What do you think the future of the Forsaken will be under Calia Menethil? [Spoilers]

[Rhlor]

responding to several posts, incl the one from three days ago. soz, was busy. there's a fundamental error: Alliance and Horde are not the same.

name's different (of Lordaeron/Grand), members are different. one is the ideological successor of the other, but is not responsible for what's happening in the capital of the previous organization.


there is no definitive proof that the Alliance sabotaged the sanctum - on the contrary, the missive in dwarven denies it, only lamenting the recklessness of blood elf sanctum usage; the overseer of the sanctum admits that the most likely cause of the accident is their own actions. besides, i'm not sure NE spies were even capable of that.

but why were they even in Quel'thalas, you might ask?
i say, it was the Alliance's duty to invade to protect Azeroth from the Legion - and instead of a full-scale invasion, they launched a timid reconnaissance force. right.

before that, last time Tyrande heard of Kael'thas and his warriors was when she helped him out in Lordaeron. a couple years later, a blood elf in Stonetalon asked the Horde to massacre keepers and dryads to help demon worshippers in Jaedenar. but that's an isolated incident, #notallbloodelves, right?
and then a spaceship with good relatives of demons drops right next to Teldrassil, and it's infiltrated by a solid blood elf force which receives its' orders and reinforcement from Kael'thas in Outland and collaborates with the Legion. dude's still the king of Quel'thalas, his statues are all around the place - as are the fel crystals. naturally, anyone with that information assumes that Silvermoon is about to become the next Zin'Azshari and kaldorei will have to once again save the world from the quel'dorei. but no, it's just observation - met with an insane aggression instead of an "inshnu-ala, night elves" that Kael used to greet them with.

but hey, renewal, right?


keeping the Bell in Darnassus isn't an aid, it's a burden. the Alliance would never have used it (although should have), while Garrosh used it immediately.
Alliance and Horde are not the same - the former's vision of the world peace is mutual respectful coexistence; the latter's is the former's annihilation. because of that, instead of exploding the Underkeep after the Nagrandian Ogre's defeat and decapitating the Horde right there, they just walked away.
it's completely okay to prevent various Ogres from getting their hands on wunderwaffles, Alliance just has to act with way more tenacity.


you can imagine that she invoked emergency powers. or performed a coup. anything goes when the goal is the world peace.


it's not a war crime if you had fun while doing it you're working for the world peace.


idem. also, glad that a conscious Horde adventurer came about and saved the tauren. the cause of the world peace gets an unexpected ally from the other side, huh?


not gonna happen - world peace and all. although should


identical to the Divine Bell: prevent the Undead Ogre from getting her hands on the wunderwaffle.


you mean the Horde has betrayed him? Horde is a family, families don't try to drown the world in blood for the sake of it.


well, who's the adult in the room, trying to bring an end to the endless wars?


yes, they betrayed him, the Horde, and peace, "the noblest of aspirations". i thought you disliked treason?


yep, just like the Horde was effectively aiding the Lich King when they ambushed the Alliance in Icecrown. again, the difference is stark - the Horde did it for the lulz, the Alliance stopped the Ogre from whacking the world with another stupid wunderwaffle. maybe the need to pursue her was revealed to them in a dream, who knows - but somehow the Alliance almost always does the right thing in hindsight.


cf. world peace


cf. world peace
btw, why didn't Garrosh act like Kael in WC3? "king's honor, humans! i can has wood?" no bombs required.

also, re: the council
they just forgot to hand in their letters of resignation. a formality, which certainly shouldn't prevent them from expressing their free and democratic choice - and it's not usually punishable by death.


their future is Forgiven

anyway, that's interpretable as necro, it's derailing and derailing after a warning, which is a bannable offense. sorry, i couldn't resist.

the exodar incident occurs after the blood elves join the horde, in the rise of the horde novel it starts with the blood elves as members of the horde and ends with thrall learning that the draenei arrived azarroth two days ago

[Feanoro]

I never wanted the Horde to be evil like I just wanted the WC3 Horde

except perhaps the Forsaken which are indeed meant to be the evil outliers (and perhaps the thing I really wanted: Alteraci Humans for the Horde)

I didn't say you specifically, sorry if that was unclear. What should be clear from this forum though is that there are very vocal proponents of the Evil Horde, and not all of them understand there's nothing wrong with wanting to play villains. The fact that the Horde playerbase is split into three factions is no small part of Blizzard writing the Horde in such a bizarre manner. They're trying to have their cake and eat it too, when they should just decide wth the Horde is and stick to it.

[omeomorfismo]

they did
fuck, belmont pleasy marry me, im all yours


damn, at least blizz aknowledge they are shitting on forsaken characterization

[Triceron]

The lore is really messed up now because of what we know over the years, and what Blizzard seems to continue to overlook by progressing their lore.

