1. #7181
    I am just going to say it, "Pro-Life" isn't really pro-life, especially when they prioritize a non-viable fetus over the life and health of the supposed mother. It's, as George Carlin said, Anti-Women. They want to inflict consequences on to women for women daring to have and enjoy sex, regardless if that sex is to create life or not.

    I've been starting to believe for a while now that pro-choice is the real pro-life.

    As having a choice to have access to birth control and abortion respects the autonomy of the person choosing to use them. Pro choice respects their mental health as the woman should have the choice to not have a baby as the result of rape and/or incest. Pro choice respects their physical health as sometimes a pregnancy is non-viable and can harm or even kill the pregnant woman in question if an abortion is not performed (IE the above case, or any ectopic pregnancy, miscarriage that doesn't flush out of the body). And pro choice respects the financial stability of the woman if they believe their current financial situation isn't stable enough to bring life in to the world and be able to take care of it.

  2. #7182
    Quote Originally Posted by RampageBW1 View Post
    I am just going to say it, "Pro-Life" isn't really pro-life, especially when they prioritize a non-viable fetus over the life and health of the supposed mother. It's, as George Carlin said, Anti-Women. They want to inflict consequences on to women for women daring to have and enjoy sex, regardless if that sex is to create life or not.

    I've been starting to believe for a while now that pro-choice is the real pro-life.

    As having a choice to have access to birth control and abortion respects the autonomy of the person choosing to use them. Pro choice respects their mental health as the woman should have the choice to not have a baby as the result of rape and/or incest. Pro choice respects their physical health as sometimes a pregnancy is non-viable and can harm or even kill the pregnant woman in question if an abortion is not performed (IE the above case, or any ectopic pregnancy, miscarriage that doesn't flush out of the body). And pro choice respects the financial stability of the woman if they believe their current financial situation isn't stable enough to bring life in to the world and be able to take care of it.
    I'll maybe catch some flak here but I do think a lot of "pro-life" people are genuine in their belief that it's for the best, in one way or another. I have a couple friends who don't like abortions or think it should be a bit more restricted (I'm Canadian, it's practically unregulated here). A lot of their arguments hinge mostly on late-term abortions, or ye old life is sacred stuff. I don't agree with them and make it clear, yet all but one are OK with the practice being legal and not really regulated as they also think it's too much of a personal choice to leave it to the authorities.

    But I think the people who have those beliefs and don't necessarily want to impose them unto others aren't represented much by the Republican higher-ups. They're either extremists on the subject who want abortion to stop as a practice altogether, or (more commonly IMO) beholden to donors and a particularly active voter base that wants to stop it. It's a policy driven in very large part by the party's extreme social conservatives. That's why it goes so far in so many instances and why Roe was needed; give an inch, and the religious nuts will most definitely take an arm if they can, because for them there's no way abortion can ever be OK as they view it as murder.
    It is all that is left unsaid upon which tragedies are built -Kreia

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  3. #7183
    Dreadlord Karreck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milchshake View Post
    Ongoing in: Cruelty and misogyny is the Point
    It always was.
    Princesses can kill knights to rescue dragons.

  4. #7184
    The Lightbringer
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    At this point it feels like they're fishing for another Supreme Court hearing so they can try and get even more restrictions put on it nation wide.

    But I'm 100% open to the idea that they're just being cruel for the sake of their shitty ideological purity and to virtue signal to the deplorables that vote for them.

  5. #7185
    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    I'll maybe catch some flak here but I do think a lot of "pro-life" people are genuine in their belief that it's for the best, in one way or another. I have a couple friends who don't like abortions or think it should be a bit more restricted (I'm Canadian, it's practically unregulated here). A lot of their arguments hinge mostly on late-term abortions, or ye old life is sacred stuff.
    A woman being denied an abortion of a fetus that will not survive no matter what... for whom exactly do your friends think this is the best?

