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  1. #101
    Would be interesting to have a mythic tier to not have gear involvement. On one hand, all characters utilize the exact same template with no option to change any gear and no drops other than titles/mounts/transmogs.

    Will obviously get old very fast and not be very popular anyway, especially when the top guilds will just run with 10 * x class, but an interesting experiment nonetheless.

  2. #102
    I am Murloc! Makabreska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feral Druid ist Op View Post
    who you define as a mythic raider? the dog guilds in WR 2000? those are HC raiders doing first half on myhtic afer 6 nerfs 4 months in
    they maybe care for gear cuz they need all the help they can get to make up the lack off brain cells.
    I cleared 11/11 with 272 ilvl this is equal to 268 valor gear + 2 legos and the bosses had 4x less nerfs back then you dont even need mythic gear tahts why no one whos good cares you may get your farm runs 20 mins faster in wow gj and thats it
    Man, and here I though Mythic elitism was gone.
    Sometimes, the light of the moon is a key to other spaces. I've found a place where, for a night or two, the streets curve in unfamiliar ways. If I walk here, I might find insight, or I might be touched by madness.

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by Syncr View Post
    So I guess suggesting a game should respect your time because you have real life to tend to, means your entitled?
    Wow that’s quite the spin you got on that.
    Games are not made to respect your time - essentially, they are made to waste your time (which is not a bad thing by any means).
    It's only down to you to respect your time, so put your money where your mouth is and don't play it if you feel it's not worth your time. I swear people always find it the hardest to do the most obvious thing! If you're an adult and have real life obligations, you have to make a choice on how to use your free time - like every adult does. Hint: investing your time into forum battles is rarely the most sensible choice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by stomination View Post
    pray do tell the reason we play in mythic.
    It's a trap. He said "good raiders", so if you don't agree, you automatically fall into the "bad raiders" group. There is nothing here to discuss.

  4. #104
    Moderator Cloudmaker's Avatar
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    Haha, I wonder who would play for so many hours to kill bosses and get no loot. Though I agree with it in some way. There could be different rewards like some epic cosmetic appearances or mounts.
    Behold my new creation!


  5. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by erifwodahs View Post
    I bet there are people who raid to get that best ilvl possible - it would make it better for them.
    Agree, but getting bis is much easier in m+ than in raiding.

    What capped ilvl for m+ and mythic raiding would solve?
    1. Way more accessibility - racing to world/faction/region/realm first is time and gearing issue. Removing gear from equation would ease the pressure and allow more people to participate. It's also better optics for casual people to dip into content because in many people eyes, gear is a barrier for raiding. Many people have the skill to play, but they don't have enough time to grind gear.
    Disagree. Many people are only able to raid because they flatout outgear the content. Just look at the average item level of a heroic jailer kill. It's above 270, meaning most people who killed the jailer got their gear from other sources than raids. So by removing the ability to outgear certain encounters you'll remove access to this mode entirely. Also you should have guild groups in mind, which often consist of players of varying skill levels. It should be possible to carry one or two slackers through a raid.

    2. Alt-Friendly - currently to get any pushing keystones/raiding/parsing done on my alt mage I need to grind base gear which is 272 and then it will sit for weeks waiting for good vaults. If it was capped at hc ilvl - you could get a spec/character ready in few days and it would be as good as your main.
    I mean, agree, but why not abolish the concept of gear alltogether then? Getting gear is like 60% of the motivation of playing WoW. Just look at how Torghast was recieved. It's basically m+ just without the ability to get gear. And most people complained to no end about it. A gamemode without gear is either ignored by most (like the mage tower) or hated (Like Island expeditions or Torghast). To add to this: Torghast is much more hated than Horrific Visions were. Because HV gave gear.


    3. ilvl inflation - we did yet another stat squish in SL - back to back after SL and here we are, going into 100k of HP again and yet another season in front of us. Next expansion we will go into millions again = another stat squish = another load of issues with bad scaling somewhere. removing 13ilvls from each tier would save us a stat squish which is required every expansion now.
    It would also mean, that some classes would have to grind old raids for their BIS items. Think the trinket of Azshara in BfA, think UVLS in MoP just to name a few examples. I think reducing the gap between the different modes from 13 to 10 would be a more sensible solution and would offer a better difficulty curve overall.


