SCOTUS removes Roe V Wade

[Edge-]

both popular movements

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tan...-most-cases-2/

There's really only one "popular" movement - the group supporting bodily autonomy. With support of 61% of Americans for abortion access remaining legal in all or most cases. Support for banning abortion access in all or most cases sits at 37%.

[tehdang]

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tan...-most-cases-2/

There's really only one "popular" movement - the group supporting bodily autonomy. With support of 61% of Americans for abortion access remaining legal in all or most cases. Support for banning abortion access in all or most cases sits at 37%.

Gallup has support for legal abortion flipping when the question changes from first 3 months to second 3 months, in terms of "generally legal" question. I'm not as sure as you are in predicting what the future will bring on this.

[cubby]

In the sense that the popular movement precedes the legislative successes. And the popular movement, or both popular movements, are only now truly taking shape. This is the post-Roe and post-Casey world now.

And the abortion movement will continue to be state-by-state until one of two things happen. The GQP gets a national abortion bad through and signed, which is the more likely of the two; or the Democrats get a bodily autonomy amendment added to the constitution (could also be a national law, but SCOTUS might kill it).

Otherwise, we're a backwards nation stuck in the 19th century when it comes to medicine and women's rights...again.

- - - Updated - - -

It's easier to influence state representatives than it is federal. Of them 18 states are democrat senate and assembly, 2 states democrats control one or the other. So, there's a likely 20 states to have sign on immediately. Then it's just a matter of squeezing 13 or so other states legislatures. What suck is now or the last few years would have been the best time to do this, and moving forward it's only going to get harder as it seems (and i could be wrong) the republicans are going to have more seats after midterms.

They will have more House seats, but might actually lose a seat or two in the Senate. I'm now much more curious how the state legislatures and governorships will play out.

[CastletonSnob]

I watched a video on how expensive it is to raise a kid. Women shouldn't be forced to risk financial ruin by having a kid they don't want or might not be able to support. (I know, what a hot take).

[Edge-]

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/10/24/supr...on-rights.html

Supreme Court Justice Samuel Alito, who wrote the majority opinion this summer overturning the abortion rights case Roe v. Wade, assured the late Sen. Ted Kennedy in 2005 that he considered a key legal basis for Roe to be “settled,” a new report reveals.

“I am a believer in precedents,” the conservative Alito told Kennedy, the liberal Massachusetts Democratic senator wrote in his diary in November 2005, The New York Times reported.

“I believe that there is a right to privacy. I think it’s settled as part of the liberty clause of the 14th Amendment and the Fifth Amendment,” Alito said, according to the diary citation.

“So I recognize there is a right to privacy. I’m a believer in precedents. I think on the Roe case that’s about as far as I can go,” Alito said to Kennedy, a staunch defender of abortion rights who died in 2009.

The comment was made as Alito was seeking Senate confirmation to the court during a visit to Kennedy’s office, wrote John Farrell in the Times report. Farrell’s new book, “Ted Kennedy: A Life,” which features details of the diary entries, is being published Tuesday.

Contemporaneous notes at the time are very relevant historical documents are usually taken pretty seriously.

Sure seems like Samuel Alito has spend decades lying to politicians about his views on the right to privacy as guaranteed in the Fourteenth and Fifth Amendments, he was just waiting for the right time to drop the decades-long charade and go full mask-off.

“He had been seeking a promotion and wrote what he thought his bosses wanted to hear. ‘I was a younger person,’ Judge Alito said. ‘I’ve matured a lot.’ ”

Alito also said that his views on Roe being erroneously decided were “personal,” according to Kennedy’s diary.

“Those are personal,” Alito said, Kennedy wrote in the diary. “But I’ve got constitutional responsibilities and those are going to be the determining views.”

Or maybe he stopped caring about the Constitution and started caring more about his personal views. Either way -

Despite that assurance, Kennedy voted against confirming Alito to the Supreme Court.

Like him or not, Ted Kennedy was fuckin right to vote against confirming Alito.

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https://www.msnbc.com/opinion/msnbc-...erlap-n1297896

Curious about another side-effect of the reversal of Roe?

Reports late last month of the arrest of a former Marine with ties to a neo-Nazi group highlight the dangerous and somewhat convoluted relationship between white extremists and the state of reproductive rights in the United States. The man, identified as a leader of the neo-Nazi group Rapekrieg, was reportedly spearheading a mass murder of minorities and mass rape of “white women to increase production of white children,” according to Rolling Stone.

And without access to health care services, many of those victims may likely be forced to carry the child of their rapists, accomplishing the end-goals of the white supremacists.

I'm not taking this shit unseriously anymore, we keep seeing actual Nazi's walking around and hanging signs from overpasses praising Kanye for "speaking the truth about Jews" so they're not even too scared and embarrassed to hide that shit anymore.

[Nymrohd]

I watched a video on how expensive it is to raise a kid. Women shouldn't be forced to risk financial ruin by having a kid they don't want or might not be able to support. (I know, what a hot take).

Most countries place different restrictions on abortion based on the reason behind it; social or economic reasons are among the broad categories why abortion is allowed usually up to a much further point than simply on request.