  6. #7186
    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    I'll maybe catch some flak here but I do think a lot of "pro-life" people are genuine in their belief that it's for the best, in one way or another. I have a couple friends who don't like abortions or think it should be a bit more restricted (I'm Canadian, it's practically unregulated here). A lot of their arguments hinge mostly on late-term abortions, or ye old life is sacred stuff. I don't agree with them and make it clear, yet all but one are OK with the practice being legal and not really regulated as they also think it's too much of a personal choice to leave it to the authorities.

    But I think the people who have those beliefs and don't necessarily want to impose them unto others aren't represented much by the Republican higher-ups. They're either extremists on the subject who want abortion to stop as a practice altogether, or (more commonly IMO) beholden to donors and a particularly active voter base that wants to stop it. It's a policy driven in very large part by the party's extreme social conservatives. That's why it goes so far in so many instances and why Roe was needed; give an inch, and the religious nuts will most definitely take an arm if they can, because for them there's no way abortion can ever be OK as they view it as murder.


    Well, when I say Pro life, I mean the politicians that usurped the phrase to use as a weapon against the pro-choice movement.

  7. #7187
    March of Dimes 2023 Report Card.

    • 8 states and Puerto Rico earned an “F” (Alabama, Arkansas, Georgia, Kentucky, Louisiana, Mississippi, South Carolina, West Virginia)
    • 4 states earned a “D-” (Missouri, Nebraska, Oklahoma, Texas)
    • 5 states earned a “D” (Delaware, Indiana, Nevada, Ohio, Tennessee)
    • 6 states earned a “D+” (Florida, Kansas, Michigan, North Carolina, South Dakota, Wyoming)
    • 5 states and Washington D.C. earned a “C-” (Iowa, Maryland, New Mexico, North Dakota, Wisconsin)
    • 6 states earned a “C” (Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Montana, Virginia)
    • 7 states earned a “C+” (Connecticut, Maine, Minnesota, New Jersey, New York, Pennsylvania, Utah)
    • 3 states earned a “B-” (California, Massachusetts, Rhode Island)
    • 4 states earned a “B” (Idaho, Oregon, Vermont, Washington)
    • 1 state earned a “B+” (New Hampshire)
    • **No states earned an “A”

    Some states are not even trying.

    New Texas maternal mortality report shows disparities persist
    The Maternal Mortality and Morbidity Review Committee report, delayed by more than three months, estimates that up to 90% of the deaths may have been preventable. Severe complications from pregnancy and childbirth also increased significantly.


    They kept trying.

    Missouri Republicans propose legislation to allow women who receive abortions to be charged with murder

    So which states have tried to do the same so far.

    But identical legislation to allow women to be charged for having an abortion was introduced earlier this year in Missouri and similar bills were introduced in other states, including Arkansas, Colorado, Georgia, Kentucky and South Carolina, although none were advanced by a legislative committee.


    Except for Colorado, the rest are F or D- grade states.
    Last edited by Rasulis; 2023-12-10 at 01:52 AM.

  8. #7188
    Quote Originally Posted by Twdft View Post
    A woman being denied an abortion of a fetus that will not survive no matter what... for whom exactly do your friends think this is the best?
    I don't want to speak for them or get into too many specifics on behalf of people who aren't me. As I said I don't agree with their arguments in the first place.
    It is all that is left unsaid upon which tragedies are built -Kreia

    The internet: where to every action is opposed an unequal overreaction.

  9. #7189
    Reforged Gone Wrong The Stormbringer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    I don't want to speak for them or get into too many specifics on behalf of people who aren't me. As I said I don't agree with their arguments in the first place.
    Ah, so they're just stupid. Understandable, I'd say everyone has some stupid friends.

  10. #7190
    What we are seeing in Texas, and the South in general, is the future that women in the United States will face if Republicans have full control of abortion rights.

    A future where a woman and her doctor, and her husband also, have to ask a judge's PERMISSION to get an abortion of an unviable fetus for health reason. When the permission is granted, a MAN seated in the state attorney's general office, with no medical background, says "No." Then the state's high court put everything on hold while the woman and her family suffer in fear and uncertainty.

    They won't stop there either.

