Elon Musk Buys Twitter

[Edge-]

We’re supposed to be mad that Musk found a way to run the company without as many employees?

I’m not mad.

He did find a way to run the company with fewer employees! While being warned that pursuing such a path would result in more hate-speech and child abuse of the platform.

And lo and behold it has resulted in more hate speech and child abuse on the platform, the thing you say isn't happening as a result of Elom's intentional policy and staffing decisions.

Does reality hold any meaning to you? Do words hold any meaning to you?

[Ivanstone]

You get entirely different perspectives in Europe

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-65733969

Hmmm…
European source.
Twitter does not want to meet Europe’s disinformation standards.

Is this perspective different enough for you?

[Edge-]

So long as it is being fixed, I'm good with that.

But...is it? Or are they only reacting when it gets public attention and otherwise simply allowing far more images and videos of child abuse to proliferate on the platform?

Musk seems to actively go after those accounts. He permanently suspended the account of that person who made a pedo flag, saying that it's not tolerated on the platform.

Remember that's you. It's absolutely tolerated on the platform now. It wasn't previously when they had more aggressive tools and policies and teams of staffers working to prevent its spread and take it down.

Those are all gone now, and Elom acting as a moderator when he feels like it isn't exactly a replacement.

but I'm sure you are aware of all this and that's all the point. This is a cheeky game where you pretend you care about child abuse on Twitter until you actually don't.

[D Luniz]

We’re supposed to be mad that Musk found a way to run the company without as many employees?

I’m not mad.

About the same way your car can run without a catalytic converter and on leaded gasoline
Sure it's cheaper for you. Sucks for everyone else you drive near.

[Edge-]

You're doing it again... do you know that they are all gone? Do you even have a percentage? A general idea? How involved are you with the moderation team at Twitter and it's algorthim? This isn't Twitter -- it doesn't compare.

So again we're arguing over tone policing and pedantry which is super fun!

Trust and safety council gone - https://www.npr.org/2022/12/12/11423...ncil-elon-musk

Second trust and safety chief gone - https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-65786326

They keep getting caught letting known images of child abuse slip through their system - https://www.wsj.com/articles/twitter...s-say-58d44f7b

The child safety team is gutted - https://www.wired.com/story/twitter-...buse-material/

More on their failure to deal with child sex abuse material - https://www.forbes.com/sites/emmawoo...t-observatory/

Even more on how under Elom's Twitter, with his policies, has seen a notable increase in the number of child sex abuse images posted - https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-ne...rial-rcna63621

I do hope you'll read at least a few of those links. I apologize that I don't have exact %'s because I am not internal at Twitter, though that's a fairly unreasonable and seemingly bad-faith request to begin with.

[Endus]

I mean, I wouldn’t say the NYT is a credible source. They often put out hit pieces that show bias and push intended narratives. I’d definitely like to read more on how they collected this data, and if it was really done in good faith, as I’m not seeing much context in the article.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/new-york-times/

In short, bullshit. They just don't support your ideological narrative, so your own bias forces you to reject them.

And to be clear, the "credibility" ratings on these things are orders of magnitude more important than the "bias" ratings. A source that's far-left in bias with high credibility is far more reputable a source than one that's centrist but unreliable in credibility. It's only bad-faith disinformation spreaders who try and claim that "bias" is such a big fuckin' deal in these things.

[Edge-]

What's dishonest, is how you're posting, which relies heavily on these emotionally-fueld words to get your point across. If you have to rely on that to make your point, ima feel towards you the exact way you feel towards me.

Did you click any of the links to read them or is this just like a gag reflex every time you're potentially presented with information that doesn't reinforce your worldview?

[Endus]

What's dishonest, is how you're posting, which relies heavily on these emotionally-fueld words to get your point across. If you have to rely on that to make your point, ima feel towards you the exact way you feel towards me.

That wouldn't be "dishonest", even if Edge- were relying heavily on emotional phrasing and appeals, but the reality is that he isn't, and you're openly lying about it because you're unwilling to actually inform yourself from the sources being presented to you and want to somehow build up some misbegotten image of you as being the one who's treated unfairly, here.

