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  1. #721
    Herald of the Titans Tuor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coffeh View Post
    I wonder if people who say these types of things actually believe this crap, or they're just trolling.

    I played since Vanilla. The best social interactions I ever had in the game was the last year of Wrath. As a casual I finally was doing dungeons at endgame, and a LOT of dungeons thanks to LFD. I met so many people. I had a lot of great conversations. It was an amazing experience. The content was fun and incredibly accessible.

    Now Blizz takes dungeon finder away in Wrath and it's nothing but LFG spam with a macro. No social interaction. No communication. No community building. Pure business. Endless gatekeeping due to spec choice or gear. You're not a player; you're a gearscore. That is the reality of TBC Classic, and that is going to be the reality of Wrath Classic. Which is a shame because dungeon finder fixed so much of this toxic, game-breaking, community-destroying nonsense.
    My server people just ignored eachother on LFD, anyone barely speaked, they just rushed to the end of the dungeon.

  2. #722
    As it sits, having played on warmane with LFD active and playing some beta with the retail grouping tool... I'm pretty easy either way.

    YES hitting the "join queue" button, getting a dungeon pop, joining, smashing through it and going back to what you were doing was great. I DO think it's the start of a slippery slope away from the stuff that gives wow its... overall pull (having to make friends and getting in guilds/regular pugs for end game content). Playing an MMO as a single player game where interaction is only something done for more play options.... probably ISN'T the best for the game overall. Appreciate some folks just don't have the time and want a pick up n play style of game, there's a lot of alternative games that offer that.

    The retail LFG tool is COMPLETELY fine, there will be a tonne of groups a lot of the time and I think a lot of the anger at no LFD will disappear quite quickly once folks get started on wrath and using it. There's currently a restriction on even posting in LFG channel (it being the only global) unless you or your group is listed in the LFG tool (another good direction imo, easily worked around ofc but at least it forces interaction with the tool by most people so... it'll become more normalised for use and give us healthier grouping options).

    NOT having LFD and by extension NOT heading into LFR/etc could well make for quite a serious change in mindset from the player base as time goes on. Community rep/etc start playing a bigger part, toxicity is SLIGHTLY more neutered as assholes get side-lined and it might end up with a better community down the line depending where classic goes from wrath onwards.

    The LFG tool in wrath now (having messed with it in beta) is a COMPLETELY fine alternative to LFD/RDF. Wait up and see how it plays before deciding the sky has fallen.
    Last edited by mercutiouk; 2022-08-03 at 09:05 PM.
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  3. #723
    Herald of the Titans Daffan's Avatar
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    RDF at its core was never a huge problem imho.

    It's just the execution was horrible and a lot of people hated it for that.
    Content drought is a combination of catchup mechanics and no new content.

  4. #724
    I interact with plenty of people. and have not talked with one person in game in server chat that thinks not having RFD is a good idea.. I currently have 9 70s in TBC soon to be 10. I do dungeons with guildies on a few then its up to me.. I don't need more bffs.. I need to get the dungeon done. and immersion, flying to the dungeon and sitting in a dal for hrs so everyone can see your shiny gear is so immersive... id rather be keeping busy...
    Last edited by warbagel; 2022-08-12 at 12:30 AM.

  5. #725
    Quote Originally Posted by Tuor View Post
    My server people just ignored eachother on LFD, anyone barely spoke, they just rushed to the end of the dungeon.
    Unless you are on an RP server. This was everyones experience with content like wrath. We all knew the fights the dungeons were easy. We just blew threw it. No one spoke to anyone. The people you spoke to were guildies and the shitstorm that was trade chat. Also the first iteration of RDF was with people on your server. I ran into so many people from my server. With the LFD addon people have installed. No is one having conversations about life on the mass scale people would like to believe. They are still having bare minimum chats in groups.

  6. #726
    RDF is a great feature. No, really. It opens up all the old 5 mans again as a leveling path. So all those hardly used assets just sitting there get used. Another method of playing the game is created. It ends the dumbness of leveling in Eastern Kingdoms, getting a Mara invite, and everyone standing there for 20 minutes for you to get there. I mean you will even be running though an empty world. Might get lucky and see a player or two along the way. Great stuff. Get that long reminder the world is dead because everyone is in Northrend. It also keeps current expansion 5 mans alive and bumping. Allows alts to get caught up quickly. Over all.. all it does is make for a better gaming experience.

    What is the actual debate? Fewer 5 mans being run is better for the game? Tons of 5 mans hardly used from 1-70 zones for reasons? Heroics (that run out of value in weeks) slowly dying out for what again? That is pretty much all removing RDF does. It isn't going to make people magically become friends. Or people grab everyone's hands for a song and dance on the way to walking to the instance portal in some sign of social butterflying. No major PVP battles or anything are going to happen. People will be on birds and flying into like 90% of the portals. On those birds probably afk just pointed in the direction of them. Seriously.. removing RDF does nothing.. but waste peoples time.