    Republican Lawmaker Rants About Contraception Going Against Nature

    On Wednesday, the Wisconsin State Assembly voted 82-11 in a bipartisan fashion to allow statewide pharmacists to prescribe contraceptive patches and self-administered oral hormonal contraceptives without a doctor's prescription. Current state law only allows women to obtain most birth control through a prescription written by a doctor or advanced practice nurse.

    Wisconsin state Representative Chuck Wichgers, one of the 11 Republicans who voted against the bill, said Wednesday prior to the bill's passing that contraception leads to infidelity, a "proliferation of STDs," and is unnatural.


    These are the people US constituents elected to office.

    "
    It opens up the door to marital infidelity, and it did," Wichgers said, referencing unknown religious leaders. "The government might force contraceptives upon married couples; that's happened in other countries. So, the government gets to have a role—they get to play 'supreme ruler.'"

    After being booed by some members for his remarks, Wichgers continued on, saying that contraception increases disrespect by men towards women who "have to control the natural reproductive course of the body."

    "Nature has an intention and when you have that act—when pregnancy naturally occurs, that's nature doing what nature does. The woman then has to counter nature by taking something that is highly systemic and highly invasive, according to the documents and the books that people that are pro the pill stated in their books," the Republican representative said.

    Wichgers continued: "That's a science. We would begin to see ourselves as the ultimate masters of nature, so when nature does something it's supposed to do and then we say, 'Let's not do that'—we're talking not about getting a pimple if you eat Doritos and eat chocolate; that would be contrary to a health movement or nature."


    Yeah. Not much to comment on. Next the US current speaker of the house.

    Fox News Host Confronts Mike Johnson on Birth Control Access

    While appearing on Fox News Sunday, Bream noted that Johnson had been accused of being "wildly out of step" with Americans on birth control, in which 92 percent of Americans say it's morally acceptable, according to a 2022 Gallup poll.

    "He supported bans that would not only criminalize abortion, but ban IVF treatments and common forms of birth control and that you voted against access to contraception," Bream said, quoting EMILYs List, a political action committee aimed at electing women who support abortion rights. "Is that an accurate assessment of where you are? Because that's not in step with the American people."
    Last edited by Rasulis; 2023-12-10 at 09:19 PM.

  11. #7191
    Glasses and contacts lenses go against nature. Artificial hair color goes against nature. Clothing goes against nature.

    These people are dangerous extremists who haven't actually spent a second critically thinking in their lives, apparently.

  12. #7192
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Glasses and contacts lenses go against nature. Artificial hair color goes against nature. Clothing goes against nature.

    These people are dangerous extremists who haven't actually spent a second critically thinking in their lives, apparently.
    The scary part is that "they were elected to office." There is always going to be the "village idiots." However, sane people don't put them in positions of power.

  13. #7193
    Old God Captain N's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rasulis View Post
    The scary part is that "they were elected to office." There is always going to be the "village idiots." However, sane people don't put them in positions of power.
    Then there are an awful lot of lunatics running around polling stations casting votes.
    “You're not to be so blind with patriotism that you can't face reality. Wrong is wrong, no matter who does it or says it.”― Malcolm X

    I watch them fight and die in the name of freedom. They speak of liberty and justice, but for whom? -Ratonhnhaké:ton (Connor Kenway)

  14. #7194
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Glasses and contacts lenses go against nature. Artificial hair color goes against nature. Clothing goes against nature.

    These people are dangerous extremists who haven't actually spent a second critically thinking in their lives, apparently.
    Curing diseases goes against nature.

    Would they be comfortable with their children being denied treatment for measles or the like? "Just let nature take its course"?

    These people are liars and grifters. None of them believe the shit they're spewing. It's all an intentionally dishonest cover for their misogyny and sadism. Every single last pro-lifer. Yes, even that one you just thought of. Being pro-life is like being a white supremacist; I don't care how much you think it's justified, you're admitting to being a bad person. And yes; I think it's exactly that clear-cut.


  15. #7195
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Curing diseases goes against nature.

    Would they be comfortable with their children being denied treatment for measles or the like? "Just let nature take its course"?

