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  1. #1

    I wonder why metal is more popular in countries like Japan, Europe,Brazil.

    I noticed in videos on youtube, that metal is more popular in countries like Brazil,Japan,Europe and seems many there bring women who are into metal.

    While in the United States, it is mostly a sausage fest with only guys.

    I wonder why metal seems more popular abroad, then in the States.
    Last edited by Axelthefox; 2022-05-24 at 01:35 AM.

  2. #2
    Europe is my favourite country.
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  3. #3
    The Insane Val the Moofia Boss's Avatar
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    This ties into the overall demise of American music. Americans are weened on crappy music and thus don't appreciate music very much, and good music goes unnoticed.

    We are created to understand music. Our neurology responds to pitches over time. Music theory codifies that. It is not subjective. We speak in perfect intervals. When you speak, you're singing a melody.

    Classical music theory fell out of fashion. In the modern period, we have an artificial invention of music theory, namely the twelve tone scale. Tonal harmony is a function of nature. Tonalism is a rebellion against it. Schonburg rebelled against nature by replacing it with his own invented music theory called 12 tone music theory, which doesn't represent the 12 notes in nature. His notes are adjusted, equal tempered and are an altering of what nature produces. He codified them so no pitch would be used more than another, so there is no consonance. It's only dissonance.

    Rather than styles coming in and out, you have a replacement of the whole idea that something is a vehicle for meaning. We now have this post-modernist idea that "the meaning is completely subjective", which basically means that there is no intended meaning behind the art, no artistic intent... and you've lost art. This is the problem with the academy. It's been a hundred year since we've had a composer coming out of the academy producing music anyone cares about. Instead, all of the good music that is for orchestra are film scores. In a hundred years, composition students after this trend is long dead will be studying John Williams and James Horner, and maybe even electronic artists like Philip Glass. They certainly won't be listening to Milton Babbitt.

    Japanese composers and metal bands have preserved the tradition of classical music better than Western composers have. Most Western music students are not taught tradition properly. They have composition degrees, but don't know how to compose music. Japanese composers are taught the tradition properly. That's why video game soundtracks are far more memorable than their Western counterparts. They are melodic and well composed. Metal bands have to learn classical music theory, be it by learning techniques passed down by their predecessors or by the necessity of having to get good or fade into obscurity.
    Last edited by Val the Moofia Boss; 2022-05-24 at 02:26 AM.

  4. #4
    The Insane DeltrusDisc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Val the Moofia Boss View Post
    This ties into the overall demise of American music. Americans are weened on crappy music and thus don't appreciate music very much, and good music goes unnoticed.

    We are created to understand music. Our neurology responds to pitches over time. Music theory codifies that. It is not subjective. We speak in perfect intervals. When you speak, you're singing a melody.

    Classical music theory fell out of fashion. In the modern period, we have an artificial invention of music theory, namely the twelve tone scale. Tonal harmony is a function of nature. Tonalism is a rebellion against it. Schonburg rebelled against nature by replacing it with his own invented music theory called 12 tone music theory, which don't represent 12 notes in nature. Are adjusted, equal tempered altering of what nature produces. He codified them so no pitch would be used more than another, so there is no consonance. It's only disonance.

    Rather than styles coming in and out, you have a replacement of the whole idea that something is a vehicle for meaning. We now have this post-modernist idea that "the meaning is completely subjective", which basically means that there is no intended meaning behind the art, no artistic intent... and you've lost art. This is the problem with the academy. It's been a hundred year since we've had a composer coming out of the academy producing music anyone cares about. Instead, all of the good music that is for orchestra are film scores. In a hundred years, composition students after this trend is long dead will be studying John Williams and James Horner, and maybe even electronic artists like Philip Glass. They certainly won't be listening to Milton Babbitt.

    Japanese composers and metal bands have preserved the tradition of classical music better than Western composers have. Most Western music students are not taught tradition properly. They have composition degrees, but don't know how to compose music. Japanese composers are taught the tradition properly. That's why video game soundtracks are far more memorable than their Western counterparts. They are melodic and well composed. Metal bands have to learn classical music theory, be it by learning techniques passed down by their predecessors or by the necessity of having to get good or fade into obscurity.
    It pains my heart how much this speaks to me. So many orchestras focus so strongly on the classics from hundreds of years ago and you never really hear about people composing new music. This is sad. Folks like Christopher Tin I can only hope find great success, what do you think of his work?

