Why does wow's community come off as so entitled?

[Battlebeard]

This comment 10000%
all whose entitled idiots who want to the game to cater to their specific needs, must read this

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I raided alot and did TONS of pugs
this happens but not as much
you probably got declined 2-5 times and said This, it's your fault that you do not know what groups to queue on

Check the comment above this, you are on of them
exaggerating anything that happens. Makes you look like a nonfunctional person btw

I have tried doing M+ many times, I could spend hours a day getting declined. I haven't gotten a SINGLE invite to anything I applied for. Even harder for raids. I applied for litterally 50 pugs for Normal Sepulcher and didn't get invited to a single one and I have the requirements one should have to do it, which is 239ilvl and full LFR clear.

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People are just entitled and lazy. The requirements to get into keys and raids are very easy to meet.

I am not lazy, I am desperate to find some raids, but no matter what I do, not a single pug will give me a chance, not one in weeks now.

[ellieg]

"Start your own group" - Mentioned it many times, only a few % of all players can be the leader, whether it's 1 in 40, 30, 25, 20, 10, depending on expansion/difficulty, can be the leader. The vast majority will not be the raid leader, hence it's a poor solution. AND many people are terrible leaders. I NEVER in my life played a tank or healer, how can I possibly assign tanking and healing etc then? You shouldn't be required to know more than the character you play to actually play the game.

So you admit that it takes effort to lead a group, but then get mad when leaders put certain standards in place to ensure their effort doesn't go to waste?

Literally just create a group, invite like 2 tanks, 4 healers, 9 dps. Invite the first ones u see applying and go. Either you'll get exactly what you want and you'll do the content, or you'll learn why they aren't inviting every person that qs

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I have tried doing M+ many times, I could spend hours a day getting declined. I haven't gotten a SINGLE invite to anything I applied for. Even harder for raids. I applied for litterally 50 pugs for Normal Sepulcher and didn't get invited to a single one and I have the requirements one should have to do it, which is 239ilvl and full LFR clear.

What rank keys were u applying to amd getting denied with 239 ilvl?

[Eggroll]

If you can start a group and get people to apply who are above the qualifications, why wouldn't you take them over someone who doesn't have them?

If you run a business and try to hire new folks and a bunch of people with elite experience apply for the same salary, would you really hire the noobs?

Because it's not a business... it's a game... it's playing, not working.

[Ashana Darkmoon]

Because it's not a business... it's a game... it's playing, not working.

This doesn't mean anything. It's about incentives. No one has an incentive to take a worse player when a better one is available.

[Azharok]

No, the opposite.

This happens all the time. People DO ask for HC experience to do normal, when it should be normal experience to do heroic. People should PROGRESS not REGRESS.

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People missuse the world Entitled all the time.

We PAY for this game, we are entitled to the content of the game. I DO get that this game is a progressive game and that some parts require a certain amount of level to do (like experience and gear). But once we have the necessary requirements, we are entitled to do the content.

Take raiding, usually ilvl increase by 15 levels per difficulty, normal drop 100, heroic 115, mythic 130 etc.

If you get full 100, from normal, your next step is heroic. You cannot get higher than 100 pre-heroic raids, so if you have 100, you are heroic ready. Then you are entitled to raid heroic, cause you met the standard normal requirement. To ask for 115 for heroic is absurd, cause there is no way to get 115 before you done it. I'm sure you get my point.

Leaders should comply to the way the game was BUILT to be played, not have their own elistitic ways that RUIN the entire game. Same with dungeons, if you do M+2, you are ready for M+3 etc. The requirement for doing a +10 key SHOULD be to have done a +9 key. Not a +10, and absolutely not anything above +10. That's how you SHOULD progress in a game like this, and leaders who don't do it like that ARE doing it objecitvely wrong.

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How can you get Aotc, KM or heroic gear if you never ge invited.

Your solutions are very bad an unrealistic.

"Join a community" - What community? Never seen a single one willing to help. The "community" that exist is toxic.
"Join a guild" - Not everyone has the ability to join guilds, people have IRL that makes regular play impossible. Guilds are for Mythic raiding only, that's not even what I am asking for.
"Play with friends" - And what if you don't have any friends or the ability or interest to make friends? This should not be a requirement to play the game.
"Start your own group" - Mentioned it many times, only a few % of all players can be the leader, whether it's 1 in 40, 30, 25, 20, 10, depending on expansion/difficulty, can be the leader. The vast majority will not be the raid leader, hence it's a poor solution. AND many people are terrible leaders. I NEVER in my life played a tank or healer, how can I possibly assign tanking and healing etc then? You shouldn't be required to know more than the character you play to actually play the game.

For every 50 groups asking for HC experience to run HC, there might be ONE asking HC for NHC, don't join that group. Also with regards to getting invited or not, imagine being ONE player amongst a list of 20-30 or more players, signing up to the same raid. The raidleader can pick and choose who he wants in the raid. If he didn't pick you, it's might not be as personnal as you think.

