Texas Elementary School Shooting, as many as 22 dead, including Children

[Crissi]

As i understand, parts of this speech haven't aired in Texas due to "technical mistakes".

in DFW, WFAA kept having technical issues. Which I believe, because they are very much a liberal leaning station and are not owned by Sinclair.

[PhaelixWW]

Uhhh... part of the problem at the moment (see Roe vs Wade imminent repeal) is that the justices CAN just decide whatever they want.

No, they can't. You just repeating "yes they can" doesn't change the truth.

That doesn't mean that within the very narrow scope of their interpretive focus they can't effect changes that are important, meaningful, or widely felt. That's rather why they exist, in point of fact.

[Kaleredar]

That's not at all what case law is. It doesn't "trump" the law, it is the law, as interpreted by the judiciary, whose job it is... to interpret the law. So no, Constitutional case law isn't just "made up random shit", and the justices can't just decide whatever they want.



Following the case law is following the Constitution, though. But the room for judicial decisions is exceedingly narrow in scope. As I said, most case law has been about broadening and enshrining the rights found in the Constitution. The 14th, for example, is the foundation for other later-affirmed rights, such as the right to privacy, which in turn is the basis for the Roe v. Wade decision, despite the fact that privacy is never mentioned in the Constitution explicitly. We should definitely be wary about all attempts to erode the protections established by the Constitution.

And I certainly never said the Constitution should never be changed. There's a process for that, though.

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Yeah, this is looking worse and worse for the local police department.

People should be extending this as a condemnation of all "good guys with guns can handle bad guys with guns, we just need more good guys with guns!" reasoning that's failed thus far and will continue to fail in the future, not just for this specific police precinct.

[Trifle]

No, they can't. You just repeating "yes they can" doesn't change the truth.

That doesn't mean that within the very narrow scope of their interpretive focus they can't effect changes that are important, meaningful, or widely felt. That's rather why they exist, in point of fact.

I feel like your position is more about how the system should be working, as opposed to how it's currently working. Due to changing circumstances such as the current paralysis of the legislative branch, I don't agree that currently their scope is as narrow as you seem to think it is, but I don't think either of us will convince the other at this point.

[Edge-]

Uvalde school district made extensive security preparations that failed to stop shooting

Man are they gonna have a lot of 'splainin to do.

[MCMLXXXII]

So Trump spoke at a NRA convention, three days after the shooting. Really setting himself up for another campaign...

[Breccia]

The ArmaLite AR-10 was never adopted as a US battle rifle. While the ArmaLite AR-15 was adopted by the military as the M16--

Okay, I see we have fundamentally different opinions of the word "replaced". Considering ArmaLite made the AR-10, tried to sell the US military on it, it didn't work, so they instead made the AR-15 and tried to sell the military on that, and it did work, I will stick with my version, "to take the place of especially as a substitute or successor" and/or "to put something new in the place of". You know, the dictionary definition of the word, and objectively correct depiction of the AR-10/AR-15's history. The fact that the AR-10 was not used by US military (well not for decades later) is irrelevant.

Sorry. I don't make the guns.

On topic: we are learning more about the Texas school, including their special security.

Records show the district spent about $200,000 on security and monitoring services in 2017-18 and that figure rose to more than $450,000 in the 2019-20 school year.

The district employed four police officers, including a chief, detective, and two officers. The school district also had additional security staff "who patrol door entrances, parking lots and perimeters of the campuses."

The plan included a "threat reporting system" for "students, parents, staff, and community members" to share information that is deemed "troubling," which could include information "about weapons, threats, fights, drugs, self-harm, suicide or disclosures made that are concerning." The policy states reports could be made through the district site or to a district staff member.

The district also employed a company called Social Sentinel to monitor social media "with a connection to Uvalde as a measure to identify any possible threats that might be made against students and or staff within the school district."

The security plan also refers to lockdown drills. "Students receive training on the Standard Response Protocol for lockout, lockdown, evacuate, shelter, and hold. In addition, drills are held for each of these emergency actions on a regular basis."

