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  1. #481
    Imagine arguing the pedantry of people not being wholly educated about firearm nuance when 19 kids will never know those differences because they were shot dead in an institute that exists to educate and prepare them for life after childhood.

    Fuck the “freedoms” of people when this was the system working . At some point, you grow up and realise that even if you aren’t a piece of shit, the freedoms you want are allowing this, and you have to now accept that maybe you need to make the sacrifice of not having accessible guns. I know those selfish kids didn’t want to sacrifice themselves for you, but maybe you can stand up and say, “I appreciate what I have and will give up some to curb or stop this rampant destruction”.

  2. #482
    Quote Originally Posted by Minifie View Post
    Imagine arguing the pedantry of people not being wholly educated about firearm nuance when 19 kids will never know those differences because they were shot dead in an institute that exists to educate and prepare them for life after childhood.

    Fuck the “freedoms” of people when this was the system working . At some point, you grow up and realise that even if you aren’t a piece of shit, the freedoms you want are allowing this, and you have to now accept that maybe you need to make the sacrifice of not having accessible guns. I know those selfish kids didn’t want to sacrifice themselves for you, but maybe you can stand up and say, “I appreciate what I have and will give up some to curb or stop this rampant destruction”.
    They simply do not care not now not ever. They think that whatever small arms they have will protect them if the government came to take their guns but good news is that i would simply tell officials of every person i know of if they had any kind of firearm addresses, car model etc.

  3. #483
    The 2nd amendment crowd do not want guns for "government tyranny", truly it is about some civil war and race issue... these issues became way more pronounced under Obama and it has been a decent dog whistle to whip up voters.

  4. #484
    The Unstoppable Force PACOX's Avatar
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    I remember when I was in high school and middle school all exits were monitored or locked. Your only chance to sneak in without crossing facility was during lunch. We even had a satellite parking lot that they watched with golf carts. Doors also auto locked.


    You either had to go through the office or a past facility/the resource officer to get on campus. I'm guessing elementary schools are a bit more lax but I imagined that wouldn't be the case because little kids are more prone to wandering off or taken off campus without permission. I can't get over how someone could just walk on campus. I blame poor budgets and regulation blocking legislation.

    I think it's almost worse that he didn't encounter the RO prior, at least you could identify the point of failure and work from there.


    The gun control discussion is mute. What can be said has been said years ago. If Sandy Hook and Vegas weren't the breaking point then I don't want to even imagine if such an event exists. We live in a country held back by the bastardization of words from a few old dudes from 200 years ago. We're still held back by the a few old dudes completely detached from the lives of the average citizen.

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  5. #485
    Quote Originally Posted by PACOX View Post
    I remember when I was in high school and middle school all exits were monitored or locked. Your only chance to sneak in without crossing facility was during lunch. We even had a satellite parking lot that they watched with golf carts. Doors also auto locked.


    You either had to go through the office or a past facility/the resource officer to get on campus. I'm guessing elementary schools are a bit more lax but I imagined that wouldn't be the case because little kids are more prone to wandering off or taken off campus without permission. I can't get over how someone could just walk on campus. I blame poor budgets and regulation blocking legislation.

    I think it's almost worse that he didn't encounter the RO prior, at least you could identify the point of failure and work from there.


    The gun control discussion is mute. What can be said has been said years ago. If Sandy Hook and Vegas weren't the breaking point then I don't want to even imagine if such an event exists. We live in a country held back by the bastardization of words from a few old dudes from 200 years ago. We're still held back by the a few old dudes completely detached from the lives of the average citizen.
    I mean, yeah, nothing will change… except turning schools into bunkers because apparently that makes more sense to Republicans than gun control.
    Last edited by Winter Blossom; 2022-05-27 at 12:19 AM. Reason: typo
    Fairy tales are more than true–not because they tell us dragons exist, but because they tell us dragons can be beaten. -G. K. Chesterton & Neil Gaiman

  6. #486
    Quote Originally Posted by PACOX View Post
    I remember when I was in high school and middle school all exits were monitored or locked. Your only chance to sneak in without crossing facility was during lunch. We even had a satellite parking lot that they watched with golf carts. Doors also auto locked.


    You either had to go through the office or a past facility/the resource officer to get on campus. I'm guessing elementary schools are a bit more lax but I imagined that wouldn't be the case because little kids are more prone to wandering off or taken off campus without permission. I can't get over how someone could just walk on campus. I blame poor budgets and regulation blocking legislation.

