1. #3441
    The Undying Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HeatBlast View Post
    Yeah but why do that when you can cut both AND blame someone else for the problems?
    I'm quite looking forward to the part where hackers steal people's accounts and Elon Musk is forced to tell the world that his new virtual town square is a gated community, and that some people are more equal than others when it comes to "free speech".

    Musk is putting himself in a position where he has, sad to say, an actual defense: "I told you 2FA was a paid service and you didn't buy it, therefore, you getting hacked is your own fault". That's an attitude I find ugly in the 21st goddam century, but it's defendable. Or it would be, if Musk hadn't already said he was fixing Twitter because of "free speech". Charging for a service is just business, and people can take it or leave it. Being a massive hypocrite is another issue entirely. I hope this move goes through and Twitter suffers for it.

  2. #3442
    So...Musk and lithium mining, sounds safe enough. But it's the cobalt mining that should bite us all in the ass; ‘Here, it is better not to be born’: Cobalt mining for Big Tech is driving child labor, deaths in the Congo

    The “quaint” moniker of artisanal mining, Mr Kara points out, belies a brutal industry where hundreds of thousands of men, women and children dig with bare hands and basic tools in toxic, perilous pits, eking out an existence on the bottom rung of the global supply chain.

    The miners are the first step in the race for precious metals and minerals by some of the world’s most powerful companies, with multibillion-dollar valuations and whose founders and CEOs are household names.

    If you own a smartphone, tablet, laptop, e-scooter, electric vehicle (or all of the above), then it is a system in which you are unwittingly complicit.

    "At no point in human history has so much suffering generated so much profit and been directly linked to the lives of billions of people around the world,” Mr Kara writes in the book.

    Around 75 per cent of the world’s cobalt is mined in the DRC -- and the world cannot get enough of it. The rare, silvery metal is an essential component to every lithium-ion rechargeable battery, a necessary part of the booming electric vehicle (EV) industry.

    The DRC’s industrial mines are typically structured as joint ventures between the national government and foreign operators, for the most part Chinese companies. China produces three-quarters of the world’s refined cobalt, the keys to the kingdom in the battery market.

    "Cobalt mining is the slave farm perfected,” Mr Kara writes.

    Cobalt is toxic to touch and breathe in, and can be found alongside traces of radioactive uranium. Cancers, respiratory illnesses, miscarriages, headaches and painful skin conditions occur among adults who work without protective equipment....


    ...more in that link, but it's just misery² Mr Optimism's better future in the Congo is a quick death for children.

  3. #3443
    Elemental Lord unfilteredJW's Avatar
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    Artisinal mining is something right out of The Onion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Venara
    Half this forum would be permanently banned if we did everything some of our users regularly demand or otherwise expect us to do.
    Actual blue mod response on doing what they volunteered to do. No wonder this place is infested.

  4. #3444
    Quote Originally Posted by unfilteredJW View Post
    Artisinal mining is something right out of The Onion.
    "We're providing jobs for budding young artisans and entrepreneurs, without us poverty would be way more extreme and they should really just be thankful they get paid anything at all."

  5. #3445
    New emergency bid to appeal, block huge Nevada lithium mine

    I've been having doubts about EVs for a while now...and they keep growing.

  6. #3446
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    New emergency bid to appeal, block huge Nevada lithium mine

    I've been having doubts about EVs for a while now...and they keep growing.
    You can doubt all you like…but it’s unlikely that we’ll find a way to power society without doing some damage to the environment any time soon. It’s just a matter of how much damage and how expensive it will end up being.

  7. #3447
    Quote Originally Posted by s_bushido View Post
    You can doubt all you like…but it’s unlikely that we’ll find a way to power society without doing some damage to the environment any time soon. It’s just a matter of how much damage and how expensive it will end up being.
    It's not just the environment now is it? Handwaving clean water and air...and the torturous deaths due to cobalt mining...and we can't/won't do better?

  8. #3448
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    It's not just the environment now is it? Handwaving clean water and air...and the torturous deaths due to cobalt mining...and we can't/won't do better?
    There is a reason most rare earths are mined in third world countries. It's not that there are no deposits in developed countries. They are mined there because the cost is nonexistent due to the horrid working conditions and almost no care is taken for the massive environmental damage done locally from mining them.

    They could ofc be mined with developed country standards but then they'd cost an order of magnitude more and we can't have that.

  9. #3449
    Child slave labor and their resultant early deaths...not taking into account the slave labor in general and the torture of simply living.

  10. #3450

  11. #3451
    https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/com...erman_tv_show/

    So I'm going off of this thread as I don't speak German.

    But is Elon banning German media to suppress reporting on Russia abducting Ukrainian children?

    It's his show now, he dictates policy, he's responsible, he wants to make it a freeze peach platform because it's apparently important to the literal future of humanity.

    Why is he protecting what appear to be child traffickers?

  12. #3452
    The Unstoppable Force Orange Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    It's not just the environment now is it? Handwaving clean water and air...and the torturous deaths due to cobalt mining...and we can't/won't do better?
    Cause oil is better? Are you forgetting/ignoring the disasters that have happened with oil?
    MMO-Champ the place where calling out trolls get you into more trouble than trolling.

  13. #3453
    Reforged Gone Wrong The Stormbringer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by s_bushido View Post
    You can doubt all you like…but it’s unlikely that we’ll find a way to power society without doing some damage to the environment any time soon. It’s just a matter of how much damage and how expensive it will end up being.
    We have far better options. Battery industries just don't want to pay the cost needed to switch over from lithium. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium-ion_battery
    Sodium-ion batteries would be considerably cheaper and easier to produce in the long run, but you have to entirely retool your factories and supply chains to get it. Corpos don't wanna do that, as it'll cost them billions and billions, even if it's far superior long term.

