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  1. #201
    Quote Originally Posted by craigw View Post
    moose move thru woods with little to no sound. having over a 4 foot wide rack on their head doesnt help them at all. yet they seem to do it like its instincts......so why cant a highmountain tauren stealth?
    Yeah but can they sneak into crates and throw smoke bombs? I don't see meese in the woods able to do triple backflips, vault rooftop to rooftop, and escape hordes of soldiers trying to catch them. The moment a Tauren tries to vault to a nearby rooftop they will fall through the roof and into the rooms below...

  2. #202
    Warchief Beet's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Val the Moofia Boss View Post
    Haven't you been paying attention? The current devs don't care about adhering to the lore. You'll take your stealthy cows and your light wielding Orcs and you'll like it! *pukes*
    Yeah it’s really sad. I Remember the old days when they would only introduce new classes to races, they would try to find a way to justify it in lore. And if they couldn’t, it wouldn’t happen. Much like how we never got Draenei warlocks. It would have been the dumbest thing in the world.

  3. #203
    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    In the vanilla manual, the entry for the [Stealth] ability says: "Places the rogue in stealth mode, Cannot be used in combat. White stealthed, the rogue turns transparent, and can sneak around enemies with a lower chance of being detected." Like, the fact that your rogue turns see-through when in stealth should have been a pretty big clue that stealth was something involving some sort of magic. That combined with the outright magic in ghostly strike should have told you rogues weren't just operating on skill alone, as if that made any sense AT ALL lorewise, when you have large groups of rogues in groups like the Wastewander bandits, stealthing in the middle of open deserts in direct sunlight.
    Likely a description of game mechanics. Also: do druids use shadow magic to stealth in cat form?
    The absolute state of Warcraft lore in 2021:
    Kyrians: We need to keep chucking people into the Maw because it's our job.
    Also Kyrians: Why is the Maw growing stronger despite all our efforts?

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by Gehco View Post
    I was under the belief they were unable to be turned undead as Worgen, unless something I've missed? As that is what lore states through the quests in-game, and thus, the Worgen Death Knights weren't started as undead but slowly consumed by it.
    The val'kyr lost a lot of power after Arthas was killed. With him around they could, after he died they couldn't. That's why in the Silverpine storyline the survivors from Hillsbrad deliberately took the curse to protect themselves.
    The most difficult thing to do is accept that there is nothing wrong with things you don't like and accept that people can like things you don't.

  5. #205
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    Likely a description of game mechanics. Also: do druids use shadow magic to stealth in cat form?
    Yeah! How could a magical druid capable of magically shapeshifting into several different creatures and a tree be capable of magically making themselves invisible.

    Checkmate Atheists.
    Last edited by Thestrawman; 2022-05-22 at 12:04 PM.

  6. #206
    The Undying Gehco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cparle87 View Post
    The val'kyr lost a lot of power after Arthas was killed. With him around they could, after he died they couldn't. That's why in the Silverpine storyline the survivors from Hillsbrad deliberately took the curse to protect themselves.
    That part I knew.

    but now we're at a stage with no Lich King artifacts. Isn't Worgen then more protected from undeath now?
    FOMO: "Fear Of Missing Out", also commonly known as people with a mental issue of managing time and activities, many expecting others to fit into their schedule so they don't miss out on things to come. If FOMO becomes a problem for you, do seek help, it can be a very unhealthy lifestyle..

  7. #207
    bruh rogues don't even use physical stealth in lore. they use shadow magic.

  8. #208
    Quote Originally Posted by Gehco View Post
    That part I knew.

    but now we're at a stage with no Lich King artifacts. Isn't Worgen then more protected from undeath now?
    Well, for the Cataclysm through BFA eras you'd be correct. However as of Shadowlands from what I've read the most recent death knights, to explain Blizz's decision to allow the class to all races, are that there were people approached Bolvar to be willingly changed into death knights for the power to protect Azeroth. Could be he can turn anyone who's willing as opposed to not or dead and unknowing.
    The most difficult thing to do is accept that there is nothing wrong with things you don't like and accept that people can like things you don't.

  9. #209
    So a tauren feral druid doesn't exist?

  10. #210
    Quote Originally Posted by Thestrawman View Post
    Yeah! How could a magical druid capable of magically shapeshifting into several different creatures and a tree be capable of magically making themselves invisible.

    Checkmate Atheists.
    If it's all just magic and has nothing do to with your physical form and actually being sneaky then why can they only stealth in cat form?
    The absolute state of Warcraft lore in 2021:
    Kyrians: We need to keep chucking people into the Maw because it's our job.
    Also Kyrians: Why is the Maw growing stronger despite all our efforts?

  11. #211
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    Likely a description of game mechanics. Also: do druids use shadow magic to stealth in cat form?
    Yes? It isn't just sneaking. It has never been just sneaking. Like, you do realize that Shadowmeld is also explicitly a stealth effect, not an invisibility effect, and is a magical power from Elune, right?

    I also enjoy that you totally ignored me pointing out that rogues do use magic in Vanilla, and even more magic in TBC.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    If it's all just magic and has nothing do to with your physical form and actually being sneaky then why can they only stealth in cat form?
    Why can they only dash in cat form and growl and roar in bear form? Despite bears and people being able to dash, and cats and people being able to growl or roar? Spells being form-locked doesn't mean that the other forms are incapable of doing that same thing, it means Blizzard decided that ability was relegated to a specific form. If you want a specific lore resolution for why druids are unable to use same shadow magic in other forms, it's because the magic itself is tied to taking on that cat aspect, much like the magic that lets them innately know where all nearby humanoids are.