    I think it's almost worse that he didn't encounter the RO prior, at least you could identify the point of failure and work from there.


    The gun control discussion is mute. What can be said has been said years ago. If Sandy Hook and Vegas weren't the breaking point then I don't want to even imagine if such an event exists. We live in a country held back by the bastardization of words from a few old dudes from 200 years ago. We're still held back by the a few old dudes completely detached from the lives of the average citizen.
    Australian, but when I went to school there was so many access points, bloody huge batch of trees you could just sneak off into, major highway at our doorstep, never had these locking of doors or PCO to protect us. Damn the kids are paying a huge price for ammosexuals.

  7. #487
    Quote Originally Posted by PACOX View Post
    I remember when I was in high school and middle school all exits were monitored or locked. Your only chance to sneak in without crossing facility was during lunch. We even had a satellite parking lot that they watched with golf carts. Doors also auto locked.


    You either had to go through the office or a past facility/the resource officer to get on campus. I'm guessing elementary schools are a bit more lax but I imagined that wouldn't be the case because little kids are more prone to wandering off or taken off campus without permission. I can't get over how someone could just walk on campus. I blame poor budgets and regulation blocking legislation.

    I think it's almost worse that he didn't encounter the RO prior, at least you could identify the point of failure and work from there.


    The gun control discussion is mute. What can be said has been said years ago. If Sandy Hook and Vegas weren't the breaking point then I don't want to even imagine if such an event exists. We live in a country held back by the bastardization of words from a few old dudes from 200 years ago. We're still held back by the a few old dudes completely detached from the lives of the average citizen.
    Worse that those old dudes had the idea that the constitution is a living document that should be rewritten by future generations. Yet somehow we end up with people that view the words as sacred things never to be changed...

    An event that would lead to changes? I do not think such an event exists, if it does I can't imagine what it would be. Over a hundred people killed in mass attacks over a couple of weeks wasn't enough... I do not believe an attack where even say hundreds were killed in one event would lead to changes. It would just take the crown of "Most deadly mass shooting" and then we would hear "Shame about those 750 people, we gotta figure out why this keeps happening".

    This country doesn't give a shit and honestly, it feels like it is just a sinking ship. The amount of people that want gun reforms is lower than it used to be due to higher violence... since I guess in typical American fashion, nonsense leads the day.

    "Things are so dangerous because of guns, therefore we need to make guns easier to get so I can protect myself with a gun!"

  8. #488
    https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-...m_npd_ms_tw_ma

    In the continued "galaxy smooth brain" solutions from Republicans we have Rafael Cruz and his obsession with doors.

    How many doors should a school have?

    According to Ted, just one.

    Why? Because it'll make it safer in the event there's a shooter, somehow.

    Will there be any risks to say...evacuating the school during a fire? Probably, yeah, but that's a level of thinking that requires you to think about the consequences of a proposal, and Rafael Cruz has made it abundantly clear he's unable to think further than 5-10 minutes into the future.

  9. #489
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-...m_npd_ms_tw_ma

    In the continued "galaxy smooth brain" solutions from Republicans we have Rafael Cruz and his obsession with doors.

    How many doors should a school have?

    According to Ted, just one.

    Why? Because it'll make it safer in the event there's a shooter, somehow.

    Will there be any risks to say...evacuating the school during a fire? Probably, yeah, but that's a level of thinking that requires you to think about the consequences of a proposal, and Rafael Cruz has made it abundantly clear he's unable to think further than 5-10 minutes into the future.
    Everyone knows the root of the gun problem in America is too many...doors, which other countries must not have too many of, otherwise that explanation would be completely absurd.
    Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect. There is nothing more or else to it, and there never has been, in any place or time. --Frank Wilhoit

  10. #490
    Time to invest in real-fake doors, bamboozle the shooter until kids can escape! It’s a small price you’ll pay for my freedom!

  11. #491
    Quote Originally Posted by PhaelixWW View Post
    Carbine rifles are still rifles...



    The US military had no widespread use of the various CAR-15 carbine models. They were mainly used by some Navy SEALS and Air Force pilots.

    They were also not the same as the civilian models, notably.



    Uh... no.

    There was no standard infantry carbine for 20 years between the M1 and the M4, and since then the M4 has largely phased out the longer M16, starting in 2010. The trend to move towards one primary rifle model has been around for a long, long time. Prior to that, more M1 carbines were produced than M1 Garands. At first, they went for the lighter caliber but longer length in the M16, then moved down to the shorter length in the M4.

