Ion Hazzikostas on Dragonflight Mythic+ Season 1 Itemization and Dungeon Pool

[MakeMeLaugh]

Just give us all new dungeons plus 4 old dungeons. Stop holding content just to make it look like season 2 is all brand new content.

Can't believe people are falling for that.

[Sentynel]

He is right, what is not right is he is trying to justify not having 8 dungeons at launch with gameplay reasons when it's obvious they are just planning on not having them ready at launch to save money.

Just like when they used blood elves and humans to create a new race instead of something new. I guess they have a low budget this time around. And that's fine, but they should be clear about it and not make up excuses.

Uhmm... I am pretty sure you can still run all 8 in non mythic plus modes.

[Bwgmon]

I believe Halls of Origination was mentioned somewhere. Possibly even Halls of Lightning. That would mean Blizzard is potentially looking back as far as WotLK for the m+ dungeon pool.

Though they would obviously need a ton of tuning.

This is actually getting me kind of excited at the idea. There are so many trinkets, weapon effects, and potentially micro-set bonuses they'll be able to pull from that could give people a lot of options to play with. Mulling over the old stuff and comparing it to the new equipment will be fun, and the prospect of the legacy dungeons changing every season to shake thinks up has me intrigued.

I might actually give a hoot about Mythic+ this go round.

[Trenbolone]

Just give us all new dungeons plus 4 old dungeons. Stop holding content just to make it look like season 2 is all brand new content.

Can't believe people are falling for that.

Yep. Also. Do you think they are going to bother with new dungeons in content patches now? We are not getting anything if this goes live. They will just timegate the initial 8 dungeons throughout the expansion. Wake up people, this is less content!

I am all up for revisiting old dungeons in m+ format. IN TIMEWALKING. The thing they have in the game. Like they did ALREADY with legion to supplement and ADD to m+ experience. This is not adding but taking away from the current expac m+ experience.
Give us all 8 dungeons we pay for in the expansion and add variety and spice things up with TW!

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Uhmm... I am pretty sure you can still run all 8 in non mythic plus modes.

Yes, you can. But who cares about that? How many times have you run Tazavesh before it was added into m+ pool. Most people did it once, or twice. Many didnt do it at all. M+ is the 5 man content now.

People have to stop using this donkey argument because it completley misses the point.

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This is actually getting me kind of excited at the idea. There are so many trinkets, weapon effects, and potentially micro-set bonuses they'll be able to pull from that could give people a lot of options to play with. Mulling over the old stuff and comparing it to the new equipment will be fun, and the prospect of the legacy dungeons changing every season to shake thinks up has me intrigued.

I might actually give a hoot about Mythic+ this go round.

Does it really? May i ask how many times have you run Legion M+? Do you completely skip on current M+ when TW is out? Because to me, it seems people did those a few times and went back to the current rotation. And if you think blizz will fine tune those old dungeons for current expac, think again.

[Inoculate]

Yep. Also. Do you think they are going to bother with new dungeons in content patches now? We are not getting anything if this goes live. They will just timegate the initial 8 dungeons throughout the expansion. Wake up people, this is less content!

I am all up for revisiting old dungeons in m+ format. IN TIMEWALKING. The thing they have in the game. Like they did ALREADY with legion to supplement and ADD to m+ experience. This is not adding but taking away from the current expac m+ experience.
Give us all 8 dungeons we pay for in the expansion and add variety and spice things up with TW!

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Yes, you can. But who cares about that? How many times have you run Tazavesh before it was added into m+ pool. Most people did it once, or twice. Many didnt do it at all. M+ is the 5 man content now.

People have to stop using this donkey argument because it completley misses the point.

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Does it really? May i ask how many times have you run Legion M+? Do you completely skip on current M+ when TW is out? Because to me, it seems people did those a few times and went back to the current rotation. And if you think blizz will fine tune those old dungeons for current expac, think again.

If you hate Blizzard as much as your replies suggest, it's best for all for you to move onto something you feel positive passion for. The game is clearly bringing you down, why hold so tight to it?

[Trenbolone]

If you hate Blizzard as much as your replies suggest, it's best for all for you to move onto something you feel positive passion for. The game is clearly bringing you down, why hold so tight to it?

I ultimately dont care. This is my spare time. I like sparking discussions.

And honestly, i never know how to respond to this type of comment. Because i dont understand the rationale behind it. Move on from anything you have a problem with? F that i wanna change things.

[Celement]

It is them offering less... you can't beat around that bush.

[uncl55]

I would rather see Cata dungeons then panda dungeons

[crusadernero]

Weird that its not just the 8 new dungeons + 4 old ones. Why shouldnt it be? I mean, we will get to play all 8 on N & HC right? So why not just have them as mythic too? Fear of to many dungeons?

That said - Its m+. Its about rushing a dungeon with a meta comp, so it probably doesnt matter what dungeon people run. No?