Of course, none of that worked. A lot of that makes sense. There was a basically zero chance that, when the murderer sent a text message to someone in Germany apparently, that it would be caught by a Texas school district in time. Or...ever, since I don't think they have that power or authority to intercept private messages between someone who wasn't even a member of that school and someone who wasn't even in the country. The FBI maybe, if they were listening to literally everyone literally all the time without just cause to do so. They're...not, that's effectively impossible.

So, the officers that school had for only themselves either:
a) didn't have the required tools to stop one American with a gun Texas insists every American should have, which raises questions about how a police officer should be outgunned by the average American. Not Rambo or a gun runner, the average American.
b) did have the tools, but chose not to use them
c) just weren't there, which really conflicts with their own earlier statements, but is honestly the most understandable of the three. If, just to use a complete hypothetical, I were to break into TexasRules' house to start chain-vomiting on his furniture, I think it would be odd if a police officer was there before I arrived. There aren't enough police officers to have one at every doorway. Perhaps Texas will ask their citizens to pay even higher taxes to help protect their children from the average American using a weapon of war, like the AR-15, to kill as many children as possible.

The drills did not work at all. Either the teachers missed the warning signs, didn't follow the drill's plan, or they did but it wasn't enough because Texas insists the average American have a weapon of war. In any event, there was no plan that was capable of protecting the children, which was followed, as evidenced by all the dead children. And teachers. I can't speak for the Texas school's doors, but the ones I teach behind are inch-thick wood with security glass and deadbolts. I have every faith such a door would stop someone with a knife, but someone with a weapon of war -- like the shooter in this case and his AR-15 -- could probably break the door if they spent enough ammo on it. Again, perhaps Texas will ask its taxpayers for more money for doors capable of stopping the kind of firepower they insist the average American be allowed to have. Solid steel doors, perhaps.

I guess Texas will just have to decide how much their chidren's lives are worth, how much they're willing to turn their schools into heavily-armed heavily-armored fortresses. Or, more realistically, how many more schoolchildren will be murdered just so the average American can have a weapon of war, because they want one to shoot up a school.

Lt. Gov. Dan Patrick said that the Uvalde district “has been doing a really good job in trying to protect their students.”

Patrick said that a 2019 law, passed in the wake of a shooting at high school in Santa Fe, Texas, a year earlier, allocated $100 million for districts to beef up their security measures. But he said more needed to be done — including, perhaps, a way to keep only one entrance available to visitors of small schools.

“No matter what you do, there’s going to be someone to find another area that’s vulnerable,” Patrick said.

I've heard that argument before. "Why make XXX illegal, criminals will just find another way to get it?" It's an interesting approach to try from someone who wants to make something else, such as abortion, illegal. I get what Lt. Gov. Patrick was trying to say, and actually agree that no defense would be 100%. Of course, when Lt. Gov. Patrick is helping make sure the average American has access to a weapon of war capable of breaking this defense this easily, maybe discussing 100% isn't really the point. There was no security on scene willing and able to stop the obviously armed, obviously dangerous murderer. There was no plan that was followed that stopped him from murdering a class full of terrified children and their teachers. Someone with an off-the-rack weapon of war walked directly towards the nearest school and murdered as many innocent people as he could, as quickly as he could.

Any extra actions taken by Texas simply didn't help.

The end. 21 times.

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So Trump spoke at a NRA convention, three days after the shooting.

Did he say he would have run into this one, too?

[Masark]

https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-...oter-rcna30511

More on Republicans being awful people: They're out there harassing a trans woman by claiming she was actually the shooter. Claiming images were from 4chin.

They weren't, they were from her social media accounts.

Republicans are just filth. Period.

And now people are being assaulted because of that shit.

https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2022/05/...-trans-person/

Gosar should be physically thrown from the House chamber.

[PhaelixWW]

Okay, I see we have fundamentally different opinions of the word "replaced".

And see, the "replace" aspect was the least import bit of the whole response. So the fact that you singled it out is kinda telling.

We can agree to disagree on whether or not your use of the word "replace" is accurate. (They were just two different models: the ArmaLite AR-15 did not supersede the ArmaLite AR-10 at all and both models continued to be made afterward, side-by-side.) But the ArmaLite AR-10 was never adopted by the US military, not even "decades later" as you suggest. (There are a few specialist rifles that are used, but they're only "loosely based" on the original ArmaLite AR-10 design, as, indeed, are a vast amount of different models.)