"Join a community" is a valid solution, guilds are absolutely not for "MYTHIC RAIDING ONLY". If you do not wish to make friends I find it a bit entitled that you want to be able to do GROUP content without having to interact with another human being, could always run LFR. You don't need to be a leader to run a PUG, you don't even need to raidlead. Just invite people who supposedly know the fights and let them carry you. I got into a NHC SFO raid, we went 10/11, Raidleader was dead on EVERY SINGLE BOSS FIGHT.

You're just complaining for the sake of it. If you want to do group content, expect to interact with other human beings.

[ChairmanKaga]

Why does wow's community come off as so entitled?

The community is horrendous.

[Azharok]

I have tried doing M+ many times, I could spend hours a day getting declined. I haven't gotten a SINGLE invite to anything I applied for. Even harder for raids. I applied for litterally 50 pugs for Normal Sepulcher and didn't get invited to a single one and I have the requirements one should have to do it, which is 239ilvl and full LFR clear.

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I am not lazy, I am desperate to find some raids, but no matter what I do, not a single pug will give me a chance, not one in weeks now.

Push your own key. Start your own raid.

[Ashana Darkmoon]

I have tried doing M+ many times, I could spend hours a day getting declined. I haven't gotten a SINGLE invite to anything I applied for. Even harder for raids. I applied for litterally 50 pugs for Normal Sepulcher and didn't get invited to a single one and I have the requirements one should have to do it, which is 239ilvl and full LFR clear..

I get the frustration, but you're just competing against better people. 239 is incredibly low; it was low even last season.

There's no good solution aside from joining a guild or trying to run your own group.

[Aggressive]

It depends on where you look. FFXIV's fandom on reddit and twitter is 100% cultist, but if you look at the official forums or the 4chan general or the FFXIV subforum on this site, you find that most people are in agreement about the flaws and would should be improved. Whereas it seems to be the opposite with WoW: there is a lot of criticism of WoW on reddit, while on the official forums and on MMO-C, you see a lot of bootlicking, and what criticism is offered is often met with condescension.

I think this is the most accurate of information I have seen in years on this site.....900%

[Battlebeard]

So you admit that it takes effort to lead a group, but then get mad when leaders put certain standards in place to ensure their effort doesn't go to waste?

Literally just create a group, invite like 2 tanks, 4 healers, 9 dps. Invite the first ones u see applying and go. Either you'll get exactly what you want and you'll do the content, or you'll learn why they aren't inviting every person that qs

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What rank keys were u applying to amd getting denied with 239 ilvl?

If I was a good leader, I would take anyone who fit the bare minimum requirements, but I suck at leading, it's not a trait I have. I have 0 ability to multitask, I can't even eat and watch a movie, or walk and listen to music basically. I struggle raiding and listening to a leader, but it works. Can't even imagine if i try to lead.

I don't have 239, I have 252, but 239 should be the requirement for Normal raids, as that is the ilvl you get if you get full LFR gear. Just like the requirement for Heroic should be 252, as that's full normal gear. So technically, I am ready for Heroic, but I can't even get invited to normal mode For keys, just about anything around +10, as I've talked to people who do keys and they say more or less +20 is mythic geared, +15 is heroic geared, and +10 is normal geared, and having 252ilvl, I should do +10s!

[Eggroll]

This doesn't mean anything. It's about incentives. No one has an incentive to take a worse player when a better one is available.

Then don't compare it to business. Maybe they all should just unclench their a$$es, relax and don't take themselves so damn seriously.

[Battlebeard]

Push your own key. Start your own raid.

Do you seriously think it should be a requirement to be a raid leader to actually play the game? To know every single class, to know every single persons job, and to assign every player. And at the same time, recruit the right classes, communicate and organize everything. To lead a raid is HUGE, and it takes a certain kind of human to do it, and I admire and respect those who have that skill. But the vast majority of us doesn't have that skill and are terrible leaders and quite frankly completely incapeable of leading anything. So that should NOT be something that every single player should need.

[dacoolist]

I look at the opposite and don't understand how people can accept the elitistic game that this has become. And the insane requirements that people ask for.

- People asking for Ahead of the Curve for Normal raids
- People asking for Keystone Mastery (+15s) to join +10s
- People asking for full Heroic gear to do Normal raids

etc etc, it's become a joke.

As much as I agree with what you’re saying: If it’s YOUR KEY/Group it’s YOUR CALL. End of story ggclose/gbye

[ellieg]

If I was a good leader, I would take anyone who fit the bare minimum requirements, but I suck at leading, it's not a trait I have. I have 0 ability to multitask, I can't even eat and watch a movie, or walk and listen to music basically. I struggle raiding and listening to a leader, but it works. Can't even imagine if i try to lead.

I don't have 239, I have 252, but 239 should be the requirement for Normal raids, as that is the ilvl you get if you get full LFR gear. Just like the requirement for Heroic should be 252, as that's full normal gear. So technically, I am ready for Heroic, but I can't even get invited to normal mode For keys, just about anything around +10, as I've talked to people who do keys and they say more or less +20 is mythic geared, +15 is heroic geared, and +10 is normal geared, and having 252ilvl, I should do +10s!