[Rageonit]

Just give us all new dungeons plus 4 old dungeons. Stop holding content just to make it look like season 2 is all brand new content.

Can't believe people are falling for that.

I don't want 12 m+ dungeons at launch. It's too much, 8 is perfect. Season 2 with completely new pool of 8 dungeons is also perfect.

[shise]

"If we ended up landing in a situation where a specific item from the prior season’s dungeons was beating higher item level alternatives from the following season, we’d make tuning adjustments to correct that"
Nooo! why? That would be cool, to actually have the chance to do ANY of the existing dungeons and benefit from it.

Everyone likes doing old dungeons too, mog runs, pets, mounts.. so why not certain loot too? It doesn´t have to be BIS items, okay, but nearly pair to BIS, why not?
As long as the best in slot items are in thee new content.. this would bring life to some parts of past expansions, which would bring many new players who´d be interested in that.

It´s a win win, none loses out on anything by not doing it but you can actually get updated loot from it.

[czarek]

Pandaria dungeons hmmm. Dragon isels new land across the azeroth hidden in the MISTS. Isnt that sounds familiar ? lol :P

[Coldkil]

I think he hit on a pretty important factor there. Anybody who's run a decent amount of M+ knows that there's a shortage of tanks (and an even larger dearth of good tanks). Trying to get into tanking later in an expansion after multiple seasons worth of meta gaming have made the dungeon experience extremely streamlined and regimented can be a daunting task, leaving a feedback loop of players simply not wanting to try tanking. Keeping the dungeon pool fresh every season puts everybody on a level playing field and also has the knock-on effect of alleviating the "farm {x} trinket every season" meta which develops.

For the record, I'm not entirely sold on the idea just yet but I'm interested to see how it plays out.

I'm sold on the fact that M+ can really be improved by changing the pool each season - even for a less stale environment. Having new dungeons to try to master is surely more enjoyable and we have 17 years of ones they can take from (needs rework but can be done in small amounts over time).

Not sure if i want this for the first season. I mean, dungeons are all new so i don't think you need old revamped ones to "shake up the meta". Also i'm fine with a pool of 8, i don't think they're too few. Probably they evaluated the time needed for people to do the usual basic thresholds like KSM and have seen that more dungeons will only make the thing longer an less appealing, who knows.

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Weird that its not just the 8 new dungeons + 4 old ones. Why shouldnt it be? I mean, we will get to play all 8 on N & HC right? So why not just have them as mythic too? Fear of to many dungeons?

That said - Its m+. Its about rushing a dungeon with a meta comp, so it probably doesnt matter what dungeon people run. No?

I think it's mostly due to the sensible wear-down of the M+ system during the course of the expansion. People and especially M+ enjoyers get bored about redoing the whole same dungeons all over for 2 years. Having the pool split in 2 means you can have different ones though the seasons.

I think that a setup like s1 = 8 new expack dungeons - s2 = first half + 4 old - s3 = second hal + 4 old would be just optimal both for players and devs that will have more time to change/adapt old dungeons to the M+ system.

[DechCJC]

This is alright. Keeps it fresh each patch and I imagine by season 3 we’ll get all 8 of the DF dungeons in a oner.

[Chromell]

Do whatever you want with M+, just gimme Aran's Relaxing Ruby at max ilv.

[Lorgran]

I can't believe they're even considering this. Dungeons from other expansions should be a bonus and/or if you want to do it, not a seasonal-permanent addition to the rotation. This will probably kill m+, that's how bad it is.
It's why I never played wow classic. I was there, I already did it for years, I don't want to do it again at "current" level.

Also, I don't get why people say "all 8 dungeons", when they should be saying "only 8 dungeons?". We should be having 10-12 on release, plus at least one to two (or a mega-) every patch.

[Rageonit]

I am all up for revisiting old dungeons in m+ format. IN TIMEWALKING. The thing they have in the game. Like they did ALREADY with legion to supplement and ADD to m+ experience.

Only Timewalking didn't work for m+. People simply don't do dungeons that are not a part of the normal rotation, for numerous reasons. Go check how many legion m+ groups are there to find (during timewalking) in the group finder, compared to "normal" dungeons. At times, you won't find a single group.

[erifwodahs]

what about... 12 dungeons? Only count the score from whichever 8 dungeons are the best and let us choose keystone dungeons and level

[[Apok]]

This will be part of their new m/o going forward , stretch out the content by padding it with "revamped or upscaled" versions of older content. shadowlands s4 will be the trial run for this so they can get an extra year of subscriptions out of content drought, concentrate on further bumping microtransactions in order to bolster their bottom line once wow goes to gamepass.

[Rageonit]

what about... 12 dungeons? Only count the score from whichever 8 dungeons are the best and let us choose keystone dungeons and level

Would have some pluses, but definitely some minuses too. I can bet my ass some of the dungeons (the difficult/long ones) would quickly get labeled as "non-meta" and it would be more difficult to get them running. If you need all, at least there are no excuses.