    Now, they'll be changing over to the Sig XM5, which is still carbine-length, but moving back to a heavier (though not as heavy as 7.62x51mm or .30-06) caliber for the standard-issue military infantry firearm.



    No, sorry, you said:

    You didn't say carry capacity, you definitely said magazine capacity. That's the only statement you initially made, and to which I objected.



    The admittedly anecdotal information is out there. Knock yourself out.



    "Military style" is a completely meaningless euphemism in this context. Again, there's nothing fundamentally different between an AR-15 and another semi-automatic small-caliber rifle, of which there are lots and have been for a long, long time.



    And there are an awful lot of regulations on firearms, too.



    Hardly the only difference, actually. The restrictions on speech are only there to specifically prevent damaging abuse, whereas most new proposed gun control measures seek to limit normal use in the hopes that it will trickle down to some later instance of damaging abuse, somewhere, somehow.

    Gun control measures that directly target the abuse/abuser are totally fine, but they're mostly all already enacted.
    All you're really doing is showing the US military changes its mind more often than I thought. Its largely irrelevant. The AR 15 is marketed as a masculine, military style weapon. It can be fired quickly even as a semi-automatic and can have very large magazine capacities. Even a semi-competent individual can do a lot of damage in a very short amount of time. And also over an extended period of time.

    You DON'T need it for hunting. Seriously, just stop being an insecure asshole and get a rifle with a lower magazine capacity. Preferably a bolt action. It works for other countries.

    You DON'T need it for self-defence. Successful self-defence is rare to begin with. Actual self-defence with an AR15 is non existent. One frequently cited example is the Sutherlands Church Shooting. Dude drove off the attacker with his AR15. After the attacker killed 26 people and injured 20. Also with an AR15. He was less effective than the Uvalde police department.

    Does losing some rights suck? Sure. So does getting shot with an AR15 either deliberately or by accident. You're never going to be 100% free. If you don't like, fuck off and go live in the woods by yourself.

    I know one guy who likes to shoot guns. He doesn't own a gun. Doesn't want to own a gun. He's quite happy to go on vacation to a decent gun range and use what ever happens to be on hand.
    Last edited by Ivanstone; 2022-05-27 at 12:39 AM.

  12. #492
    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Continues to be hilarious to me that podunk little towns and counties with nobody fuckin living there and no meaningful violent crime that heavily armed law enforcement are needed for always manage to find the budget for heavily armed SWAT teams, complete with military-grade vehicles that they have no use for.

    Fuckin defund the police indeed, start spending that money on something actually effective instead of giving them tanks and more tacticool gear.
    And yet it was the Border Patrol that actually did the job, not their SWAT team nor their actual police. I say that the citizens should sue the city for their money back.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    https://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-...m_npd_ms_tw_ma

    In the continued "galaxy smooth brain" solutions from Republicans we have Rafael Cruz and his obsession with doors.

    How many doors should a school have?

    According to Ted, just one.

    Why? Because it'll make it safer in the event there's a shooter, somehow.

    Will there be any risks to say...evacuating the school during a fire? Probably, yeah, but that's a level of thinking that requires you to think about the consequences of a proposal, and Rafael Cruz has made it abundantly clear he's unable to think further than 5-10 minutes into the future.
    Someone should tell Mr. Cancun Cruz that windows are a perfectly good way of entering/exiting a building. Most schools have them and are required to have them. This isn't The Sims or some random game where you can't make use of your environment.

  13. #493
    https://twitter.com/ndrew_lawrence/s...71595553939457

    Republican solution? "man traps" triggered by tripwires. Because I guess that's...safe in a school with kids?

    Fuckin smoothbrains out there.

    - - - Updated - - -

    https://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-...oter-rcna30511

    More on Republicans being awful people: They're out there harassing a trans woman by claiming she was actually the shooter. Claiming images were from 4chin.

    They weren't, they were from her social media accounts.

    Republicans are just filth. Period.

  14. #494
    Quote Originally Posted by gondrin View Post
    And yet it was the Border Patrol that actually did the job, not their SWAT team nor their actual police. I say that the citizens should sue the city for their money back.
    They would lose the supreme court has already ruled that police officers are not obligated to do their jobs.

  15. #495
    Quote Originally Posted by Draco-Onis View Post
    They would lose the supreme court has already ruled that police officers are not obligated to do their jobs.
    I didn't say the police. I said the city. Or at least get a bill that can be voted on where a person can claim a refund for city services not done when supposed to.