You're the one refusing to consider evidence and flinging baseless accusations at everyone who contradicts you. That's desperation, not an argument.

[Breccia]

What's dishonest, is--

What's dishonest is asking a question ike "are they all gone?" getting a specific and direct answer, and disregarding that answer because the first line is sarcastic.

You asked, @Edge- answered, you responded with bile. No wonder you like Twitter.

[Jastall]

You'd be surprised just how much Americans are spoonfed by their own media. You get entirely different perspectives in Europe -- it's why I prefer watching/reading those.

And as I previously said, I'm interested in the data and future preventative-steps made by Musk. I prefer to not get angry and make claims without it fully being investigated and that info released.

- - - Updated - - -



I agree, but was this video posted deliberately to attract these pedo's (which many are trying to suggest) or was this a fuck-up in the algorithm (or whatever it was) that was promised to be investigated and corrected?

Which are we going to believe? Cause the latter makes more sense to me, rather than some conspiracy that Musk is trying to give pedos and racists a much louder voice.

So only facts and data matter, except facts posted in a way you don't like don't matter and positions that reinforce your existing worldviews without providing data and facts are "eye-opening"?

Gee, one wonders why you struggle to be taken seriously.

[Edge-]

Was there an issue? Yes
Was it addressed? Yes
Was there promises to fix it? Yes

Were these issues there before with the same severity? No
Were they addressed before others flagged them to Twitter? No
Is Twitters promise to fix it given their gutting of teams responsible for this work and the ending of many of the related policies? No

What I don't appreciate, is people that take that and twist it into an emotional plea

You keep using that word, I do not think it means what you think it means.

convincing people that this is a huge, wide-spread problem and that it will never be fixed

Things I have never explicitly stated nor implied.

I have stated that it's a growing problem - which is true
I have stated that Elom's policy and staffing decisions contributed to this - which is true
I have stated that these problems were not as severe or pronounced under the policies and teams in place prior to Elom - which is true

That's it, everything else is your imagination.

basically, the sky is falling and Musk is just posting memes.

"just posting memes" is doing a lot of heavy lifting for, "Platforming and signal-boosting bigoted, hateful content and rhetoric from hateful sources that intend to cause harm to marginalized communities." in which case yes, you're correct. He's getting criticized for the content of his memes, not the fact that he posts memes. If he actually had super dank memes people would still like him

[Endus]

Was there an issue? Yes
Was it addressed? Yes
Was there promises to fix it? Yes

That middle one is false. That's what people have been pointing out to you. You're openly lying to people's faces after they've already proven it's a false claim.

What I don't appreciate, is people that take that and twist it into an emotional plea, convincing people that this is a huge, wide-spread problem and that it will never be fixed, blah, blah, blah.... basically, the sky is falling and Musk is just posting memes.

You're twisting their words. They've been pointing out to you that it's a problem Musk created, that Musk is making it worse, and that Musk doesn't want it fixed because he supports the malicious nature.

That's not "the sky is falling" nor is it "Musk is just posting memes", nor is anyone claiming that the issue can't be fixed. It was fixed. Then Musk broke it, on purpose, because he wants it broken.

Why should I be expected to accept that reasoning? Cause that's desperation.

No, that's just you lying to our faces and expecting to be treated as a serious person.

Edit: And I swear to bacon and puppies if anyone fuckin' pulls off a "what happened to civility?" bit of bullshit for this kind of response; lying to people's faces is uncivil. Responding in kind is not unwarranted.

[Breccia]

Was it addressed?

As Edge- posted, no. Musk fired everyone that was supposed to fix it, and personally re-invited Nazis and murderous insurrectionists back on the platform. And you approved, because it made it less of an "echo chamber", and you wanted their points of view -- their Nazi and/or murderous insurrectionist viewpoints, the ones they were banned for -- to be heard.

Twitter hate speech surged with Musk, study says

From April.

Link directly to the study. It nearly doubled.

You have said, recently, that you'd rather have a platform with Nazi and murderous insurrection viewpoints -- something something echo chamber -- than listen to someone who's emotional about Nazis and murderous insurrectionists being invited back. Groups that inspire violence and kill people, which is why they were kicked off.

