SCOTUS removes Roe V Wade

[Draco-Onis]

He's actually the most liked Democratic Senator in your entire damned caucus, if we poll Senators within their state.

ROFLMAO that is the dumbest thing ever most senators are popular in their state that's how they keep getting re-elected every term. That's like saying you are popular with your mom and dad.

[Elegiac]

Wait what? This seems like a weirdly specific poll. You got a link? Not that I doubt you, but more that I'm just curious who would commission such an oddly specific poll with such limited value in it. And to see what the other poll numbers are like.

Edit: Unless you're wording "he's popular with voters in his state" weirdly - https://www.wboy.com/news/west-virgi...west-virginia/

Though if you go to the poll it appears that Patrick Leahy is actually the most popular Democratic Senator with voters in his home state, and if we actually take the disapproval rating into the final number then Manchin would also be behind Ed Markey (-2% positive approval, but also -7% to disapproval, resulting in Markey coming out with a +5 over Manchin).

tehdang lying about easily researched information. Shocker.

[masterhorus8]

tehdang lying about easily researched information. Shalcker.

There, typo fixed.

[tehdang]

Wait what? This seems like a weirdly specific poll. You got a link? Not that I doubt you, but more that I'm just curious who would commission such an oddly specific poll with such limited value in it. And to see what the other poll numbers are like.

Edit: Unless you're wording "he's popular with voters in his state" weirdly - https://www.wboy.com/news/west-virgi...west-virginia/

Though if you go to the poll it appears that Patrick Leahy is actually the most popular Democratic Senator with voters in his home state, and if we actually take the disapproval rating into the final number then Manchin would also be behind Ed Markey (-2% positive approval, but also -7% to disapproval, resulting in Markey coming out with a +5 over Manchin).

I misstated it. This was the morning consult poll measuring change in job performance approval rating. He leads the list in Senators whose performance in the Biden presidency over the last year improved.

https://morningconsult.com/2022/04/2...ch-paying-off/

It's a little less relevant to the DINO angle, but relevant to his ability to represent West Virginians.

[Elegiac]

I misstated it. This was the morning consult poll measuring change in job performance approval rating. He leads the list in Senators whose performance in the Biden presidency over the last year improved.

https://morningconsult.com/2022/04/2...ch-paying-off/

It's a little less relevant to the DINO angle, but relevant to his ability to represent West Virginians.

Your own link points out the gains made are mostly among Republicans (i.e. people who didn't vote for him and are not representative of the Democratic caucus).

So no, habibi, you're still lying and trying to walk it back.

[Edge-]

I misstated it. This was the morning consult poll measuring change in job performance approval rating. He leads the list in Senators whose performance in the Biden presidency over the last year improved.

https://morningconsult.com/2022/04/2...ch-paying-off/

Which is a very different metric than, "Most popular Democratic Senator with their constituents". That's the same poll linked from the article I linked.

It's a little less relevant to the DINO angle, but relevant to his ability to represent West Virginians.

Nobody is arguing he's doing a poor job of representing his constituents, and despite the eagerness to portray Democrats as embracing the "DINO" term in the way Republicans have embraced "RINO", it's still not a "thing".

[tehdang]

Which is a very different metric than, "Most popular Democratic Senator with their constituents". That's the same poll linked from the article I linked.

Hence, the "misstated it."

Nobody is arguing he's doing a poor job of representing his constituents, and despite the eagerness to portray Democrats as embracing the "DINO" term in the way Republicans have embraced "RINO", it's still not a "thing".

I was responding to someone that seemed pretty eager. You saw and also responded, so I don't get why you're saying this.

[Endus]

Which is a very different metric than, "Most popular Democratic Senator with their constituents". That's the same poll linked from the article I linked.



Nobody is arguing he's doing a poor job of representing his constituents, and despite the eagerness to portray Democrats as embracing the "DINO" term in the way Republicans have embraced "RINO", it's still not a "thing".

The whole argument you're having boils down to tehdang being completely blindly partisan and ignoring that votes and bills actually mean something and that ignoring that context is willful ignorance if not deliberate shitposting and disinformation.

Manchin isn't "bad" because he doesn't toe the Democrat party line. He's "bad" because he's a fucking neoliberal bigot shitmonger who's more focused on his career and personal wealth and infliction of suffering on innocents than he is on responsible governance.

Whether he's a Democrat or voting along party lines is irrelevant, fundamentally. He's an expression of the electorate's fundamental malice.

[Edge-]

I was responding to someone that seemed pretty eager. You saw and also responded, so I don't get why you're saying this.

One person, does not a trend make.

[tehdang]

One person, does not a trend make.