  14. #3454
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    https://www.reddit.com/r/ukraine/com...erman_tv_show/

    So I'm going off of this thread as I don't speak German.

    But is Elon banning German media to suppress reporting on Russia abducting Ukrainian children?
    ZDF is public TV, Frontal is one of its investigative political shows.
    Here's the report that somehow got Musk mad. No subtitles, not even in German, I guess the €18.36 I have to pay every month is not enough for subs...

  15. #3455
    Quote Originally Posted by Orange Joe View Post
    Cause oil is better? Are you forgetting/ignoring the disasters that have happened with oil?
    Not one bit, and I think you know that.
    Just as I know you will never endorse child-slave labor and their deaths for any reason.
    I've always had two lines drawn; children, and the environment. Now it's one or the other?

  16. #3456
    Quote Originally Posted by The Stormbringer View Post
    We have far better options. Battery industries just don't want to pay the cost needed to switch over from lithium. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium-ion_battery
    Sodium-ion batteries would be considerably cheaper and easier to produce in the long run, but you have to entirely retool your factories and supply chains to get it. Corpos don't wanna do that, as it'll cost them billions and billions, even if it's far superior long term.
    Not the only option either. There have been multiple advancements made in battery technology. Retooling and getting mass manufacturing up to speed is costly. Like standing up a new fab is for chips. Until someone makes the first move (like Apple maybe moving battery tech to something else) then we will be stuck.

  17. #3457
    High Overlord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rozz View Post
    Stay civil during discussion.

    If debate breaks down, you don't need to obsessively reply to each other. You can move on. No petty remarks and no cyclical arguments for arguing's sake needed.

    Once replies begin to focus on a poster and not the thread, it's a good sign to take a breather. So let's go back to discussing the topic.
    I see you have time to comment on the discussion taking place, but no time to take action against an obviously bad faith poster. Hard to imagine why they get to keep derailing threads all the time.

  18. #3458
    The Unstoppable Force Orange Joe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    Not one bit, and I think you know that.
    Just as I know you will never endorse child-slave labor and their deaths for any reason.
    I've always had two lines drawn; children, and the environment. Now it's one or the other?
    Just to confirm, you are suggesting we never harvest this stuff because 3rd world counties don't have regulations to prevent exploitation? There is no other solution except just not mining it?
    MMO-Champ the place where calling out trolls get you into more trouble than trolling.

  19. #3459
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    So...Musk and lithium mining, sounds safe enough. But it's the cobalt mining that should bite us all in the ass; ‘Here, it is better not to be born’: Cobalt mining for Big Tech is driving child labor, deaths in the Congo

    The “quaint” moniker of artisanal mining, Mr Kara points out, belies a brutal industry where hundreds of thousands of men, women and children dig with bare hands and basic tools in toxic, perilous pits, eking out an existence on the bottom rung of the global supply chain.

    The miners are the first step in the race for precious metals and minerals by some of the world’s most powerful companies, with multibillion-dollar valuations and whose founders and CEOs are household names.

    If you own a smartphone, tablet, laptop, e-scooter, electric vehicle (or all of the above), then it is a system in which you are unwittingly complicit.

    "At no point in human history has so much suffering generated so much profit and been directly linked to the lives of billions of people around the world,” Mr Kara writes in the book.

    Around 75 per cent of the world’s cobalt is mined in the DRC -- and the world cannot get enough of it. The rare, silvery metal is an essential component to every lithium-ion rechargeable battery, a necessary part of the booming electric vehicle (EV) industry.

    The DRC’s industrial mines are typically structured as joint ventures between the national government and foreign operators, for the most part Chinese companies. China produces three-quarters of the world’s refined cobalt, the keys to the kingdom in the battery market.

    "Cobalt mining is the slave farm perfected,” Mr Kara writes.

    Cobalt is toxic to touch and breathe in, and can be found alongside traces of radioactive uranium. Cancers, respiratory illnesses, miscarriages, headaches and painful skin conditions occur among adults who work without protective equipment....


    ...more in that link, but it's just misery² Mr Optimism's better future in the Congo is a quick death for children.
    Interestingly enough, Tesla is moving its Global Engineering HQ from Austin to Palo Alto. A bit of an irony, it will be located in the former Hewlett Packard HQ. Supposedly, Tesla was having problem hiring high caliber engineers in Austin. Especially those with AI expertise. Or California gave him a better tax break than Texas. I kind of doubt that.

    Looking at the endless list of Tesla job openings in Palo Alto, there are lots and lots openings in their Navigation and Robotic division.

    In comparison, there is one single job opening in Tesla Navigation and Robotic division in the entire state of Texas.
    Last edited by Rasulis; 2023-02-23 at 05:27 PM.

  20. #3460
    Quote Originally Posted by Orange Joe View Post
    Just to confirm, you are suggesting we never harvest this stuff because 3rd world counties don't have regulations to prevent exploitation? There is no other solution except just not mining it?
    I'm saying there needs to be a better way than killing children.
    Or to use your tactic; are you in so much favor of taking advantage of 3rd world countries, and exploitation of child and slave labor?

    The silence is deafening from 1st world countries. And I'm certain it's because there's not much that can be done that won't result in one big frustrating geopolitical mess.

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