And most importantly, the civilian AR-15 of today is not the same gun as the ArmaLite AR-15 that was adopted by the military as the M16.

Sorry. I don't make the guns.

Yeah, you don't really understand the guns, either, which is probably understandable.

[postman1782]

No, they can't. You just repeating "yes they can" doesn't change the truth.

That doesn't mean that within the very narrow scope of their interpretive focus they can't effect changes that are important, meaningful, or widely felt. That's rather why they exist, in point of fact.

Guns aren't specifically mentioned in the constitution, according to Alito, they can be banned.

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So Trump spoke at a NRA convention, three days after the shooting. Really setting himself up for another campaign...

I thought that wasn't til today? But it wouldn't surprise me, that orange shitstain turns every event he is at, into a poor me campaign rally. Including weddings, natural disasters and mass shootings.

[Draco-Onis]

I feel like your position is more about how the system should be working, as opposed to how it's currently working. Due to changing circumstances such as the current paralysis of the legislative branch, I don't agree that currently their scope is as narrow as you seem to think it is, but I don't think either of us will convince the other at this point.

No his opinion is always based on his masturbatory belief that he is right, while Roe V. Wade is the most plain example the supreme court have been pulling rulings out of their derriere for a while. They have gutted several laws meant to protect voting, union rights among many others to help the GOP, they were specifically put on the bench to render these decisions. There are no rules anymore you have to be delusional to think so when Alito is quoting colonial English law to render a judgement that reverses decades of precedent.

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I didn't say the police. I said the city. Or at least get a bill that can be voted on where a person can claim a refund for city services not done when supposed to.

I am sure there are several lawsuits that can be filled against the city and the school, they would most likely settle since that court case would be a nightmare for them.

[Huehuecoyotl]

So if good guys with guns are good, and should stop bad guys with guns, who are bad.....shouldn't we have some means of stopping bad guys from getting guns? Like, I don't know, some kind of gun control?

Because I think that would work better than "let everyone have as many guns as they want, and see what happens".

[Nastard]

So Trump spoke at a NRA convention, three days after the shooting. Really setting himself up for another campaign...

Sadly, it'll only stand to boost his support within Republicans. You have to realize how most of them view school shootings. They don't give a shit about the innocents lost, but are afraid it will be an "excuse" to take away their guns. Hence why gun sales always soar after a school shooting.

[Levelfive]

The same place where it says that the 1st Amendment doesn't apply when someone yells "Fire!" in a crowded room, or uses certain types of extreme hate-speech.

That's the point of case law.

Except none of that is true.

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Guns aren't specifically mentioned in the constitution, according to Alito, they can be banned.

Also, women aren't mentioned in the Constitution, so no laws apply to them at all. Right, Alito?

[Breccia]

And see, the "replace" aspect was the least import bit of the whole response. So the fact that you singled it out is kinda telling.

Um...

The ArmaLite AR-15 didn't "replace" the ArmaLite AR-10

You're the one who singled it out, dude. Can we get back on topic please? Or are we going to get into how Ford didn't replace the Pinto with the Escort in 1980 next, because the US military never approved of the Pinto?

[Canpinter]

Ok so apparently the cops lied about confronting the shooter outside?

[D Luniz]

I fully expect it to turn out the local police depts took the money that was supposed to be for training and gear in situations like this, and fucked off with it.

[Very Tired]

I honestly don't know how he ONLY killed 21 people in the 40 minute window these coward cops gave him. I assume even the shooter was wondering wtf was happening with the cops, maybe even took a smoke break halfway through.

[Levelfive]

I honestly don't know how he ONLY killed 21 people in the 40 minute window these coward cops gave him. I assume even the shooter was wondering wtf was happening with the cops, maybe even took a smoke break halfway through.

Because he locked himself in one room--as I understand it, everyone killed was in that classroom. Cops "solved" it by getting a staff person to unlock the door after an hour or so of threatening and handcuffing parents.

[Edge-]

Ok so apparently the cops lied about confronting the shooter outside?

They've lied about a whole lotta shit, as has Abbott, and I'm sure we'll find out more of their lies soon enough.

Anything to make it seem like your own incompetence and inaction resulted in more dead kids because, "Well, our officers could have been shot if they'd gone in."