MrGM Interview with Brian Holinka - New Class/Race Combinations in Dragonflight!

[Sunlonghorn]

Tauren had longwalkers tho. While they're usually scouts and hidden messengers in the books, if you had to assign an existing role to them in WoW, they'd most likely fall into the rogue class. Same as the sunwalkers basically being sun-priest/warriors that happen to share a lot with paladins. Classes just tend to be reductive like that sometimes.

A Longwalker & all sort of other scouts can very easily be a hunter, not necessarily a Rogue. Longwalkers are basically messengers, not really a class but more of like a job? Just a fast scout. Hunters are very scout like with their tracking, eagle eye & agility.

I liked the majority of new race class combos that Cataclysm brought (Tauren Sunwalkers & Seers/Priests worshiping their sun isn't that crazy, especially because Tauren are very spiritual) but Tauren using Arcane (through non drudic means) or being dagger wielding assassins isn't really in-line with with the current lore & identity of the Thunder Bluff faction Tauren.

Same goes for Dreanei as a rogue, doesn't seem to fit in much with their morals or combat style. Especially Light-Forged. Too many class-race combos kind of ruin the identity of races.

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They have been in the game since vanilla, considering Tauren are the best scouts/ messengers in the Horde rogue makes a lot of sense for them

If a hulking orc or 8ft elf can be sneaky there's no reason a Tauren can't, stealth in wow is literally magic as much as it is clandestine

A scout/messenger can very easily be a hunter too, not necessarily a Rogue. Also a scout doesn't really have to fall into any one class really, it's more of like a job? Hunters are very scout like with their tracking, eagle eye & agility.

The orcs & elves, although tall & muscular still have a more agile frame then Tauren & are still smaller. If only we could adjust character body type a bit to look more lean it would be easier to envision. The Shattered Hand Clan are technically mainly Rogues.

Especially Night Elves (assuming you mean them by 8feet tall?) They can literally go invisible as a racial ability. They're very shadow oriented by nature (You know...Night & all). And if it is magical (technically subtlety rogues seem to be the only ones that use some form of shadowy magic) Tauren aren't big fans of it. Even lore wise, the majority of Tauren priests are light aligned & not really shadowy assassins. Maybe the Grimtome sure but as far as I know being dagger wielding assassins isn't really in-line with with the current lore & identity of the Thunder Bluff faction Tauren.

Same goes for Dreanei as a rogue, doesn't seem to fit in much with their morals or combat style. Especially Light-Forged.

Now I get Blizzard will probably write some Lore reasons to make them fit, but not everything is written well or makes sense just because it's there. OH WELL rant over

Too many class-race combos kind of ruin the identity of races. Tauren & Dreanei fit the role of the more peaceful spiritual races.

[dying2live]

Looks like Void Elf Paladins will be a thing at some point. I can imagine that won't sit too well with some people.

bro TBH with you I highly doubt most of folks outside the forums could care any less if they do get Paladins, I know I for one don't care what race play what class but maybe that just me idk if others share the same opinion

[Kyriani]

bro TBH with you I highly doubt most of folks outside the forums could care any less if they do get Paladins, I know I for one don't care what race play what class but maybe that just me idk if others share the same opinion

I'm fine with any race/class combos opening up myself, but there's some people who are losing their shit over stuff like void elf paladins, draenei warlocks, undead druids, etc. I'm fine with whatever tbh.

[Unholyground]

They could easily make Gladiator stance work, they just need to change the tank specific block abilities to be much weaker or create alternate effects for those abilities, like maybe make them small group buffs instead that reduce incoming damage or pull a few spells in to you and then you can spell reflect them all back. They could do really neat things and balance it but lack of imagination hurts their class design team.

[Utrrabbit]

Moving further away from RPG elements and more into action fantasy grinder that has 0 soul or thought behind it. But hey, I was here to watch it destroy itself by catering more and more to the mobile game standards.

Ummm. What. They are literally moving closer to the RPG element giving players more choice and control over their character. You are not that smart are you.

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Still no undead Paladin... Come on the Scarlet Crusade was a thing and they were turned to Undeath many over and make sense over a Stealthy Cow.

Paladins, shamans and others have more to do than just flipping a switch. They got a lot of art assets do not forget.

For paladin they need to design a class charger for every race.
For shaman they need to design totems for each race.
For druids they need to design cat, bear and boomkin forms for each race

All these take time and money to do.

