King's Diversity Space Tool: A Leap Forward for Inclusion in Gaming

[vincink]

It has to be one or the other because every thing that has come out about blizzard and it’s work Culture is the exact opposite of progressive culture to the point where it could Only be more on the nose if they had mandated MAGA Hats.

That's an unreasonable framing-- that there's only two kinds of people in the world: progressives or "MAGA Hats". Humanity is not that simple and even people within both movements are not that simple. You are also not that simple. Reductive categories make it easy to make hypothetical people who do not exist or exist in few numbers. By claiming that there's only progressives and "MAGA Hats" in Blizzard, you force the entire corporation of Blizzard employees into those categories and discard one category as undesirable. This is prejudice, reductive, and not at all helpful.

[Syncr]

This is not hard stuff if you spend any time offline, touching grass, not thinking about twitter and not desperately seeking woke bogeymen around every corner.

The original post sounded like a half hearted promo for a silly idea that seven people at Activision ever actually saw and would never go anywhere.

What on earth does this have to do with going outside? A company has a giant announcement detailing everything about a program they worked on for five years, and you think it’s obvious that this was just a “just for giggles” thing?

I honest to god can’t tell if you’re trolling. I don’t actually care about the tool at, no matter how dumb I think it is. But what on earth are you even talking about my friend.

[vincink]

It has to be one or the other because every thing that has come out about blizzard and it’s work Culture is the exact opposite of progressive culture to the point where it could Only be more on the nose if they had mandated MAGA Hats.

That's an unreasonable framing-- that there's only two kinds of people in the world: progressives and "MAGA Hats". Humanity is not that simple and even people within both movements are not that simple. You are also not that simple. Reductive categories make it easy to make hypothetical people who do not exist or exist in few numbers. By claiming that there's only progressives and "MAGA Hats" in Blizzard, you force the entire corporation of Blizzard employees into two categories and then discard people in one category as undesirable. At best, this straw-manning is unhelpful; at worst is prejudice.

[Memory]

They clarified it is not being used in active game development. That is, it is just virtue signaling, which apparently backfired.

[Syncr]

There's a strange overlap of people offended by this tool's existence and those who are inclined to, unprompted, write paragraphs upon paragraphs about how persecuted straight white males are in this, God's year two-thousand-and-twenty-two.

Ok? Lol.

I mean just because I think the tool is dumb and is hurtful in the long run doesn’t mean I think white people are being persecuted. This is that same mindset of people calling all woke folks white hating because some of them use it as a tool to actually hate white people.

But this guy has taken it in a very weird very conspiratorial-esq type of direction that’s super silly lol.

[Celement]

what they are doing is just racist gaslighting,using quotes from the people they hate to spin it is pretty common

I could poke fun at the irony of this but like all comedy brevity is golden.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

IMO, given the developers, it really wouldn't be that out-of-character for them to be using such a thing.

Because making a diverse game like say overwatch means you want to break people down into numbers and charts?

[Drudi]

Yes, gay people are normal.

Yes they are - in the eyes of the beholder. Also, it doesn’t automatically mean that a male can have a “husband”.

[Chilela]

It's just a silly over-engineered solution to a problem. The absolute meltdown in response is hilarious.

Some degree of grievance is, frankly, justified, even if there are certainly people who are blowing it out of proportion. The fact that time and effort was dedicated to conceiving this, on top of it being considered relevant enough to get an open announcement of it, is proof that reducing people's identities to measurable numbers is something that's not entirely out of the question for modern corporate culture. That, in and of itself, should be at least mildly concerning.

Because making a diverse game like say overwatch means you want to break people down into numbers and charts?

Because modern game development sort of nurtures that mindset. One of the WoW devs was adamant in making Ardenweald effectively 50/50 in gender ratio. While I personally didn't really care (nor would I have even noticed unless it was explicitly pointed out by them), making such things into a highly-conscious decision makes the "Numbers and charts" thing not too far of a logical leap.

Yes they are - in the eyes of the beholder. Also, it doesn’t automatically mean that a male can have a “husband”.

Wat

[Syncr]

Yes they are - in the eyes of the beholder. Also, it doesn’t automatically mean that a male can have a “husband”.