Ok so 252 ilvl is great for +10s, but what is your rating?

The same way you progress thru lfr to normal to heroic, you should be progressing up thru keys incrementally. Get them all done on like +2-5, then start rocking out 7-9s, then get your 10s. For M+, rating is just as important if not more important than ilvl. Need both but rating is like your resume

[facefist]

People missuse the world Entitled all the time.

We PAY for this game, we are entitled to the content of the game. I DO get that this game is a progressive game and that some parts require a certain amount of level to do (like experience and gear). But once we have the necessary requirements, we are entitled to do the content.

Paying for the game doesn't necessarily make you entitled for the content as long as content grouping is player driven, which is basically the whole idea of the social aspect of MMOs. While you are correct that it is annoying when people demand more than is necessary for the content, what you want is to change how the whole grouping works in the game.

Currently grouping is community driven apart from lfg autogrouping. The solution to your problem is forcing people to group with people they wouldn't group with if they had the freedom to choose. I prefer player driven grouping even if it has certain annoyances, and I would hate forced grouping where I can't choose who to play with.

[Le Conceptuel]

Agreed. It's truly nonsensical that we have to do all these grinds—in fact, why do we even have to go around looting items? I think we should just be able to buy all the items we want for real money on the store. Imagine having to actually earn the things you get. You have to be able to get whatever you want whenever you want!

/s

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Do you seriously think it should be a requirement to be a raid leader to actually play the game? To know every single class, to know every single persons job, and to assign every player. And at the same time, recruit the right classes, communicate and organize everything. To lead a raid is HUGE, and it takes a certain kind of human to do it, and I admire and respect those who have that skill. But the vast majority of us doesn't have that skill and are terrible leaders and quite frankly completely incapeable of leading anything. So that should NOT be something that every single player should need.

So, what you're saying is you know to expect a raid leader who has all of those skills to do all of the prerequisite work to create a fun and cohesive experience for his fellow players in the raid, and yet you yourself do not want to put in the legwork to make his experience enjoyable by ensuring that he has a certain kind of player involved. Why should raid members get to expect so much out of their raid leaders and not vice-versa?

[Battlebeard]

Ok so 252 ilvl is great for +10s, but what is your rating?

The same way you progress thru lfr to normal to heroic, you should be progressing up thru keys incrementally. Get them all done on like +2-5, then start rocking out 7-9s, then get your 10s. For M+, rating is just as important if not more important than ilvl. Need both but rating is like your resume

I don't have any rating, but I did all of them +15 season one, when I had a team, some friends that quit after, so I certainly have the experience of it.

And no, before you say "play with friends" those are the only friends I've had that played the game and I got the luck of a lifetime when one guy didn't show and I could take that persons place. Not everyone have friends, it's no reliable solution.

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Paying for the game doesn't necessarily make you entitled for the content as long as content grouping is player driven, which is basically the whole idea of the social aspect of MMOs. While you are correct that it is annoying when people demand more than is necessary for the content, what you want is to change how the whole grouping works in the game.

Currently grouping is community driven apart from lfg autogrouping. The solution to your problem is forcing people to group with people they wouldn't group with if they had the freedom to choose. I prefer player driven grouping even if it has certain annoyances, and I would hate forced grouping where I can't choose who to play with.

Well, I guess the game needs to be less player driven, as players are toxic and elitistic. LFG for Normal+Heroic Raids and up to like +10 keys at least is a start.

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Agreed. It's truly nonsensical that we have to do all these grinds—in fact, why do we even have to go around looting items? I think we should just be able to buy all the items we want for real money on the store. Imagine having to actually earn the things you get. You have to be able to get whatever you want whenever you want!

/s

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So, what you're saying is you know to expect a raid leader who has all of those skills to do all of the prerequisite work to create a fun and cohesive experience for his fellow players in the raid, and yet you yourself do not want to put in the legwork to make his experience enjoyable by ensuring that he has a certain kind of player involved. Why should raid members get to expect so much out of their raid leaders and not vice-versa?

Because we HAVE done the legwork that should be required to join.

[Le Conceptuel]

Because we HAVE done the legwork that should be required to join.

Why is your judgment superior to that of the raid leader? Going off the qualifications you ascribed them, it seems like they'd be wholly qualified to judge who they do and don't want in their raid, right?

[tomten]

Didn't bother to even read what OP wrote but its super easy...
Paying for an expansion AND paying for a subscription every month... I have the right to my entitlement....

[Le Conceptuel]

Didn't bother to even read what OP wrote but its super easy...
Paying for an expansion AND paying for a subscription every month... I have the right to my entitlement....

You are buying a certain service and paying for a certain service. You know what to expect from what they're giving you. You are holding yourself to higher expectations than your money bought. Just paying for a service does not inherently grant you the right to entitlement to anything save for the service itself and certain standards of quality.