[vian]

Might actually buy the game just to play Tauren Rogue again for real this time.

[Unholyground]

Paladins, shamans and others have more to do than just flipping a switch. They got a lot of art assets do not forget.

For paladin they need to design a class charger for every race.
For shaman they need to design totems for each race.
For druids they need to design cat, bear and boomkin forms for each race

All these take time and money to do.

To be fair though, to this day Blood Elf Paladin still have a red version of the human charger, so tell us another fancy story about why Undead can't be Paladin lmao.

[Julian Rayne]

Void elf Paladins are easy. The Charger, Thalassian Charger and Argent Charger are just recolors or each other (as as the Warhorser, Thalassian Warhorse, and Argent Warhorse).

All Blizzard needs to do is make a purple recolor of it.

[Utrrabbit]

To be fair though, to this day Blood Elf Paladin still have a red version of the human charger, so tell us another fancy story about why Undead can't be Paladin lmao.

CAUSE THEIR MOUNT HAS NOT BEEN MADE.

Are you seriously that daft.

The charger most likely itself took a few weeks ti make and that is just a recolour. Creating full put new mounts may take up to a fw months.

[Unholyground]

CAUSE THEIR MOUNT HAS NOT BEEN MADE.

Are you seriously that daft.

The charger most likely itself took a few weeks ti make and that is just a recolour. Creating full put new mounts may take up to a fw months.

All they have to do is take the racial undead mount and give it some glowing effects, it is not that complicated. They have plenty of shaders pre-coded to give off the glowing effects that they can easily apply.

[Utrrabbit]

All they have to do is take the racial undead mount and give it some glowing effects, it is not that complicated. They have plenty of shaders pre-coded to give off the glowing effects that they can easily apply.

No. It is literally not that easy. If you are going to try say it is. You have zero clue what you are talking about.

[Unholyground]

No. It is literally not that easy. If you are going to try say it is. You have zero clue what you are talking about.

I actually am a game designer and I program, yes it is that easy once you have them built and they have plenty of them built. If you don't know what a shader or a particle effect is why are you talking to me.

[Azadina]

I actually am a game designer and I program, yes it is that easy once you have them built and they have plenty of them built. If you don't know what a shader or a particle effect is why are you talking to me.

Might help the flex to include what caliber game designer. I've made a text game. Does it qualify for those vague terms? If we're splitting hairs, then yes.

[crusadernero]

All they have to do is take the racial undead mount and give it some glowing effects, it is not that complicated. They have plenty of shaders pre-coded to give off the glowing effects that they can easily apply.

If they did "just" that, the forum-goers would melt because its lazy.


Anyway; I think giving all races all classes to pick from somewhat shallows out the world. Its like the whole deal about making every class viable for literally every situation, something Blizzard has tried to do. What did we get? Shallow classes were everyone could do the same and no class was unique.

The game lose depth and the world has less of a meaning. Imagine a Tauren warlock, or a undead paladin. It contradicts the whole nature of those races and the only reason its done is to satisfy players. It got nothing to do with things happening in the world or how its shaped out, its outside factors forcing it in for the sake of it.

It waters down the world that has been buildt up and all the reasons it became to reality in the first place.

That said, it might not matter. For me, its just weird and feels out of place.

[Smeagolski]

Ummm. What. They are literally moving closer to the RPG element giving players more choice and control over their character. You are not that smart are you.

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Paladins, shamans and others have more to do than just flipping a switch. They got a lot of art assets do not forget.

For paladin they need to design a class charger for every race.
For shaman they need to design totems for each race.
For druids they need to design cat, bear and boomkin forms for each race

All these take time and money to do.

This is actually quite wrong, imho. Giving people more choice and control over their character does not exactly mean you increased the RPG element at all.
Take for example on of the definitions of rpg-
"Players take responsibility for acting out these roles within a narrative, either through literal acting or through a process of structured decision-making regarding character development."
If you take that for what it means, it's that role playing without an actual narrative reasons behind it, did only decrease the quality of the rpg element within the game.
Very simple example, somebody says rogue, you think Tauren? If I told my wife to role play as a naughty professor, do you think she'd go and buy a fat eddie murphy costume and come to bed?
There are some things that bring role play to it's value, and that core fantasy getting removed can only hurt the game.
Having a stealth cow stunlock you to death is devaluing the settings this fantasy world brings, thus devaluing the rpg feel, even though you have more "choice".
Choice being correlated to RPG is something you can often see on platforms like youtube, but it's not as easy as that.
Also, see how I did not insult your intelligence, just debated the topic with clear arguements, that can still be disputed and elaborated on? It's nice, innit?