  7. #727
    I see people complaining that RFD ruins immersion. i fail to see how staring at chat for hrs, trying to find a group for a dungeon is immersive in any way...

  8. #728
    You know RDF gets a bad rap....cause a lot of the shit it gets blamed for Wrath was already doing. Socialness of the game really started to struggle all the way back with Naxx and WoTLK heroics

    Suddenly the casual players can run with the big boys....the hardcore players didn't want to run with scrubs.....websites popped up everywhere and got more popular on learning how to actually play the game right...an obsession with efficiency came with it. With said efficiency Speedrun mentlity came to dungeons which already existed but got worse...

    RDF happened and it basically exasperated the issue...really wrath as a whole killed the social experience

  9. #729
    Brewmaster Depakote's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northern Goblin View Post
    Subs continued to go upwards up to and including cataclysm's launch. So I don't get where this "decline" is.

    Edit: Infact post the release of 3.3, WoW reached its peak of 12 million subs, which continued until Cata launch. A whole year of LFG resulted in the highest subscription totals this game ever saw. Also who ever had a problem with the badge system, we'd had one since TBC and it was great for catch up gear or bad luck protection if you'd suffered crap drops in raids.



    And as we've demonstrated here both in retail and classic, the "social interaction" of pugging 5 mans is an absolute myth. By the time LFD came out people spammed chat, formed a group and would leave without saying two words to each other.
    Don't know when you started playing but as a Wrath baby I can tell you this is not true by a long shot.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mysterymask View Post
    You know RDF gets a bad rap....cause a lot of the shit it gets blamed for Wrath was already doing. Socialness of the game really started to struggle all the way back with Naxx and WoTLK heroics

    Suddenly the casual players can run with the big boys....the hardcore players didn't want to run with scrubs.....websites popped up everywhere and got more popular on learning how to actually play the game right...an obsession with efficiency came with it. With said efficiency Speedrun mentlity came to dungeons which already existed but got worse...

    RDF happened and it basically exasperated the issue...really wrath as a whole killed the social experience
    The social experience was fine until Legion. Then everyone became an edge lord. Well, most everyone.

  10. #730
    raiding may have geared two toons in wotlk but LFD geared the rest for me and many others
    Last edited by imoncrack; 2022-08-22 at 02:25 AM.

  11. #731
    Quote Originally Posted by Jimabob View Post
    Classic apologists will never admit that the players are the problem and that not everything is the game or Blizzard's fault. People want more barriers to other people succeeding at the game, their ego can’t take that hit.

    Classic WoW is hugely about flossing on people with your accomplishments and gear. The more people get to do that the less special it is.

    Spamming trade chat with"LF TANK!!" is such an amazing experience and when the guy leaves mid run, you have hearthstone back to the main city and look for a person again.

    People need to realize this is 2022, people want easier accessibility.
    Because this one time that mean person said mean things to some person. Now here we are!

  12. #732
    Can't wait for GS req and achievement checks for 5 mans

  13. #733
    I love the posts from people who clearly never played wotlk going off about how RDF was a wotlk feature from the get-go

    Yes RDF came out in WOTLK. However it came out during the launch of ICC which was the last major content patch not counting the pre-expansion changes.

    Wotlk classic will get RDF. The same time it was released during retail

  14. #734
    Herald of the Titans Tuor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarym13 View Post

    Wotlk classic will get RDF. The same time it was released during retail
    Except Blizzard already said DF won't be there.

  15. #735
    Being social in dungeons means it will take twice as long to do it.

  16. #736
    Because no one will use it and it will be empty just like it is now in TBC.

  17. #737
    Quote Originally Posted by sarym13 View Post
    I love the posts from people who clearly never played wotlk going off about how RDF was a wotlk feature from the get-go

    Yes RDF came out in WOTLK. However it came out during the launch of ICC which was the last major content patch not counting the pre-expansion changes.

    Wotlk classic will get RDF. The same time it was released during retail
    Look idc if it’s in or not tbh, I really don’t. But don’t make it sound like that patch didn’t last fucking forever. In terms of actual duration of wotlks life RDF was in for almost half of its existence. A very similar argument would have been like someone saying they don’t want cross realm bgs in vanilla and it was only in the last patch it got added, when really that patch lasted for almost half of vanillas existence.
    Last edited by Somic; 2022-08-22 at 08:19 PM.

  18. #738
    Quote Originally Posted by Tuor View Post
    Except Blizzard already said DF won't be there.
    That's even better than IMO. I could play the entire wotlk without RDF. I just assumed they were going to implement RDF when it launched on Live as they have been doing so far with implemented features

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