Well, that's a decision you're allowed to make. Have fun.

[Draco-Onis]

basically, the sky is falling and Musk is just posting memes.

Just this week he joined into the right wing bigots by attacking Megan Fox for daring to allowing her son to wear a dress so no not "posting memes". That's not even going into his Soros tweets, Neo Nazi tweets etc.

[Slirith]

Can we just put it on ignore and stay on topic ffs?

[Endus]

You’re right, I’ll just wait for my daily reminder from Edge- that Musk is a POS… you know, the reminder that they always put at the end of their posts, which is often filled with these emotional words to also convince people to side with them.

Anyone who has to constantly remind me that a person is bad, and who overdramatizes situations, is a person who’s word and motive should be questioned.

Empty tone policing, dodging what I actually said that you were responding to.

Ironically, making an entirely emotion-based appeal as your only argument against Edge-'s posting.

You're everything you're projecting onto everyone else.

- - - Updated - - -

Can we just put it on ignore and stay on topic ffs?

Putting it on ignore keeps it out of my sight lines, but it's still there for everyone else, which means it does nothing to fix the issue and just lets it fester without opposition.

Thanks, but no. I'd rather address the actual problem face-on rather than volunteering to stick my head in the sand and let it continue being a problem for everyone else.

[Karreck]

I mean, I wouldn’t say the NYT is a credible source.

And there is the giveaway line. You don't care about credibility, you want confirmation bias.

[NED funded]

I agree, but was this video posted deliberately to attract these pedo's (which many are trying to suggest) or was this a fuck-up in the algorithm (or whatever it was) that was promised to be investigated and corrected?

Which are we going to believe? Cause the latter makes more sense to me, rather than some conspiracy that Musk is trying to give pedos and racists a much louder voice.

I dont think Elon is purposely making Twitter a space for pedophiles. More like him acquiring Twitter has thrown a wrench on existing programs to combat this type of content.

I see some people trying to tie this to hate speech and what not, but thats a free speech issue. Its kinda separate. You can be for bigoted speech in a principled manner.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

So long as it is being fixed, I'm good with that.

"Guys, Musk said he's going to fix the problem that he caused...it's all good now"

[Benggaul]

Putting it on ignore keeps it out of my sight lines, but it's still there for everyone else, which means it does nothing to fix the issue and just lets it fester without opposition.

Thanks, but no. I'd rather address the actual problem face-on rather than volunteering to stick my head in the sand and let it continue being a problem for everyone else.

This bullshit again.

No, ignoring a troll/bad-faith poster is not "letting it fester" or "sticking your head in the sand", it's starving it of the attention it needs to survive. We have been told repeatedly by mods--of which you WERE one--that we should not engage with trolls, ignore them and report them instead. Now, if you want to argue that they aren't doing their job effectively which is why people like Deparduh keep running rampant here, I'll agree. But you constantly trying to "logic" them into submission does absolutely jack shit as far as combatting their nonsense. It just gives them another springboard to regurgitate the same shit while ignoring or purposefully misconstruing everything you wrote--which they do ad fucking nauseum.

You're not saving other people from it; you're propagating it. And, as I've mentioned before, people aren't coming to the politics sub-subforum of a random (and declining) gaming forum to form their views on politics. Nobody. Everyone here already knows how they feel about pretty much every aspect of politics and social reform and nobody is going to change because you or anyone else decided you have this righteous crusade against people who are proven time and again to be bad-faith, willfully ignorant bigots at best. The only reason this place even has a Politics subforum is to put all the shit in one spot so that it doesn't flood the topics of other forums. It's contained--mostly--to an isolated section so that other people can safely ignore it, the fucking disingenuous stooges and the self-important blowhards who can't resist responding to every provocation.

I know this won't stop you and others from further spamming the threads pointlessly in response to people who have no intention of taking anything you say seriously, but if a handful of posts with links to reputable sources/facts doesn't deter someone from just flat-out posting misinformation continuously then neither will 3 pages worth of the same. It just bloats the thread with derailment after derailment time and again instead of an honest discussion about the topic among people who are at least willing to entertain new information.