Elon Musk Buys Twitter

[Malkiah]

I'm not saying they can't, I'm saying they don't. But mostly because they don't need to.

but doesn't human history pretty strongly contradict this view?
before fascism you had things like the US confederacy, before that you had the french aristocracy, you had monarchism, feudalism, empires, warlords, military city-states... it's always been conquest, it's always been oppression, for the entirety of known human existence.
they do keep popping up because IMO these structures of thinking and behaving are endemic to the human mind and near as i can tell they always have been.

Fascists are really only fascists when they organize. But again, these organizations don't just spontaneously create themselves. In almost all cases, they've existed for decades upon decades and have just continued, behind closed doors, to recruit like-minded haters and show them an ideology that caters to their hatred. One that gives them an excuse to revel in a pattern of thought which well-adjusted people would automatically eschew.

well sure that's true of "fascism" abstractly but not of that core way of thinking, which has been going for thousands of years at least.

[Endus]

That's the fucking point. He wasn't defending Elon Musk from accusations of being a Nazi or Nazism itself. He was offering context for how Elon Musk thinks, but you flew off the handle the moment you read the words "Elon Musk is not a Nazi..." and ignored everything else in his post.

"Elon Musk is not a Nazi" and "Elon Musk is not just a Nazi" are not the same phrase.

My point is that you are calling someone a Nazi because they said someone else is worse than a Nazi.

He said they're not a Nazi. That's what I was contesting. You've agreed they said that.

The point of the parable was that it is absurd to start accusing someone of being a cunt sympathizer just because you disagree about the degree of how big of cunt they are, if both of you already think he is a massive cunt.

In this case, he opened his argument by claiming "he's not a cunt". Imagine if we were talking cannibalism. This guy would be looking at a picture of Elon Musk with a child's roasted leg in his hands, child-grease smeared all over his face, chewing, and he's arguing "oh, he's not a cannibal."

And that's fucked up. It's a denial of obvious verifiable truth. That's what I took them to task for. And you keep deflecting because he made other criticisms. I don't care. I care about the denial that Musk is a Nazi.

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but doesn't human history pretty strongly contradict this view?
before fascism you had things like the US confederacy, before that you had the french aristocracy, you had monarchism, feudalism, empires, warlords, military city-states... it's always been conquest, it's always been oppression, for the entirety of known human existence.
they do keep popping up because IMO these structures of thinking and behaving are endemic to the human mind and near as i can tell they always have been.

There's very little evidence of such behaviour in prehistory. It largely only emerged when we developed agriculture, because that allowed for societies to produce enough food for individuals to specialize and require greater organization. There would've been conflict between tribes before that, but not that kind of oppression.

There have also been groups who specifically refused to engage in such behaviour, the issue was they largely got exterminated by the groups that would. It's only really in the 20th century with the emergence of concepts like human rights that we've really started to get past that.

It is, however, dangerous to associate all forms of authoritative power (not authoritar[i]ian, note) with fascism, however. Fascism is particularly evil and is a response largely born out of a combination of fear, insecurity, and misanthropy, and without all three, it won't emerge.

[Elder Millennial]

Btw, are we sure it's not simply copied homework? A bit rewritten and optimized...

A much better explanation came out of what exactly it's going on here.

[KrayZ33]

https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreak...is_remarks_at/

and here we are, it's getting normalized.
(obviously just another reason to never do anything for the church btw. If you want to help, never help with money or stuff they could turn into money)

[Twdft]

https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreak...is_remarks_at/

and here we are, it's getting normalized.
(obviously a reason to never do anything for the church btw. If you want to help, never help with money or stuff they could turn into money)

I wonder if Nazis like him set themselves a reminder to stop doing this while on vacation in Germany...

[Gorsameth]

https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreak...is_remarks_at/

and here we are, it's getting normalized.
(obviously just another reason to never do anything for the church btw. If you want to help, never help with money or stuff they could turn into money)

got to love that shit eating grin.
"yes I just did a Nazi salute, what are you going to do about it".