Actually it kinda does.

[NineSpine]

Yes they are - in the eyes of the beholder. Also, it doesn’t automatically mean that a male can have a “husband”.

Objectively speaking, a male can have a husband. I know some of them.

[neik]

Hypothetically speaking most of these fetishes can turn into a serious threat to national security many generations ahead. So let's not groom our kids with it.

I hold you corporate leaders accountable on it, not your fucking coins that you make out of it. But basic fucking common sense that has been a successful fabric of human reality.

[NineSpine]

That's an unreasonable framing-- that there's only two kinds of people in the world: progressives and "MAGA Hats". Humanity is not that simple and even people within both movements are not that simple. You are also not that simple. Reductive categories make it easy to make hypothetical people who do not exist or exist in few numbers. By claiming that there's only progressives and "MAGA Hats" in Blizzard, you force the entire corporation of Blizzard employees into two categories and then discard people in one category as undesirable. At best, this straw-manning is unhelpful; at worst is prejudice.

There are literally only two kinds of people: people who want progress and people who don’t want progress. That’s a true dichotomy.

[Lorgar Aurelian]

That's an unreasonable framing-- that there's only two kinds of people in the world: progressives or "MAGA Hats". Humanity is not that simple and even people within both movements are not that simple. You are also not that simple. Reductive categories make it easy to make hypothetical people who do not exist or exist in few numbers. By claiming that there's only progressives and "MAGA Hats" in Blizzard, you force the entire corporation of Blizzard employees into those categories and discard one category as undesirable. This is prejudice, reductive, and not at all helpful.

Ya no where did I say there’s only two kinds of people.

What I actually said is that when you have a frat work culture that’s all but mandating MAGA hats it’s mutually exclusive with a progressive culture actually being in charge.

Unless of course you think passing over minority’s and woman threatening people who come forward with harassment ect are all part of progressive culture.

[NineSpine]

What on earth does this have to do with going outside? A company has a giant announcement detailing everything about a program they worked on for five years, and you think it’s obvious that this was just a “just for giggles” thing?

I honest to god can’t tell if you’re trolling. I don’t actually care about the tool at, no matter how dumb I think it is. But what on earth are you even talking about my friend.

Because it doesn’t say they worked on this for five years. It says they started conceiving of a way to solve this problem five years ago. That’s not the same thing.

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Some degree of grievance is, frankly, justified, even if there are certainly people who are blowing it out of proportion. The fact that time and effort was dedicated to conceiving this, on top of it being considered relevant enough to get an open announcement of it, is proof that reducing people's identities to measurable numbers is something that's not entirely out of the question for modern corporate culture. That, in and of itself, should be at least mildly concerning.



Because modern game development sort of nurtures that mindset. One of the WoW devs was adamant in making Ardenweald effectively 50/50 in gender ratio. While I personally didn't really care (nor would I have even noticed unless it was explicitly pointed out by them), making such things into a highly-conscious decision makes the "Numbers and charts" thing not too far of a logical leap.

It’s just like garbage anti-racism corporate training. “Woke” people hate that shit too. We just don’t spend our time crying about it. We laugh at it and move on to working on actual solutions.

[Sinfelle]

This isn't what we meant by rework racials

[arkanon]

It’s just like garbage anti-racism corporate training. “Woke” people hate that shit too. We just don’t spend our time crying about it. We laugh at it and move on to working on actual solutions.

"We"? Are you saying you identify as Woke?

[Syncr]

Because it doesn’t say they worked on this for five years. It says they started conceiving of a way to solve this problem five years ago. That’s not the same thing.

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It’s just like garbage anti-racism corporate training. “Woke” people hate that shit too. We just don’t spend our time crying about it. We laugh at it and move on to working on actual solutions.

A distinction without a difference is what that’s called.

[Zolaris192]

now we know why overwatch 2's dev time took 4 years

[NineSpine]

"We"? Are you saying you identify as Woke?

I am what weirdo losers would call “woke”.

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A distinction without a difference is what that’s called.

If you think there’s no difference between “I had an idea five years ago” and “I worked on this for five years”. Ok then.