The Forsaken who saw Calia as their leader are most-if-not-all dead because Sylvanas literally treated them as traitors and killed them all back in BFA, when Calia first became undead. So now, we're talking about all Forsaken who do not have the love of her being Queen at all. And yet here she is being propped up as leader for Forsaken. Why? It feels so backwards. If anything, the Forsaken should be deciding who to appoint as their leader, not having one thrust upon them to fill Sylvanas' shoes.

[Celvira]

The Forsaken as we know them are all likely dead (get it?...okay, I'm sorry). But in all seriousness, they are about to lose a significant chunk of what them compelling and desirable as a faction - their inability to co-exist amicably with the living and their ability naturally reproduce. Prior they had to accept that they would be shunned and feared, forced to acknowledge that they had to kill and defile to replenish lost bodies to sustain their faction. It hardened them, made them weary, and it made them interesting to learn and interact with due to their callous and realist outlooks.

But with Calia seizing the reins and the Sylvanas loyalists fading into obscurity, Blizzard seems keen to explore alternative avenues to the issue of The Forsaken's population problems that are more benevolent in nature, which more or less will turn them into nothing more than humans with bad odor and skin conditions.

[Ardenaso]

Calia is much more suited to be a Forsaken representative in the Argent Crusade and just settle in Hearthglen or Tyr's Hand, yeah

Dunno who said it but quoting them, not all Forsaken are Leonid and Judkins

[omeomorfismo]

Calia is much more suited to be a Forsaken representative in the Argent Crusade and just settle in Hearthglen or Tyr's Hand, yeah

Dunno who said it but quoting them, not all Forsaken are Leonid and Judkins

actually they arent even forsaken in the first place

[Finlandia WOAT]

Calia sucks. It's not that she's a lightforged, of which I'm ambivalent and would be positive if they had kept the lore that using the holy light is possible but painful for Forsaken.

She's a Menethil. Why would the Forsaken-the undead citizens of Lordaeron- want another Menethil when the last one murdered and enslaved them? Arthas as the Evil One was a crucial part of their mythos- and now theyre turning to his sister? And she hasn't done anything in game to actually ingratiate herself to the Forsaken.

I mean, the story, to an extent has always been bad, and this is why: a complex geopolitical world is dumbed down to Strong Man Theory, most of which are boring characters to boot. One of my favorite parts of Garrosh was the idea there were orcs who agreed with him on the point that Thrall was wrong to force the Orcs to live in a desolate wasteland as "penance".

[Atrea]

Well there you have it. The Forsaken are now led by a council; they don't have a singular leader.

It's time to stop pretending the sky is falling now, guys.

[voidox]

belmont spitting facts

Calia "Danuser's new pet" Menethil should have nothing to do with any leadership or leader-like role in the Forsaken.

Even her being part of the Desolate Council is too much cause she has zero knowledge or experience of the Forsaken/undead/Horde/leadership in general. So what exactly is she doing in a leadership council?

On top of that, Calia is barely being accepted into the Forsaken in the first place, yet Blizzard has already forced her into a leadership role? how does that make sense? there are still questions about trusting her, yet we're meant to accept her on the Desolate Council?
______________________________________________________________

Danuser is pushing his new pet character way too much (such as how she's the only who could help the undead kaldorei, her being so readily accepted in horde council meetings, so on) especially when she's a complete 180 of the Forsaken in every possible way and has zero knowledge/experience with undeath/Forsaken/Horde... all she has is her Menethil surname, das it.

also holy fck Blizzard, the Pallid Lady? Champion of the Pallid Lady? really? just stop with that -_-
_________________________________________

you know, all this stuff with Calia is just so dumb cause Calia could have worked if she was just a normal Forsaken. Simple as that.

Instead of being pushed as this special light bulb cause Danuser always need some stupid special thing for a new character, they could have just had her being a normal undead coming into the Forsaken. That way, she would be more welcomed by Forsaken players as she'd be an actual undead and Forsaken character, making much more sense in the story as a new important Forsaken character

[Haladrian]

Sadly this is the horde cow sympathizers want, considering that most of the prominent race leaders are dead or gone it is time to slowly turn into a red alliance unless they make Calia bipolar just like the other female leads, either way I don't see anything good coming out of this, as a forsaken main can't be more disappointed

[omeomorfismo]

belmont spitting facts

Calia "Danuser's new pet" Menethil should have nothing to do with any leadership or leader-like role in the Forsaken.

Even her being part of the Desolate Council is too much cause she has zero knowledge or experience of the Forsaken/undead/Horde/leadership in general. So what exactly is she doing in a leadership council?