[Edge-]

https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreak...is_remarks_at/

and here we are, it's getting normalized.
(obviously just another reason to never do anything for the church btw. If you want to help, never help with money or stuff they could turn into money)

just gonna be a bunch of people begging to get punched in the face for being confused for being a nazi, apaprently

edit: rofl this chud owns a gaming website still.

[PACOX]

I play with ChatGPT and DeepSeeks free models and DeepSeek is a lot more fun to mess around with and not as restrictive. It not as detailed in is responses as ChatGPT but more personable than ChatGPT. You set ChatGPT to be more casual and get less info and it's almost unbearably cheesy, like an obnoxious child. Even though ChatGPT is more detailed it's not like if actually gives you a better answer, it's just very wordy.


DeepSeek recognizes tone and intent a lot better than ChatGPT. I asked for false information from both and then told both to not fed more cover ups. ChatGPT refused to yield, DeepSeek played along and matched the vibes.


DeepSeek has won this round of the virtual assistant game.

[gondrin]

"Elon Musk is not a Nazi" and "Elon Musk is not just a Nazi" are not the same phrase.



He said they're not a Nazi. That's what I was contesting. You've agreed they said that.



In this case, he opened his argument by claiming "he's not a cunt". Imagine if we were talking cannibalism. This guy would be looking at a picture of Elon Musk with a child's roasted leg in his hands, child-grease smeared all over his face, chewing, and he's arguing "oh, he's not a cannibal."

And that's fucked up. It's a denial of obvious verifiable truth. That's what I took them to task for. And you keep deflecting because he made other criticisms. I don't care. I care about the denial that Musk is a Nazi.

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There's very little evidence of such behaviour in prehistory. It largely only emerged when we developed agriculture, because that allowed for societies to produce enough food for individuals to specialize and require greater organization. There would've been conflict between tribes before that, but not that kind of oppression.

There have also been groups who specifically refused to engage in such behaviour, the issue was they largely got exterminated by the groups that would. It's only really in the 20th century with the emergence of concepts like human rights that we've really started to get past that.

It is, however, dangerous to associate all forms of authoritative power (not authoritar[i]ian, note) with fascism, however. Fascism is particularly evil and is a response largely born out of a combination of fear, insecurity, and misanthropy, and without all three, it won't emerge.

I understand what Elon's ex friend and others are getting at.

It is not so much that Musk is a Nazi in that he is such a malignant narcissist that he will use any group or person to advance his own personal goals. He will use fascism to advance his goals along with the ideologies of those. However, he himself has no ideology other than "Am I getting anything out of this and is someone else losing?". That is it.

And honestly, somehow, it is more evil than typical fascist behavior. Because he will do things regardless of who gets hurt or killed just because he felt like seeing how many people would suffer one day.

Don't get me wrong? In my eyes, he is at a minimum a Nazi sympathizer or a Nazi outright. But since he has no ideology towards anything, I am not really sure what to call him other than pure evil. Absolute pure evil.

[PhaelixWW]

It is not so much that Musk is a Nazi in that he is such a malignant narcissist that he will use any group or person to advance his own personal goals. He will use fascism to advance his goals along with the ideologies of those. However, he himself has no ideology other than "Am I getting anything out of this and is someone else losing?". That is it.

Again, that pretty much describes most far right leaders and "influencers". There's a reason so many of them are exposed as hypocrites, doing things that go against their professed ideology.

Elon isn't special; he's just another Nazi leader.

[Endus]

I understand what Elon's ex friend and others are getting at.

It is not so much that Musk is a Nazi in that he is such a malignant narcissist that he will use any group or person to advance his own personal goals. He will use fascism to advance his goals along with the ideologies of those. However, he himself has no ideology other than "Am I getting anything out of this and is someone else losing?". That is it.