[The Stormbringer]

I watched a video on how expensive it is to raise a kid. Women shouldn't be forced to risk financial ruin by having a kid they don't want or might not be able to support. (I know, what a hot take).

bUt iT Was HER deCisION TO HavE sex, SO shE HaS TO Face thE coNseqUeNCes

That was me pretending to be one of countless anti-abortion idiots online, just fyi. It's a stupid fucking argument that has its roots based entirely in hatred of women. (Not saying you're saying this, just showing an "argument" I normally see in response to posts like yours)

[shimerra]

Gallup has support for legal abortion flipping when the question changes from first 3 months to second 3 months, in terms of "generally legal" question. I'm not as sure as you are in predicting what the future will bring on this.

How kind of you to agree that the majority of Americans absolutely oppose the GOP's attempt to ban abortions locally and federally in addition to the other GOP initiatives since almost 100% of the GOP's attempts to restrict abortion restrict or ban abortions before 3 months. According to the CDC almost 80% of abortions are performed before the 10th week and about 93% are done before week 13. Which is probably why the GOP is seeking to violate the obvious will of the people with total bans/bans so early most women don't know they're pregnant yet and why you have to be their mouth piece to excuse what's a blatantly not supported by a majority of Americans. Even more do so after the 13th week primarily because of funds/a lack of access to healthcare not because they didn't want to do it earlier.

Most Americans support access to abortions and would prefer less government regulating their personal medical choices in this area. You said yourself in this quote although you tried to obfuscate it because of a lack of integrity. Why do you support big government?

And big surprise generally speaking people don't look for abortions/support them later in pregnancy. Despite what your cheeto god and Tucker "white replacement/nationalist" carlson tell you most people don't get abortions late term because at that point you've long decided you're keeping the child. Pretty basic 2 year old logic even you can follow there. And the people who do get them do so because of medical issues like that fetus you supported a woman giving birth to missing half it's skull. Something that if I recall correctly rendered her unable to have more children and almost killed her. And support for life of the mother exceptions is extremely high which still isn't stopping the GOP from ignoring that and putting women's lives at risk for no reason.


The data's quite predictive. You just don't have a basic understanding or are willfully lying/misrepresenting the numbers to pursue your tribe's narrative. Americans broadly support the right to an abortion and the GOP is directly going against the will of most of the country's citizens.

[tehdang]

How kind of you to agree that the majority of Americans absolutely oppose the GOP's attempt to ban abortions locally and federally in addition to the other GOP initiatives since almost 100% of the GOP's attempts to restrict abortion restrict or ban abortions before 3 months.

Try taking another gander at abortion laws in red states. Arizona, Florida, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Montana, Nebraska, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Utah, and Wyoming do not. There's a great variety of positions by states, but thanks for your "almost 100%" conclusion.

Despite what your cheeto god and Tucker "white replacement/nationalist" carlson tell you ...

Abortion debates always bring out the best in people. Calm down and realize you're interacting with real humans here, not some hideous manifestation from a resistance-type fever dream.

[unfilteredJW]

Try taking another gander at abortion laws in red states. Arizona, Florida, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Montana, Nebraska, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Utah, and Wyoming do not. There's a great variety of positions by states, but thanks for your "almost 100%" conclusion.

Abortion debates always bring out the best in people. Calm down and realize you're interacting with real humans here, not some hideous manifestation from a resistance-type fever dream.

Then stop being a terrible person who supports stripping away peoples rights.

[DarkTZeratul]

Try taking another gander at abortion laws in red states. Arizona, Florida, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Montana, Nebraska, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Utah, and Wyoming do not.

• Arizona is currently a clusterfuck of competing laws, including a 150-year-old law that was never repealed, that one state court said was still valid, and makes no exceptions for rape, incest, or the mother's health.
• Indiana bans all abortions, period. It only makes exceptions for rape and incest up to 10 weeks, and for fetal abnormalities up to 20 weeks. There's no time limit if the mother's health is "at serious risk," but there are plenty of examples of how "serious risk" is insufficiently clear. In addition, the language of the law is also vague enough that it could be interpreted to ban multiple forms of contraception.
• Kansas does protect abortion entirely via the state constitution, though you may recall how Republicans recently fought like hell to get that repealed (and lost spectacularly).
• North Dakota also bans all abortions whatsoever except for rape or incest, or to save the mother's life (a phrase which is perhaps more clear than Indiana's "at serious risk," but nevertheless comes with many of the same problems).
• Ohio currently allows abortions up to 22 weeks, but only because the courts blocked a law that would ban it at 6 weeks.
• Oklahoma also bans all abortions except for rape, incest, or endangerment of the mother's life.
• South Carolina does not ban abortions before 20 weeks, but that is absolutely not for lack of trying.
• And, finally, Wyoming also outlaws all abortions except for rape, incest, or to protect the life or health (but not mental health) of the mother.

Really, you could have at least tried to ensure your point was accurate. That's a third of the states you listed that do, in fact, have a near-total ban on abortion before 3 months. This information was not difficult to find.