[Unholyground]

Might help the flex to include what caliber game designer. I've made a text game. Does it qualify for those vague terms? If we're splitting hairs, then yes.

2D games is my focus for now. Building a metroidvania where you play as 2 characters in which you can freely switch between (with temporary limitations based on progression of each area) but in some areas only one or the other can safely progress due to their nature and it has full co-op through the entire game with each character having abilities to help the other player or vice versa reach things or progress where the other cannot.

That being said, shaders and particle effects exist whether it is a 2D or 3D game and even with the ancient game engine WoW uses it would be maybe an afternoon worth of effort to add a glow to an old mount lol.

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If they did "just" that, the forum-goers would melt because its lazy.


Anyway; I think giving all races all classes to pick from somewhat shallows out the world. Its like the whole deal about making every class viable for literally every situation, something Blizzard has tried to do. What did we get? Shallow classes were everyone could do the same and no class was unique.

The game lose depth and the world has less of a meaning. Imagine a Tauren warlock, or a undead paladin. It contradicts the whole nature of those races and the only reason its done is to satisfy players. It got nothing to do with things happening in the world or how its shaped out, its outside factors forcing it in for the sake of it.

It waters down the world that has been buildt up and all the reasons it became to reality in the first place.

That said, it might not matter. For me, its just weird and feels out of place.

Blizzard is lazy though we know this so that solution would work for them lol.

[crusadernero]

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Blizzard is lazy though we know this so that solution would work for them lol.

I mean, I get it; Its a free win without them having to do a whole lot. Just chug in Night Elf Paladins, Undead Paladin, Tauren Rogue etc and call it a day. To me, it lessens all of the races background and place in the world.

Theres a reason why the races have been locked into certain classes and while I do agree that some makes sense, others dont. Now we are at the point were its starting to make no sense.

If they are going this route, might aswell give us Gnome Demon Hunters. Now that would be funny.

[Unholyground]

I mean, I get it; Its a free win without them having to do a whole lot. Just chug in Night Elf Paladins, Undead Paladin, Tauren Rogue etc and call it a day. To me, it lessens all of the races background and place in the world.

Theres a reason why the races have been locked into certain classes and while I do agree that some makes sense, others dont. Now we are at the point were its starting to make no sense.

If they are going this route, might aswell give us Gnome Demon Hunters. Now that would be funny.

I and many others have wanted undead Paladin for a long time, there is no logical reason to not have them now with Calia taking leadership of the Forsaken. It gives them more reason to do it.

[crusadernero]

I and many others have wanted undead Paladin for a long time, there is no logical reason to not have them now with Calia taking leadership of the Forsaken. It gives them more reason to do it.

Sure, I respect that. If it does happen, fine. I can live with it, but I just find it weird.

[Tandu]

I'm fine with any race/class combos opening up myself, but there's some people who are losing their shit over stuff like void elf paladins, draenei warlocks, undead druids, etc. I'm fine with whatever tbh.

Undead druids? Hell yes! I'm one of those people. I mean, it actually make sence since wow's druidism is all about balance, but the class mostly focusing on life. If they could somehow reintroduce the nightmare (now tamed by undeads) that would be so epic since there has to be a nightmare if there is balance. Also we are just after the shadowlands, we've met the Winterqueen who represents the part of death in the great cycle of nature. So unded druids themed over the nightmare and the legacy of the Winterqueen (just like night elves and taurens tied to cenarius) is actually make sence and would be so epic. Do not forget how much they resemble shadowlands in our realm, they are basically created to imitate it. So Winterqueen fits perfectly in this picture. It would feel like all that happened before, the stories and the characters have impact on our world not just like we move on. But I doubt they would reskin the abilities just for a race (which could be still available to others throug glyphts and visa versa).

Draenei warlocks and void elf paladins are meh. It not fit at all and might never be. If they introduce the Broken as an allied race (they should have do that instead of lightforged, in my oppinion), could be a solution but those are not "pure draeneis".