. The people in this thread seem like they're digging their heels in and arguing for the sake of arguing more than they actually have a strong point. And some of us (like me) are intrigued at running old dungeons as M+.

I literally did math few posts ago, how about you do the same before trying to argue, assume 1 or 4 dungeons per week. Now calculate how many weeks before statistically you run on same dungeon. With 8 dungeon pool vs 20 dungeon pool.

The tradeoff is worth it. I'd much rather have a rotation and wait on the 4 out dungeons than have the same 8 dungeons for 2 years.

16 dungeons?? 8 added in the second patch?? WoW has never done that many. The most added over the course of an expansion is 4 over the course of Wrath (3 of which were in the ICC patch, spiritually the final patch of WoW's initial story). And since you're so against re-using old dungeons, you're advocating adding 16 dungeons that will then never be used again lest Blizz get accused of lazily rehashing old content.

There is no tradeoff, its simply trying to squeeze more money from players. You will still have same pool of 8 dungeons per season with half of them already know and remade to be templated.

[Lolites]

The most added over the course of an expansion is 4 over the course of Wrath

cata added 5, ZA/ZG in 4.1 and 3 "hour of twilight" dungeons (end time, well of eternity, hour of twilight) in 4.3

And since you're so against re-using old dungeons, you're advocating adding 16 dungeons that will then never be used again lest Blizz get accused of lazily rehashing old content.

some people dont think ahead and only care about here and now...
they are the same people who after first month (at most) will whine there is nothing new to do...

[Rayr]

You clearly forgot what you wrote:



I am here to give a feedback about terrible system, and according to your terrible argument, this option is non existent, thus the link I posted is absolutely applicable. You are tying to imply i should "move".

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I literally did math few posts ago, how about you do the same before trying to argue, assume 1 or 4 dungeons per week. Now calculate how many weeks before statistically you run on same dungeon. With 8 dungeon pool vs 20 dungeon pool.




There is no tradeoff, its simply trying to squeeze more money from players. You will still have same pool of 8 dungeons per season with half of them already know and remade to be templated.

I’m not saying you should move I’m saying you should stop going out of your way to come here. That’s a massive difference Einstein

[kaminaris]

I’m not saying you should move I’m saying you should stop going out of your way to come here. That’s a massive difference Einstein

Read again

Why are you even here if you already made your decision then?

I know its hard thing to graps that even if I won't play it, there is still room for feedback as former player.

[Soimu]

Who cares. Dungeons are boring and outdated.