[tehdang]

• Arizona is currently a clusterfuck of competing laws, including a 150-year-old law that was never repealed, that one state court said was still valid, and makes no exceptions for rape, incest, or the mother's health.
• Indiana bans all abortions, period. It only makes exceptions for rape and incest up to 10 weeks, and for fetal abnormalities up to 20 weeks. There's no time limit if the mother's health is "at serious risk," but there are plenty of examples of how "serious risk" is insufficiently clear. In addition, the language of the law is also vague enough that it could be interpreted to ban multiple forms of contraception.
• Kansas does protect abortion entirely via the state constitution, though you may recall how Republicans recently fought like hell to get that repealed (and lost spectacularly).
• North Dakota also bans all abortions whatsoever except for rape or incest, or to save the mother's life (a phrase which is perhaps more clear than Indiana's "at serious risk," but nevertheless comes with many of the same problems).
• Ohio currently allows abortions up to 22 weeks, but only because the courts blocked a law that would ban it at 6 weeks.
• Oklahoma also bans all abortions except for rape, incest, or endangerment of the mother's life.
• South Carolina does not ban abortions before 20 weeks, but that is absolutely not for lack of trying.
• And, finally, Wyoming also outlaws all abortions except for rape, incest, or to protect the life or health (but not mental health) of the mother.

Really, you could have at least tried to ensure your point was accurate. That's a third of the states you listed that do, in fact, have a near-total ban on abortion before 3 months. This information was not difficult to find.

Thought my source had updated since August, but I guess I gotta go back and update.

Also, don't give me that bs on "not for lack of trying" when the article says "Tuesday’s 95-11 vote in the House — with almost all the chamber’s Democrats joining most of the Republicans."

[Blur4stuff]

Republicans fucked up so bad on this issue. If they had a unified voice on this with a reasonable week limit (more than 6 obviously) and some clearly defined exceptions (nothing vague like "life of the mother") they could have kneecapped the voter turnout dems are getting.

Somehow they seem unable to process that many abortions need to take place that have nothing to do with whether or not the mother wants the baby. There are millions of voters that would have been on the republican's side if their position had been more sane than outright banning abortion.

[DarkTZeratul]

Also, don't give me that bs on "not for lack of trying" when the article says "Tuesday’s 95-11 vote in the House — with almost all the chamber’s Democrats joining most of the Republicans."

So you agree with me, then, that they tried to pass a more comprehensive ban even though the effort ultimately failed. And that's leaving aside that South Carolina has been passing abortion restrictions purely to try and overturn Roe v. Wade for years.

But also, looking closer, South Carolina also passed a heartbeat law that effectively bans abortions at 6 weeks, but is in the same boat as Ohio in that the courts blocked it for the time being.

And this is all, of course, to say nothing of the multiple prominent Republicans in Congress that have made it explicitly clear that they intend to impose a federal ban on abortions as soon as they're able.

[Cthulhu 2020]

And this is all, of course, to say nothing of the multiple prominent Republicans in Congress that have made it explicitly clear that they intend to impose a federal ban on abortions as soon as they're able.

Do Democrats even need to campaign? Seems Republicans are giving voters a reason to get off their asses and vote Democrat more than ever before. Banning abortion is a sure fire road to losing.

[s_bushido]

Do Democrats even need to campaign? Seems Republicans are giving voters a reason to get off their asses and vote Democrat more than ever before. Banning abortion is a sure fire road to losing.

Yes. 2016 proved that even if your opponent is a worthless sack of flaming dogshit left by a prankster on your front porch, poor campaigning and the impression that victory is assured can still sink a candidate.

[Dontrike]

Abortion debates always bring out the best in people. Calm down and realize you're interacting with real humans here,

Just real people like you that want to take away the rights of other people, for no reason.

[Belize]

Abortion debates always bring out the best in people. Calm down and realize you're interacting with real humans

Maybe start treating women as real people first, and then we'll talk about being civil to Conservatives.

[Edge-]

https://www.commondreams.org/news/20...-role-abortion

"There should not be involvement from the federal government in how states decide their abortion decisions," Oz said when asked about his position on abortion, which has become a central midterm issue following the U.S. Supreme Court's June decision in Dobbs v. Jackson Women's Health Organization.

"I want women, doctors, local political leaders letting the democracy that's always allowed our nation to thrive to put the best ideas forward so states can decide for themselves," Oz added.

In which Oz argues the Federal Government should actively play a role in this by intentionally staying out of it.

And that local politicians should apparently have a say in what women can and can't do with their bodies. I'm not sure what a local politician has to do with deciding individuals bodily autonomy.

Because as always, Republican ultimately want to determine what girls and women can and can't do with their bodies.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

Do Democrats even need to campaign? Seems Republicans are giving voters a reason to get off their asses and vote Democrat more than ever before. Banning abortion is a sure fire road to losing.

Republican enthusiasm for the election is still higher than Democrat. Yes, they need to campaign. They need to campaign hard. Democrats made the mistake of "I don't like Trump...but I don't really like Clinton either...I think I'll sit this one out" back in 2016.