  16. #496
    https://twitter.com/VAKruta/status/1529977770931113987

    So, 7 officers at the school. They were waiting for backup to "help evacuate" the school and take on the shooter as he murdered more children.

    Why didn't they go in? According to the law enforcement spokesperson, they could have been shot...because they didn't know where the shooter was...and didn't want to go in to find him...

    Remind me again why we pay cops if they can just like...decide to not do their fuckin job when it's literally supremely important that they, trained and armed individuals, do their jobs?

    I'm super cereal here. What are we paying them for if they can just say, "Nah, I'll let a bunch of kids die."? Is it just to hang out at speed traps and hand out tickets? Harass people of color for diving while not being white?

    Whoever that spokesperson is, they need to pull his ass ASAP if they want to hope to turn around sentiment about their chickenshit, stupid ass, cowardly cops. He keeps making things worse.

  17. #497
    The Unstoppable Force Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    https://twitter.com/VAKruta/status/1529977770931113987

    So, 7 officers at the school. They were waiting for backup to "help evacuate" the school and take on the shooter as he murdered more children.

    Why didn't they go in? According to the law enforcement spokesperson, they could have been shot...because they didn't know where the shooter was...and didn't want to go in to find him...

    Remind me again why we pay cops if they can just like...decide to not do their fuckin job when it's literally supremely important that they, trained and armed individuals, do their jobs?

    I'm super cereal here. What are we paying them for if they can just say, "Nah, I'll let a bunch of kids die."? Is it just to hang out at speed traps and hand out tickets? Harass people of color for diving while not being white?

    Whoever that spokesperson is, they need to pull his ass ASAP if they want to hope to turn around sentiment about their chickenshit, stupid ass, cowardly cops. He keeps making things worse.
    And the unfortunate fact of the matter is that, even IF some resolution is reached about the roll of the police here and how they failed... It's all still distracting from the very real and necessary need for gun control measures.
    “Do not lose time on daily trivialities. Do not dwell on petty detail. For all of these things melt away and drift apart within the obscure traffic of time. Live well and live broadly. You are alive and living now. Now is the envy of all of the dead.” ~ Emily3, World of Tomorrow
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

  18. #498
    Quote Originally Posted by Kaleredar View Post
    It's all still distracting from the very real and necessary need for gun control measures.
    Nope, it's an issue about doors.

    And bulletproof blankets.

    And man-traps.

    And armed guards.

    And armed teachers.

    And armed kids.

    And bulletproof backpacks.

    And tripwires.

    And bigger fences.

    And metal detectors.

    And religion.

    And mental health (but not for the survivors who just get to live with lifelong trauma of seeing their classmates and teachers murdered around them).

    And videogames.

    And covid vaccines.

    And young men looking at women on social media.

    Not guns.

    Yes, those are all real, "serious" ideas offered up by the smoothest brains in the conservative intelligencia.

  19. #499
    The Unstoppable Force Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edge- View Post
    Nope, it's an issue about doors.

    And bulletproof blankets.

    And man-traps.

    And armed guards.

    And armed teachers.

    And armed kids.

    And bulletproof backpacks.

    And tripwires.

    And bigger fences.

    And metal detectors.

    And religion.

    And mental health (but not for the survivors who just get to live with lifelong trauma of seeing their classmates and teachers murdered around them).

    And videogames.

    And covid vaccines.

    And young men looking at women on social media.

    Not guns.

    Yes, those are all real, "serious" ideas offered up by the smoothest brains in the conservative intelligencia.
    Others have said it before, but it's truly the peak of "we've tried nothing, and we're all out of ideas!"
    “Do not lose time on daily trivialities. Do not dwell on petty detail. For all of these things melt away and drift apart within the obscure traffic of time. Live well and live broadly. You are alive and living now. Now is the envy of all of the dead.” ~ Emily3, World of Tomorrow
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

  20. #500
    Quote Originally Posted by Minifie View Post
    Imagine arguing the pedantry of people not being wholly educated about firearm nuance when 19 kids will never know those differences because they were shot dead in an institute that exists to educate and prepare them for life after childhood.

    Fuck the “freedoms” of people when this was the system working . At some point, you grow up and realise that even if you aren’t a piece of shit, the freedoms you want are allowing this, and you have to now accept that maybe you need to make the sacrifice of not having accessible guns. I know those selfish kids didn’t want to sacrifice themselves for you, but maybe you can stand up and say, “I appreciate what I have and will give up some to curb or stop this rampant destruction”.
    Some people grow up and realize they are a mountain of shit, and just make life as miserable to everyone else as possible.

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