    These people are liars and grifters. None of them believe the shit they're spewing. It's all an intentionally dishonest cover for their misogyny and sadism. Every single last pro-lifer. Yes, even that one you just thought of. Being pro-life is like being a white supremacist; I don't care how much you think it's justified, you're admitting to being a bad person. And yes; I think it's exactly that clear-cut.
    Also Guns are against nature.

  16. #7196
    Titan Lenonis's Avatar
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    I've frequently asked the "abortion is murder" crowd how many years in prison a woman should get for a miscarriage.

    I've never once gotten an answer other than an offended "how dare you" - which...I mean if abortion is murder than logically miscarraiges are manslaughter.

    I'm starting to wonder if I'll actually get an answer from state governments. Because it's only a small jump to get to this extreme from where they are pushing.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Does he wear contacts? Wear glasses? Take antibiotics? Vitamins?

    How these people can't see the hypocrisy is beyond me.
    Forum badass alert:
    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana Violence View Post
    It's called resistance / rebellion.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rochana Violence View Post
    Also, one day the tables might turn.

  17. #7197
    https://apnews.com/article/abortion-...4186f4d1e6e8bd

    A pregnant Texas woman who sought court permission for an abortion in an unprecedented challenge to one of the most restrictive bans in the U.S. has left the state to obtain the procedure, her attorneys said Monday.

    The announcement came as Kate Cox, 31, was awaiting a ruling from the Texas Supreme Court over whether she could legally obtain an abortion under narrow exceptions to the state’s ban. A judge gave Cox permission last week but that decision was put on hold by the state’s all-Republican high court.

    “Her health is on the line. She’s been in and out of the emergency room and she couldn’t wait any longer,” said Nancy Northup, president and CEO of the Center for Reproductive Rights, which was representing Cox.

    The organization did not disclose where Cox went.
    So much freedom that apparently pregnant women need to flee the state to receive the care they actually need because the state of Texas will not allow them to receive it or doctors to provide it within the borders of the state.

    Note that where she traveled to was kept secret.

    Doctors have told Cox that her fetus is at a high risk for a condition known as trisomy 18, which has a very high likelihood of miscarriage or stillbirth, and low survival rates, according to the lawsuit.

    They also told Cox that inducing labor or carrying the baby to term could jeopardize her ability to have another child in the future.
    Reminder: That the "pro-life/woman/baby" Republicans, if this woman didn't have the means to travel out of state, would literally be putting this woman's health and her ability to ever have children again.

  18. #7198
    Reforged Gone Wrong The Stormbringer's Avatar
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    People just need to start fleeing that fucking state, or any other state that's this prohibitive with abortion. I know, it absolutely sucks, uprooting your whole life, finding another job elsewhere, leaving behind family and friends, but staying is just going to cause horrible amounts of stress, trauma, and expense. How much of their OWN MONEY do you think they had to spend to go to court about this? Not to mention all the emergency room visits. Sigh.

  19. #7199
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Also Guns are against nature.
    To be fair I wouldn't be surprised if some american guns have escaped into the wilds and procreated at this point.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by The Stormbringer View Post
    People just need to start fleeing that fucking state, or any other state that's this prohibitive with abortion. I know, it absolutely sucks, uprooting your whole life, finding another job elsewhere, leaving behind family and friends, but staying is just going to cause horrible amounts of stress, trauma, and expense. How much of their OWN MONEY do you think they had to spend to go to court about this? Not to mention all the emergency room visits. Sigh.
    Double dip too because your own damn taxpayer money go into having this blowhard AG be paid to take you to court for this nonsense

  20. #7200
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gigantique View Post
    To be fair I wouldn't be surprised if some american guns have escaped into the wilds and procreated at this point.
    I'm sure in the backwater regions of Kentucky, swamps of Florida, and rural Texas, there are vast and intricate mating rituals between a man and the firearm they fancy.
    I'm sure there are woman too, but no lady seems to want to crank out a clip of hollow points much less a gun from her vagoo.
    Quote Originally Posted by Crissi View Post
    Quit using other posters as levels of crazy. That is not ok


    If you look, you can see the straw man walking a red herring up a slippery slope coming to join this conversation.

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