Again, I don't get you. I quote responded to a person on this forum that was eager to portray Manchin that way. Don't unperson somebody on the forum just because you want to minimize his perspective. I wasn't responding to 5 people, I was responding to him.

[Edge-]

Again, I don't get you. I quote responded to a person on this forum that was eager to portray Manchin that way.

Absent the specific term, which you introduced.

Don't unperson somebody on the forum just because you want to minimize his perspective.

I'm not. Factually, one person does not a trend make.

[NED funded]

I hate republicans so much

[VMSmith]

I'm not absolutely certain, but didn't Democrats hold the entirety of Congress and the Presidency with a 60-vote majority in early 2010? When they passed the ACA?

What stopped them from making abortion legal besides Roe v Wade then? It couldn't have been a lack of time, as the vote taken today was arranged over the course of ... what, a week or two?

[Endus]

I'm not absolutely certain, but didn't Democrats hold the entirety of Congress and the Presidency with a 60-vote majority in early 2010? When they passed the ACA?

What stopped them from making abortion legal besides Roe v Wade then? It couldn't have been a lack of time, as the vote taken today was arranged over the course of ... what, a week or two?

Fun fact; most Democrats are bigotry-driven neoliberals, too. There hasn't been a left-right divide in the USA since, like, the early 19th Century. Democrats have been pretty consistently center-right, and they've done as much as Republicans, traditionally, to maintain the white supremacist core of the USA.

The Republicans have gone way off the deep end the last decade or so, but let's recall Biden himself was behind the big crime bill in the '90s that is largely responsible for basically every modern problem with racist police policies today. And that shit wasn't accidental oversight.

"Not as violently racist as Republicans, at least" has basically been the Democratic core for, like, 50 years.

[Jastall]

I'm not absolutely certain, but didn't Democrats hold the entirety of Congress and the Presidency with a 60-vote majority in early 2010? When they passed the ACA?

What stopped them from making abortion legal besides Roe v Wade then? It couldn't have been a lack of time, as the vote taken today was arranged over the course of ... what, a week or two?

Likely because nobody thought Roe was going away anytime soon so it wasn't a pressing issue. Passing ACA was already an uphill battle as it was, and cost the Democrats a lot later down the line even with how tame it ended up being. Then of course 2016 happened and in one single election the ACA, Obama's one actual achievement such as it is, was ripped to shreds and SCOTUS veered right for literal decades to come. It's a case of poor projection and Democrat leadership being incapable of keeping their eyes on the prize.

Plus, as Endus said Democrats aren't actually that fan of rocking the boat. Beyond a couple issues that drive publicity and donors most aren't that different from Republicans. It's just that the Republicans, since a while ago but especially after Obama's first election, have spiraled downwards into a reactionary and regressive frenzy so the center-right people who are mostly about upholding the status quo look highly progressive in comparison, but it's mostly surface level.

[s_bushido]

What stopped them from making abortion legal besides Roe v Wade then? It couldn't have been a lack of time, as the vote taken today was arranged over the course of ... what, a week or two?

The Democrat establishment is basically the same as any company that panders to progressive issues. They don't come around on them until there's overwhelming public support. That, and I'm not sure how many people actually expected the SCOTUS to hand down this generation's Dred Scott decision...

[VMSmith]

Thanks for the answers. They line up pretty much with what I expected but had hoped I had missed something that put a positive spin on it.

It really makes voting in the US feel nearly pointless Except, perhaps, for local issues. Except when governors don't like letting cities make rules for themselves. Ugh.

They really nearly all do only care about their positions and power and money, don't they?

[Kaleredar]

The Democrat establishment is basically the same as any company that panders to progressive issues. They don't come around on them until there's overwhelming public support. That, and I'm not sure how many people actually expected the SCOTUS to hand down this generation's Dred Scott decision...

I think people assumed it was settled law. You know, like the conservative supreme court judge nominees said it was when they were up for the position. No need to pass a law that was already settled... or so they thought.

[s_bushido]

It really makes voting in the US feel nearly pointless

It's not pointless. Our democracy may be fundamentally flawed (since the GOP has rigged much of the game in their favor to maintain their minority rule), but had Hillary won in 2016 none of this would be happening. It would be her SCOTUS nominees on the bench, and that court wouldn't be in the process of further undermining the country.

[Mihalik]

It's not pointless. Our democracy may be fundamentally flawed (since the GOP has rigged much of the game in their favor to maintain their minority rule), but had Hillary won in 2016 none of this would be happening. It would be her SCOTUS nominees on the bench, and that court wouldn't be in the process of further undermining the country.

How much do you wanna bet that come November the Jimmy Dores of the "left" will come out of the woodwork shrieking about how "Voting is pointless!"?