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  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by AwkwardSquirtle View Post
    Europe is my favourite country.
    Wish I could speak European...

  6. #6
    I'd first want to know more about the premise.

    Is metal ACTUALLY more popular in those countries? By how much? How are those data gathered and analyzed? How true is that claim that there's more female fans in those countries?

    There could be a number of reasons behind it. For example, tighter geography might be more conducive to music that has a thriving "lifestyle" scene attached to it that primarily manifests itself in live events. The US is pretty large - it's difficult for people to attend events across the country. Whereas in Europe, a couple hours driving will take you across several nations and half the continent; while something like e.g. the Tokyo metropolitan area has more people than most COUNTRIES concentrated across a tight, highly connected urban space.

    So it might not be some kind of "national music taste" at play here at all, but simply a knock-on effect resulting from unrelated circumstances. Fandom tends to propagate faster when there's more connectivity - the more people are concentrated in a smaller area, the easier it is to spread. Fans become artists themselves, which then create more fans, etc.

  7. #7
    Over 9000! Kyphael's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daedius View Post
    Wish I could speak European...
    So the British speak European, no wonder Americans can't understand them.

  8. #8
    It's because America is more diverse. It's nothing complicated.

  9. #9
    Is this new data harvesting account?

  10. #10
    Stood in the Fire Derpules's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Val the Moofia Boss View Post
    This ties into the overall demise of American music. Americans are weened on crappy music and thus don't appreciate music very much, and good music goes unnoticed.

    We are created to understand music. Our neurology responds to pitches over time. Music theory codifies that. It is not subjective. We speak in perfect intervals. When you speak, you're singing a melody.

    Classical music theory fell out of fashion. In the modern period, we have an artificial invention of music theory, namely the twelve tone scale. Tonal harmony is a function of nature. Tonalism is a rebellion against it. Schonburg rebelled against nature by replacing it with his own invented music theory called 12 tone music theory, which doesn't represent the 12 notes in nature. His notes are adjusted, equal tempered and are an altering of what nature produces. He codified them so no pitch would be used more than another, so there is no consonance. It's only dissonance.

    Rather than styles coming in and out, you have a replacement of the whole idea that something is a vehicle for meaning. We now have this post-modernist idea that "the meaning is completely subjective", which basically means that there is no intended meaning behind the art, no artistic intent... and you've lost art. This is the problem with the academy. It's been a hundred year since we've had a composer coming out of the academy producing music anyone cares about. Instead, all of the good music that is for orchestra are film scores. In a hundred years, composition students after this trend is long dead will be studying John Williams and James Horner, and maybe even electronic artists like Philip Glass. They certainly won't be listening to Milton Babbitt.

    Japanese composers and metal bands have preserved the tradition of classical music better than Western composers have. Most Western music students are not taught tradition properly. They have composition degrees, but don't know how to compose music. Japanese composers are taught the tradition properly. That's why video game soundtracks are far more memorable than their Western counterparts. They are melodic and well composed. Metal bands have to learn classical music theory, be it by learning techniques passed down by their predecessors or by the necessity of having to get good or fade into obscurity.
    So much truth in a single post. As to OP's question about it being a sausage fest; If you're up in the moshing section, yeah. Man meat everywhere.
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  11. #11
    Immortal FuxieDK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axelthefox View Post
    I noticed in videos on youtube, that metal is more popular in countries like Brazil,Japan,Europe and seems many there bring women who are into metal.

    While in the United States, it is mostly a sausage fest with only guys.

    I wonder why metal seems more popular abroad, then in the States.
    Please refrain from calling Europe a country.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Verdugo View Post
    Is this new data harvesting account?

    Yep. Check out his/her/its other threads.

  13. #13
    Pit Lord RH92's Avatar
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    I don't find metal being more popular here, like at all.

    I still think the genre is mostly dominated by American bands and people tend to assume such thing because the crowds go wild whenever they visit Europe, Asia or Latin America. We don't get to see our favorite bands that often so whenever we can, you want to make it count.

    I can't speak for Brazil or Japan but in Europe the only countries I can think where Metal might be more accepted are Sweden, Norway, Finland and Great Britian. I don't think that's the case for other European countries.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Val the Moofia Boss View Post
    This ties into the overall demise of American music. Americans are weened on crappy music and thus don't appreciate music very much, and good music goes unnoticed.

