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  1. #301

  2. #302
    The Insane Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chilela View Post
    Because modern game development sort of nurtures that mindset. One of the WoW devs was adamant in making Ardenweald effectively 50/50 in gender ratio. While I personally didn't really care (nor would I have even noticed unless it was explicitly pointed out by them), making such things into a highly-conscious decision makes the "Numbers and charts" thing not too far of a logical leap.
    can you point to any modern game or development that actually uses that Mindset and try’s to break every one up into numbers or is this just the “game has woman/minority lead so is woke” nonesense?
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  3. #303
    Quote Originally Posted by Syncr View Post
    Ok I have a question for you, do you think they mentioned the 5 year thing and what they really meant was “yeah so we saw this issue 5 years ago and we just now decided to make it”.

    That is clearly implying this is how long they spent “working” or “brain storming” on this project. Your conspiratorial gene is flaring up SUPER hard in this thread LOL.
    These people kept getting drunk at work and groping the few unlucky females they employed because they thought that was their only chance to find a girlfriend at least as late as two years ago. You really think they in any way cared about diversity?

  4. #304
    Quote Originally Posted by Syncr View Post
    Ok I have a question for you, do you think they mentioned the 5 year thing and what they really meant was “yeah so we saw this issue 5 years ago and we just now decided to make it”.

    That is clearly implying this is how long they spent “working” or “brain storming” on this project. Your conspiratorial gene is flaring up SUPER hard in this thread LOL.
    It says the system was developed by MIT, not by King.

    This isn’t conspiratorial. This is just not inserting a narrative into what the article says. It says they started thinking about it five years ago and then started developing this system after they partnered with MIT. That’s what it says. I don’t know why you are so horny to add all this other shit that isn’t in the article.

  5. #305
    1st world problems

  6. #306
    Quote Originally Posted by Myradin View Post
    So, looking at Torbjorn's stats, a skinny young white straight white guy would be 'bad', but an old, short, muscled guy would score pretty decent, even if he didnt have a robot arm?
    More importantly, how the fuck is Zarya straight? There's no shot. There is no chance. Not a CHANCE she doesn't even KINDA like the ladies.

    Not even stereotyping her looks and saying that she looks like a lesbian, I mean it in the sense that it would be a legitimate crime against females attracted to other females everywhere if she didn't dabble with the ladies. My wife is pansexual, and Zarya is 100% on her list of video game characters who are attractive.

  7. #307
    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    It says the system was developed by MIT, not by King.

    This isn’t conspiratorial. This is just not inserting a narrative into what the article says. It says they started thinking about it five years ago and then started developing this system after they partnered with MIT. That’s what it says. I don’t know why you are so horny to add all this other shit that isn’t in the article.
    This article?

    In 2016, King began developing a method for guarding against unconscious bias and exclusion when it came to the creation of their games and characters. At the time, this idea existed as an intangible philosophy, but the potential was obvious.

    Enter the MIT Game Lab. Alongside King, the MIT techs helped turn a mission statement into tangible software that would create and monitor guidelines for character conception and creation, looking into all the ways basic elements such as gender, body type, roles (“heroes” vs. “villains”) and even such granular factors such as pose, or body movement, can suggest powerful things about a character one way or another. According to King Globalization Project Manager Jacqueline Chomatas, once MIT handed over the basic software, the team at King spent the last few years honing and developing it, mostly as a volunteer effort. People were spending their off-hours working on the tool, simply because they believed in its potential so much.
    The one that repeatedly says that they started working on it in 2016?

    What you’re saying is an actual program didn’t come to light until after that, which isn’t what I said. You don’t have to have an actual software developed in order to be working on something. That’s not how jobs work.

    When I say “they have been working on it for 5 years” this is what I’m referring to. They have spent this much time and effort into making a tool like this.

    So once again. You just presented to me a distinction with no difference. It doesn’t change what I said at all.

  8. #308
    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    There are literally only two kinds of people: people who want progress and people who don’t want progress. That’s a true dichotomy.
    The word you want is change not progression. It is not good nor evil only not the same.

  9. #309
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    These people kept getting drunk at work and groping the few unlucky females they employed because they thought that was their only chance to find a girlfriend at least as late as two years ago. You really think they in any way cared about diversity?
    No company ever has ever given a shit about anything to do with diversity. The issue is when they are doing things like this because they want a certain “image” they are going for. And it just fucks everything up.

  10. #310
    Quote Originally Posted by Syncr View Post
    This article?
    The one that repeatedly says that they started working on it in 2016?

    What you’re saying is an actual program didn’t come to light until after that, which isn’t what I said. You don’t have to have an actual software developed in order to be working on something. That’s not how jobs work.

    When I say “they have been working on it for 5 years” this is what I’m referring to. They have spent this much time and effort into making a tool like this.

    So once again. You just presented to me a distinction with no difference. It doesn’t change what I said at all.
    "At the time, this idea existed as an intangible philosophy, but the potential was obvious."

    If you want to consider "intangible philosophy" to be the same as developing a specific program, sure.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Syncr View Post
    No company ever has ever given a shit about anything to do with diversity. The issue is when they are doing things like this because they want a certain “image” they are going for. And it just fucks everything up.
    Lots of companies give a shit about diversity in that diversity is good for business almost universally.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Celement View Post
    The word you want is change not progression. It is not good nor evil only not the same.
    No, the word I want is "progress". Making things better is definitionally good.

  11. #311
    So there is literally a checklist for inclusion they're funneling everything through. Wonderful.

    Inclusion isn't bad. Feeding values to a computer to spit back an algorithmic assessment of whether you are unwoke, just woke enough, or possibly too woke is ... hugely overthinking it. And making the process so extremely cold.