And honestly, somehow, it is more evil than typical fascist behavior. Because he will do things regardless of who gets hurt or killed just because he felt like seeing how many people would suffer one day.

Don't get me wrong? In my eyes, he is at a minimum a Nazi sympathizer or a Nazi outright. But since he has no ideology towards anything, I am not really sure what to call him other than pure evil. Absolute pure evil.

To quote an author (A. R. Moxon); "Historians have a word for Germans who joined the Nazi party, not because they hated Jews, but out of a hope for restored patriotism, or a sense of economic anxiety, or a hope to preserve their religious values, or dislike of their opponents, or raw political opportunism, or convenience, or ignorance, or greed.
That word is "Nazi." Nobody cares about their motives anymore.

They joined what they joined. They lent their support and their moral approval. And, in so doing, they bound themselves to everything that came after. Who cares any more what particular knot they used in the binding?"

I really do not care why someone chooses to be a Nazi. I find it far less important a question than if they are a Nazi or not.

Adding "rampant narcissism" to Moxon's list doesn't change the point. Musk's still a Nazi. I find it incredibly weird that anyone would try and deflect from that conclusion if they supposedly agree with it.

A lot of actual uniform-wearing Germans-in-the-30s-and-40s Nazis weren't Nazis for ideological reasons. They were still Nazis. Still evil. Their reasons for aligning themselves do not matter.

The whole argument leans real close to the mythologizing of the idea of a "clean Wehrmacht"; that rank-and-file Nazi soldiers weren't real Nazis, but just soldiers doing their duty for their country. And that myth is a bit of post-war Nazi propaganda intended to act as Nazi apologism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_o...lean_Wehrmacht

[PhaelixWW]

To quote an author (A. R. Moxon); "Historians have a word for Germans who joined the Nazi party, not because they hated Jews, but out of a hope for restored patriotism, or a sense of economic anxiety, or a hope to preserve their religious values, or dislike of their opponents, or raw political opportunism, or convenience, or ignorance, or greed.
That word is "Nazi." Nobody cares about their motives anymore.

They joined what they joined. They lent their support and their moral approval. And, in so doing, they bound themselves to everything that came after. Who cares any more what particular knot they used in the binding?"

I really do not care why someone chooses to be a Nazi. I find it far less important a question than if they are a Nazi or not.

Adding "rampant narcissism" to Moxon's list doesn't change the point. Musk's still a Nazi. I find it incredibly weird that anyone would try and deflect from that conclusion if they supposedly agree with it.

A lot of actual uniform-wearing Germans-in-the-30s-and-40s Nazis weren't Nazis for ideological reasons. They were still Nazis. Still evil. Their reasons for aligning themselves do not matter.

I narrowly beat you to the punch, but only because I typed less. Go me.

[Ivanstone]

Their reasons for aligning themselves do not matter.

Ok. How about Finland? They allied themselves with the Nazis.

[PhaelixWW]

Ok. How about Finland? They allied themselves with the Nazis.

So did Japan. So did Italy.

Unlike those members of the Tripartite Pact, Finland realized its error in judgment early and declared war on Nazi Germany in 1945.

[Endus]

Ok. How about Finland? They allied themselves with the Nazis.

That's an oversimplification. The USSR invaded Finland in an attempt to conquer them, and they fought them alongside the Reich, but they also turned on the Reich after signing the Moscow Armistice and helped take Nazi Germany down.

They were never a part of the Axis forces proper.

Are we really taking Finland to task for fighting Stalin's invasion?

Their rejection of Nazi Germany and their actions in the Lapland War qualify as a stern rejection of Nazism. We're not talking about branding people for all of history, here, we're talking about active allegiance..

[Ivanstone]

Are we really taking Finland to task for fighting Stalin's invasion?

No. But thanks for acknowledging that motives actually do matter and those motives reveal what kind of people we're dealing with.