    We are created to understand music. Our neurology responds to pitches over time. Music theory codifies that. It is not subjective. We speak in perfect intervals. When you speak, you're singing a melody.

    Classical music theory fell out of fashion. In the modern period, we have an artificial invention of music theory, namely the twelve tone scale. Tonal harmony is a function of nature. Tonalism is a rebellion against it. Schonburg rebelled against nature by replacing it with his own invented music theory called 12 tone music theory, which doesn't represent the 12 notes in nature. His notes are adjusted, equal tempered and are an altering of what nature produces. He codified them so no pitch would be used more than another, so there is no consonance. It's only dissonance.

    Rather than styles coming in and out, you have a replacement of the whole idea that something is a vehicle for meaning. We now have this post-modernist idea that "the meaning is completely subjective", which basically means that there is no intended meaning behind the art, no artistic intent... and you've lost art. This is the problem with the academy. It's been a hundred year since we've had a composer coming out of the academy producing music anyone cares about. Instead, all of the good music that is for orchestra are film scores. In a hundred years, composition students after this trend is long dead will be studying John Williams and James Horner, and maybe even electronic artists like Philip Glass. They certainly won't be listening to Milton Babbitt.

    Japanese composers and metal bands have preserved the tradition of classical music better than Western composers have. Most Western music students are not taught tradition properly. They have composition degrees, but don't know how to compose music. Japanese composers are taught the tradition properly. That's why video game soundtracks are far more memorable than their Western counterparts. They are melodic and well composed. Metal bands have to learn classical music theory, be it by learning techniques passed down by their predecessors or by the necessity of having to get good or fade into obscurity.
    This is basically garbage.

    Classical music fell out of favor because elitists made it boring. Generally speaking, classical music was written to be experimented with and riffed upon. Elitist gatekeepers turned classical music into a museum where things like improvisation, which is a key part of a lot of classic pieces, was replaced with pre-written and "acceptable" material. God forbid we experiment with newer instruments or dramatic changes to arrangements. They removed everything dynamic from classical music and turned it into a very bland window into a fairly boring period of musical history.

    As far as Japanese versus western composition, you are ignoring that some of these changes are intentional stylistic decisions. Techniques like identifiable motifs and recurring melodic themes fell out of favor in Western film, just like it did in Western games, after a period of intense and profound accomplishment through the 60s to 90s in writing music that way for other media. Music has taken a more background, textural, ambient role since then. That's not lowering the bar. That's intentional. You can find a great talk from Tom Holkenborg (Junkie XL) on this stylistic shift in one of his videos, but I can't remember which one, maybe is video on the Mad Max soundtrack. Japan is still really invested in the motif-based style, which is a style that was absolutely mastered and perfected by a Western composer anyway, John Williams.

    As someone that has played in many, many metal bands, you are painting with way too broad a brush. You can find a great group interview with Rick Beato and a handful of the most accomplished metal guitarists producing new music right now, and all of them say that theory is not the basis for their writing, nor are any of them particularly theory adept. I don't buy into these ideas that theory is useless or bad to learn, as some do, but you can't paint all of metal with that broad a brush.
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  15. #15
    Scarab Lord Ihavewaffles's Avatar
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    Metal comes and goes...it was huge in the 80s, in the 90s you had metallica etc. in the 00s you had the gothenburg sound bands, but now?

  16. #16
    ̶s̶̶u̶̶r̶̶v̶̶i̶̶v̶̶i̶̶n̶̶g̶̶ ̶ living in the states is already metal enough.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by FuxieDK View Post
    Please refrain from calling Europe a country.
    Countries in Europe ceded their sovereignty to the EU. Europe is therefore a country. Leave the EU if you don't like it.

    No different than the States that make up the USA.
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  18. #18
    systematic depression

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by bullseyed View Post
    Countries in Europe ceded their sovereignty to the EU. Europe is therefore a country. Leave the EU if you don't like it. No different than the States that make up the USA.

  20. #20
    Immortal jackofwind's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bullseyed View Post
    Countries in Europe ceded their sovereignty to the EU. Europe is therefore a country. Leave the EU if you don't like it.

    No different than the States that make up the USA.
    States in the USA are states. They were never countries.

    Countries in the EU are countries. The EU is no more a country than any other international economic conglomerate.
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    Because fuck you, that's why.

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