    Yes, I'm using woke facetiously. Relax.

    As the tweet read... we have eyes, ears, and hearts. Creators have these things. This really doesn't need to boil down to a mathematical theorem to strike a good balance of representation with your characters, writing, and storytelling in general.

  12. #312
    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    "At the time, this idea existed as an intangible philosophy, but the potential was obvious."

    If you want to consider "intangible philosophy" to be the same as developing a specific program, sure.
    When it comes to my point about them spending time on it and working on it then yes, yes it is the same. My point was only there to highlight the amount of time they have spent on it. Again, your distinction makes no difference.

    Lots of companies give a shit about diversity in that diversity is good for business almost universally.
    I really really hate to break this to you, but they don’t. Companies care about money, and that’s it. If diversity brings them money then they will go toward that, but that doesn’t mean they now care about diversity. They care how diversity is effecting the money they get.

    If the outcome to cost ratio doesn’t add up then it would be dropped.

    Just like when blizzard says “customer satisfaction is number one priority to us” and then turn around and fire most of their CS staff and now we deal with bots. It’s a cost thing so they went with what made them more money. That’s how the world works.

  13. #313
    Mechagnome
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    What happened to just hiring the most qualified person for the job. This world is going to shit so fast, I'd get out the popcorn and watch it all burn if it weren't for the fact I have to leave this crap for my kids to deal with.

  14. #314
    Quote Originally Posted by Syncr View Post
    I really really hate to break this to you, but they don’t. Companies care about money, and that’s it. If diversity brings them money then they will go toward that, but that doesn’t mean they now care about diversity. They care how diversity is effecting the money they get.
    And you are lecturing me on "distinction without a difference"?

    If I say "They care about X, because X is good for business" what the fuck do you think I mean besides "They care about X because it makes them money"?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Talon8669 View Post
    What happened to just hiring the most qualified person for the job. This world is going to shit so fast, I'd get out the popcorn and watch it all burn if it weren't for the fact I have to leave this crap for my kids to deal with.
    Well for one thing, this has nothing to do with hiring anyone so you look like a weirdo rambling about that in this thread.

  15. #315
    Fucking barf... 100% no thank you. Stop it with the bullshit inclusion shit. It only hurts the game and makes people not want to play. People want to be separated by skill, not by other factors.

    I'm fine with anyone saying something racist or misogynistic getting instantly banned but just stop it there. The problem will correct itself from that point forward. Punish the people who are the problem, don't punish everyone because of a couple of bad apples. When you pay $30-$60 for a game and get banned for being a dickhead, you will think twice before you have to spend another $30-$60 again. And if the game is free to play, follow the same rules. These people that they're hunting, won't be able to contain themselves. They will always fuck up.

    But in reality, this is political correctness going too far. When the truth is now offensive, you need to wake the fuck up and stop being so delusional.

  16. #316
    Quote Originally Posted by agentsi View Post
    Fucking barf... 100% no thank you. Stop it with the bullshit inclusion shit. It only hurts the game and makes people not want to play. People want to be separated by skill, not by other factors.

    I'm fine with anyone saying something racist or misogynistic getting instantly banned but just stop it there. The problem will correct itself from that point forward. Punish the people who are the problem, don't punish everyone because of a couple of bad apples. When you pay $30-$60 for a game and get banned for being a dickhead, you will think twice before you have to spend another $30-$60 again. And if the game is free to play, follow the same rules. These people that they're hunting, won't be able to contain themselves. They will always fuck up.

    But in reality, this is political correctness going too far. When the truth is now offensive, you need to wake the fuck up and stop being so delusional.
    Which "truth" is offensive?

  17. #317
    Quote Originally Posted by Sinfelle View Post
    This isn't what we meant by rework racials
    I laughed.

    Quote Originally Posted by bryroo View Post
    Instead of rerolling characters to get an 18 in Str or Dex now you reroll until you're a blind palestinian lesbian who studies engineering at community College and hates cats
    Even better.


    Some real gems here lol, ngl
    A better way to think about Casual v Hardcore: https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...asual-Hardcore

  18. #318
    Quote Originally Posted by NineSpine View Post
    And you are lecturing me on "distinction without a difference"?

    If I say "They care about X, because X is good for business" what the fuck do you think I mean besides "They care about X because it makes them money"?
    It is a difference in the conversation that me and that other poster was having. He was asking me if a company like blizzard actually have a shit about diversity given their actions in the business place so I was responding to him about how none of them do.

    If you butted into that conversation and just wanted to point out that companies care about it because it makes them money, then yeah that basically just means you’re intentionally saying irrelevant nonsense just to say it.

    We weren’t discussing whether it’s good for their business we were discussing about how they actually don’t fundamentally care about diversity.

    If you can’t keep up with context then just stay away from conversations that aren’t directly addressed to you.

  19. #319
    Quote Originally Posted by Syncr View Post
    It is a difference in the conversation that me and that other poster was having. He was asking me if a company like blizzard actually have a shit about diversity given their actions in the business place so I was responding to him about how none of them do.

    If you butted into that conversation and just wanted to point out that companies care about it because it makes them money, then yeah that basically just means you’re intentionally saying irrelevant nonsense just to say it.

    We weren’t discussing whether it’s good for their business we were discussing about how they actually don’t fundamentally care about diversity.

    If you can’t keep up with context then just stay away from conversations that aren’t directly addressed to you.
    Don't respond directly to me if you are trying to carry on a conversation with someone else.

  20. #320
    Quote Originally Posted by qwerty123456 View Post
    Clearly this tool has its own biases coded into it.
    Every tool does, but does it counter more bias than it incorporates? That's to be seen. Not by any means sayings it's perfect, I imagine it needs a LOT more refinement.

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