    4. balancing - devs would know exactly what ilvl people will have and how much dmg they will do/receive and it would allow them for better class/raid balance.
    See point 1. It's impossible to perfectly balance around players and groups. And ilvl is actuall a tool for balancing. Did you notice how Legion, BfA and Legion did not have a balancing mechanism in their last raids? I'm talking about the buff (extra health and damage) you get in Icecrown, Dragon Soul and SoO. In Legion and BfA Titanforging was that buff. Because the devs actually want players to be able to clear higher difficulties and not getting stuck at one boss for months. In SL this tool is missing, so the devs have to change boss mechanics to lower the difficulty. That's hardly an easier way of balancing.

    What else we need? Better world progression systems - I think that people who do solo gameplay still should be able to get to near hc ilvl over time. ZM system is cool, but it still could go further - why can't next step be gated by some mage-tower styled solo-fight? Add some tuning knobs for it - beat it on "easy" here u go 255ilvl now in world content, "normal" 258ilvl and so on! So people who want gear progression are not locked into raids - because if they raid for gear and not fun, they might want other option then.
    Again, I don't think many players raid for gear when m+ is the strictly superior option and is basically a solo activity. Though I also liked the opportunity to acquire gear through difficult solo content, like horrific visions. Which again makes me wonder, why exactly Torghast doesn't drop gear, since it is the solo activity you're talking about.
    Last edited by LordVargK; 2022-05-23 at 12:36 PM.

  6. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by Rageonit View Post
    Games are not made to respect your time - essentially, they are made to waste your time (which is not a bad thing by any means).
    It's only down to you to respect your time, so put your money where your mouth is and don't play it if you feel it's not worth your time. I swear people always find it the hardest to do the most obvious thing! If you're an adult and have real life obligations, you have to make a choice on how to use your free time - like every adult does. Hint: investing your time into forum battles is rarely the most sensible choice.

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    It's a trap. He said "good raiders", so if you don't agree, you automatically fall into the "bad raiders" group. There is nothing here to discuss.
    Yet he was wr 30 and the op was more worried about the "gooder" raiders doing the race. Poor guy.

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by stomination View Post
    pray do tell the reason we play in mythic.
    was this a question? i cant tell, well if it was then:

    there are 3 types of myhtic guilds that cater to the same type of mythic raider, like i have said before 2000+ WR guilds that cant clear mythic are not mythic guilds or palyer, those are HC raider that get some of nerfed to death mythic bosses along the way

    1 the bad mythic guilds 200-1000 WR goal is CE and mount
    2 the good mythic guilds 20-200 goal is HF
    3 and the best 1-10 goal is WF

    no one of those care about purple pixle unless there is some miracle dps check wall like fallen avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rageonit View Post

    It's a trap. He said "good raiders", so if you don't agree, you automatically fall into the "bad raiders" group. There is nothing here to discuss.
    i mean yes ppl with the goal of geting loot geting g kicked form any normal progression guild we had some guy back in bfa who was like that and he was kicked in hes second trail raid lol, he demanded to be put in into a boss even tho he was bechen cuz he neeeded "loot"
    Last edited by Feral Druid ist Op; 2022-05-23 at 12:49 PM.
    I.O BFA Season 3


  8. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by Feral Druid ist Op View Post
    was this a question? i cant tell, well if it was then:

    there are 3 types of myhtic guilds that cater to the same type of mythic raider, like i have said before 2000+ WR guilds that cant clear mythic are not mythic guilds or palyer, those are HC raider that get some of nerfed to death mythic bosses along the way

    1 the bad mythic guilds 200-1000 WR goal is CE and mount
    2 the good mythic guilds 20-200 goal is HF
    3 and the best 1-10 goal is WF

    no one of those care about purple pixle unless there is some miracle dps check wall like fallen avatar
    Oh we dont need gear until gear is needed.

  9. #109
    Pandaren Monk czarek's Avatar
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    Or maybe just erase all gear progression from all difficulties ?! Just cosmetics at all with recolored in every difficulty level

  10. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by stomination View Post
    Oh we dont need gear until gear is needed.
    but those bosses dont exist for over 8 years now and if they get nerfed week 1-2 therefore you dont need any gear past HC and M+ to clear 11/11
    I.O BFA Season 3


  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    Asking a game to respect your time is like saying that cars should respect the speed limit. If you feel like a game isn't "respecting your time" play another fucking game.
    That isn’t a response at all, that’s just a lazy thing people say when they have nothing to add.