  12. #212
    Mechagnome terminaltrip421's Avatar
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    aren't there "broken" that can stealth? also tauren stealthing as druids is still tauren stealthing.

    that said I have no idea what this argument is about..?

  13. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    If it's all just magic and has nothing do to with your physical form and actually being sneaky then why can they only stealth in cat form?
    "GAMEPLAY LIMITATIONS"- to make CAT form unique parody on rogue, since whole druid thing is Jack of all trades but master of none.

    What if you were able to use Dash+Stealth and all paw/claw skills in bear form..... why even use Cat form then, if all it's skills can be used in Bear form?
    Quote Originally Posted by Varx View Post
    This is a question for you Tinker haters out there.
    I already know that Tinker is the most probable class for 10.0, so probable that's it's practically a certainty.
    Regardless, since many of you disagree, what then is the most realistic class to be added for 10.0.
    Try to be neutral about it, no biasis.Maybe this exercise will help you see the light.

  14. #214
    Quote Originally Posted by Aedruid View Post
    I don't see meese in the woods able to do triple backflips, vault rooftop to rooftop, and escape hordes of soldiers trying to catch them.
    I don't see humans doing that, either.

    I can IMAGINE humans doing it. But I can also imagine tauren doing it.

    Don't pretend like this isn't a case of ignoring real-life physics for one race, and suddenly protesting because it's not rigorously applied for another.

  15. #215
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    Please name a single classic rogue spell or talent that mentions the use of magic.
    absence of proof is not proof of absence, frostbolt description doesnt mention magic, do you think mages just have very cold hands?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    You need to demonstrate why the assumptions is wrong.
    ehm... no? you said its not magical, you need to prove that you are right, not others that you are wrong... its called burden of proof, look it up...

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    The game actually also distinguishes mechanically between stealth and a mage's invisibility.
    sure it works differently, its most likely based on different type of magic, but thank you for pointing out mages can turn invisible using magic without ANY sneaking abilities whatsoever, completely destroying your own argument... good work

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    On a side note: do feral druids use shadow magic to sneak as well? And can they only use that shadow magic while transformed into a cat?
    druids, who use magic to do literaly everything including transforming into said cat? yeah, its pretty reasonable to assume they also use magic to turn invisible... why would it have to be shadow magic though? you can use the same (or similar) spels by gaining power from different sources... as you pointed out (still makes me laugh how you destroyed your own argument) with mages having invisibility... also hunters too afaik...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by xVicarious View Post
    Lmfao wtf is this thread
    in a jist, bunch of "old" guys yelling "no, change is BAD!!" and people telling them the change is not even new

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    Likely a description of game mechanics. Also: do druids use shadow magic to stealth in cat form?
    so he literaly proved you wrong, but you double down with "nah im still right despite having nothing but my opinion and assumptions"
    damn, it really is pointless trying to argue with you, you just put fingers in your ears and yell "change is bad!"...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by terminaltrip421 View Post
    aren't there "broken" that can stealth? also tauren stealthing as druids is still tauren stealthing.

    that said I have no idea what this argument is about..?
    there are also tauren (grimtotem) and drenei rogues at least since cata...
    its just bunch of people yelling how they dont like changes

  16. #216
    Mechagnome terminaltrip421's Avatar
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    are they opening up DH to the other evles? cause that might warrant a sub.

  17. #217
    Quote Originally Posted by terminaltrip421 View Post
    are they opening up DH to the other evles? cause that might warrant a sub.
    afaik they want all race/class combo, but not right away, they wanted to make some lore (possibly some q lines) excusing some wilder combos, in 10,0 we get all races rogue mage and priest i believe

  18. #218
    Quote Originally Posted by Hitei View Post
    Why can they only dash in cat form and growl and roar in bear form? Despite bears and people being able to dash, and cats and people being able to growl or roar? Spells being form-locked doesn't mean that the other forms are incapable of doing that same thing, it means Blizzard decided that ability was relegated to a specific form. If you want a specific lore resolution for why druids are unable to use same shadow magic in other forms, it's because the magic itself is tied to taking on that cat aspect, much like the magic that lets them innately know where all nearby humanoids are.
    Why do you think they chose the cat form and NOT the bear form for stealthing? Might it be the same reason why they didn't allow Tauren to be rogues?
    The absolute state of Warcraft lore in 2021:
    Kyrians: We need to keep chucking people into the Maw because it's our job.
    Also Kyrians: Why is the Maw growing stronger despite all our efforts?

  19. #219
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    Why do you think they chose the cat form and NOT the bear form for stealthing? Might it be the same reason why they didn't allow Tauren to be rogues?
    Because bear was built to be a fucking tank and cat was built to mimic rogues.

    As amusing as it is watching you ignore all the points being made to keep attempting really dumb deflections into tangential arguments, and watching you try really, really hard to dance away from your whole original "rOgUeS aReN't MaGiC!!!!" point that was proven objectively wrong---I really have no interest in continuing to humor your constant side-stepping just because you feel the desperate need to save face after doubling down too many times on bad points.

    So I guess enjoy continuing to be really angry about this very reasonable addition.

  20. #220
    Elemental Lord Santti's Avatar
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    Of course Tauren can stealth. How else would you explain the fact that we've never seen Tauren Rogues?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ransath View Post
    Money laundering, especially prior to his election? I couldn't give a flying fuck.

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