[Endus]

No. But thanks for acknowledging that motives actually do matter and those motives reveal what kind of people we're dealing with.

That's not something I actually said. You're just putting words in my mouth rather than engaging in good faith.

Finland never adopted Nazism or fascism themselves. You're confusing "willing to work with the enemy of our enemy" with "ideological alliance".

[Ivanstone]

That's not something I actually said. You're just putting words in my mouth rather than engaging in good faith.

Nobody cares about their motives anymore.

Motives always matter.

Finland never adopted Nazism or fascism themselves. You're confusing "willing to work with the enemy of our enemy" with "ideological alliance".

I am not. I'm just pointing out that life isn't simple. I don't begrudge the average German for living under the Nazi regime.

[ringpriest]

To quote an author (A. R. Moxon); "Historians have a word for Germans who joined the Nazi party, not because they hated Jews, but out of a hope for restored patriotism, or a sense of economic anxiety, or a hope to preserve their religious values, or dislike of their opponents, or raw political opportunism, or convenience, or ignorance, or greed.
That word is "Nazi." Nobody cares about their motives anymore.

They joined what they joined. They lent their support and their moral approval. And, in so doing, they bound themselves to everything that came after. Who cares any more what particular knot they used in the binding?"

I really do not care why someone chooses to be a Nazi. I find it far less important a question than if they are a Nazi or not.

Adding "rampant narcissism" to Moxon's list doesn't change the point. Musk's still a Nazi. I find it incredibly weird that anyone would try and deflect from that conclusion if they supposedly agree with it.

A lot of actual uniform-wearing Germans-in-the-30s-and-40s Nazis weren't Nazis for ideological reasons. They were still Nazis. Still evil. Their reasons for aligning themselves do not matter.

The whole argument leans real close to the mythologizing of the idea of a "clean Wehrmacht"; that rank-and-file Nazi soldiers weren't real Nazis, but just soldiers doing their duty for their country. And that myth is a bit of post-war Nazi propaganda intended to act as Nazi apologism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_o...lean_Wehrmacht

This.

When my grandparents were shooting Nazis, why those Nazis chose to be Nazis was irrelevant. When they were honored for killing Nazis, no one checked why the Nazis they killed had put on their Nazi uniforms. They'd chosen to do so, and that was sufficient. (Many Nazis may not have had a lot of other pleasant choices, but they all had more of a choice than their victims received.)

The only basis for disputing whether Musk is a Nazi or not is whether you want to get pedantic about it. Obviously, he's not in 1930s Germany, and isn't marching around in a Hugo Boss uniform with swastikas, sig runes, and skulls (yet). He is not a registered member of Adolf Hitler's Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei (to the best of my knowledge). Yet, to say that Musk isn't a Nazi is like arguing that a pochard isn't a duck because it doesn't have 'duck' in its name. In every other sense of the word, he is a Nazi. He is colloquially a Nazi. He is figuratively a Nazi. He resembles a Nazi. He demonstrates ties to Nazi ideology. He is a modern-day authoritarian fascist who encourages the targeting of Jews and other minorities. He publishes Nazis, and makes sure Nazis get published. He shows up at Nazi rallies that aren't technically called Nazi rallies because it would be illegal in Germany for them to be called Nazi rallies.

Elon Musk is a Nazi.

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Motives always matter.

Once you're a soldier on the battlefield (or a war criminal running a death camp), motives are irrelevant.

[Pannonian]

https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreak...is_remarks_at/

and here we are, it's getting normalized.
(obviously just another reason to never do anything for the church btw. If you want to help, never help with money or stuff they could turn into money)

Seems not everyone is fine with it being noramlized: https://anglican.ink/2025/01/29/calv...tical-actions/

Dude lost his license at least. Interestingly even an organization that believes in some made up friends in the heavens is aware that it does not really matter "what he had in his heart" as a nazi salute is a nazi salute is a nazi salute.