    “DONT LIKE THE GAME DONT PLAY IT”

    Great input, let me know when you have something to add to the discussion.

  12. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by Syncr View Post
    That isn’t a response at all, that’s just a lazy thing people say when they have nothing to add.
    “DONT LIKE THE GAME DONT PLAY IT”
    Great input, let me know when you have something to add to the discussion.
    There is no input to be made if he enjoys the game the way it is. You're in no obligation to enjoy it too and for most people, it's really rather simple: they do things they enjoy and they don't do things they don't enjoy, instead of complaining that the thing they don't enjoy should be changed to their liking.
    By the way, you're complaining WoW is not respecting your time, yet you're here wasting it the worst way you possibly could. Do you realise how much it undermines your own argument? Why should WoW respect your time, if you can't respect it yourself? So in reality, this is not about any kind of respect; you want a different game and you make up arguments to make it seem sensible, while doing the exact opposite thing.
    Last edited by Rageonit; 2022-05-23 at 01:06 PM.

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by Rageonit View Post
    There is no input to be made if he enjoys the game the way it is. You're in no obligation to enjoy it too and for most people, it's really rather simple: they do things they enjoy and they don't do things they don't enjoy, instead of complaining that the thing they don't enjoy should be changed to their liking.
    By the way, you're complaining WoW is not respecting your time, yet you're here wasting it the worst way you possibly could. Do you realise how much it undermines your own argument? Why should WoW respect your time, if you can't respect it yourself? So in reality, this is not about any kind of respect; you want a different game and you make up arguments to make it seem sensible, while doing the exact opposite things.
    You’re on a forum that is made for discussions about the game. One subject that is most common is changes or suggested changes to the game. If your brain is so limited it is incapable of having any of these discussions, while you are actively coming to a FORUM, then I don’t know what to tell you.

  14. #114
    M+ above 15, and mythic raids are the only places that should drop gear cause that's the only place you need gear. 252 cypher gear is good enough for all other content. If you can't down every content below m+15 or mythic raid, it's a skill issue not a gear issue.

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by Syncr View Post
    You’re on a forum that is made for discussions about the game. One subject that is most common is changes or suggested changes to the game. If your brain is so limited it is incapable of having any of these discussions, while you are actively coming to a FORUM, then I don’t know what to tell you.
    There's no discussion to have if the premise is wrong, and I firmly believe yours is: it's not the game's obligation to "respect your time". Game gives you a way to spend your time, and it's down to you to decide if it's a time well spent or not. Simple as that. So yours "WoW needs to respect my time" translates into: "I want my rewards faster". That's all there is to it.

  16. #116


    i respectfully disagree

  17. #117
    No if anything remove gear from all non premade group content. Casual scrubs don't deserve gear but if you're alpha and have the skills to clear mythic you deserve much more powerful rewards than those who don't. But hey, maybe you want the game to die, which by all means remove the hardcore playerbase who's carrying the game from the equation.

  18. #118
    I am Murloc! dacoolist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by callipygoustp View Post
    Yeah! People should be doing nude Mythic!!!
    I'm going to take this to the next level: WoW should just delete gear - everyone has max gear 100% of the time, no more issues with Loot Drama or running SPLITS or saying to me in whisper "the only reason you beat me is gear" - no more. Blizzard: I agree, get this man a DRINK - lets get naked

  19. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by Rageonit View Post
    There's no discussion to have if the premise is wrong, and I firmly believe yours is: it's not the game's obligation to "respect your time". Game gives you a way to spend your time, and it's down to you to decide if it's a time well spent or not. Simple as that. So yours "WoW needs to respect my time" translates into: "I want my rewards faster". That's all there is to it.
    Just because you disagree with a premise, doesn’t make it wrong, that’s not how the world works.

  20. #120
    Quote Originally Posted by Syncr View Post
    Just because you disagree with a premise, doesn’t make it wrong, that’s not how the world works.
    It may not make it wrong, but you said nothing yet to make it right.

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