On top of that, Calia is barely being accepted into the Forsaken in the first place, yet Blizzard has already forced her into a leadership role? how does that make sense? there are still questions about trusting her, yet we're meant to accept her on the Desolate Council?
______________________________________________________________

Danuser is pushing his new pet character way too much (such as how she's the only who could help the undead kaldorei, her being so readily accepted in horde council meetings, so on) especially when she's a complete 180 of the Forsaken in every possible way and has zero knowledge/experience with undeath/Forsaken/Horde... all she has is her Menethil surname, das it.

also holy fck Blizzard, the Pallid Lady? Champion of the Pallid Lady? really? just stop with that -_-
_________________________________________

you know, all this stuff with Calia is just so dumb cause Calia could have worked if she was just a normal Forsaken. Simple as that.

Instead of being pushed as this special light bulb cause Danuser always need some stupid special thing for a new character, they could have just had her being a normal undead coming into the Forsaken. That way, she would be more welcomed by Forsaken players as she'd be an actual undead and Forsaken character, making much more sense in the story as a new important Forsaken character

dude, isnt like that belmont is selfaware, like danuser or whatever is writing calia, he is writing belmont..
they know they are fucking up, so thats all...

[Feanoro]

dude, isnt like that belmont is selfaware, like danuser or whatever is writing calia, he is writing belmont..
they know they are fucking up, so thats all...

Sometimes you really have to wonder if people understand these are characters rather than living beings.

[elbleuet]

Forsaken are just normal humans at this point.

[Iain]

Even her being part of the Desolate Council is too much cause she has zero knowledge or experience of the Forsaken/undead/Horde/leadership in general. So what exactly is she doing in a leadership council?

Why do I get the sense that this is some type of unintended metaphor for something?

[Ersula]

Well there you have it. The Forsaken are now led by a council; they don't have a singular leader.

It's time to stop pretending the sky is falling now, guys.

This is what they did with both the Horde & Alliance. Anduin doesn't want to be king. The Horde is a council now.

Literally the Game of Thrones ending, and I mean that in the worst possible way. Complete with a "Can we try democracy? Lol no" lipservice moment.

[voidox]

dude, isnt like that belmont is selfaware, like danuser or whatever is writing calia, he is writing belmont..
they know they are fucking up, so thats all...

no way, you serious!?

like come on dude, I was just saying what Belmont said in the cutscene are facts... yes they were written by a writer of fcking course. And it was one line I spent on Belmont, the 13 lines of the rest of my post had nothing to do with him... how did you just miss all of that? -_-

[Super Dickmann]

dude, isnt like that belmont is selfaware, like danuser or whatever is writing calia, he is writing belmont..
they know they are fucking up, so thats all...

Belmont and Faranell are there as sops to the extant Forsaken playerbase by people who're trying to reconstruct it akin to a blind man trying to paint the Mona Lisa from memory. People going on about how NOW when there's at least lip service to the Forsaken identity of 15 years they've become humans with a skin condition and not back in BTS confuse the fuck out of me. The Forsaken were dead since then, now they've just put googley eyes on the corpse and made it dance a little gig like it used to, which is still an improvement over what the BFA Calia cutscene and Shadows Rising implied when Calia took over off-screen and everyone was grateful for having the chance to be healed by her. Instead is Calia being the one looking for their approval in the course of the quests and at least their existing iconography and aesthetic are there and Derek is given exactly as many lines as he deserves, i.e 0.

[omeomorfismo]

no way, you serious!?

like come on dude, I was just saying what Belmont said in the cutscene are facts... yes they were written by a writer of fcking course. And it was one line I spent on Belmont, the 13 lines of the rest of my post had nothing to do with him... how did you just miss all of that? -_-

wtf, literally my answer is about your 13 lines rant
that btw, i even agree, but come on, you are depicting a danuser that just doesnt exists...

- - - Updated - - -

Belmont and Faranell are there as sops to the extant Forsaken playerbase by people who're trying to reconstruct it akin to a blind man trying to paint the Mona Lisa from memory. People going on about how NOW when there's at least lip service to the Forsaken identity of 15 years they've become humans with a skin condition and not back in BTS confuse the fuck out of me. The Forsaken were dead since then, now they've just put googley eyes on the corpse and made it dance a little gig like it used to, which is still an improvement over what the BFA Calia cutscene and Shadows Rising implied when Calia took over off-screen and everyone was grateful for having the chance to be healed by her. Instead is Calia being the one looking for their approval in the course of the quests and at least their existing iconography and aesthetic are there and Derek is given exactly as many lines as he deserves, i.e 0.

at least belmont and faranell werent any time out of characters. even in the battlefront they were just perfect.
isnt like that i have anymore hopes in the writing, but ehy, at least blizz still know what a forsaken is. they just want to cancel it, they are honest and explicit about it.

so bye warcraft, at least my favourite character remained himself.
addio deathstalker commander belmont, conqueror of gilneas, mio amore <3

[Aedruid]

Honestly the only people that should be able to respond to the questionnaire are undead players