Class Tuning and PvP Adjustments Coming in 9.2.5

[tomten]

That makes zero sense given the context. If tanks are losing agro to other tanks, buffing threat gen of all tanks changes nothing...

Do you read what you write before posting or do you just quickly type out whatever you think makes the other person look stupid (without realizing its backfiring for you)?

Do you bother to read the dev notes for buffs/nerfs? Of course you don't... I suggest you do that before opening your mouth next time

[GMZohar1]

I wonder how long they'll keep buffing/nerfing PvE and PvP separately before they realize that their one-size-fits-all-content approach to PvE vs. PvP is deeply flawed from the get-go.

They tried that in Legion. Gear didn't matter in PvP, it was terrible... One of the worst things they ever did to the game. It's why it only lasted in Legion lol

[Biomega]

They tried that in Legion. Gear didn't matter in PvP, it was terrible... One of the worst things they ever did to the game. It's why it only lasted in Legion lol

Sorry how do you get from "the constant buffing/nerfing of skills differently in PvP/PvE speaks to a deeper problem resulting from trying to unify both" to "lol what if gear didn't matter at all tho"? Who's talking about gear here, at all and in any way? Isn't this entire post about ABILITIES?

[Goatfish]

Agreed......

If there were no numbers in the game, people would find other ways to measure power. We'd have nerds analyzing how fast a run can go, time it takes to kill x mob in y time. Tier lists would still exist, and they would probably be pretty similar because the differences are pretty drastic.

Damn not a single comment about the WW change yet.

Guess that spec is dead and no one cares.

The WW changes are potentially good. It'll be a small bump in aoe (which we don't really need) and a massive bump in single target (which we definitely need). Honestly the spec probably needs a whole rework because it's significantly more work to do similar damage as every other spec. The scaling is fubar and the rotation is dumb and overly complicated. Destro hits one button and my mage hits 3 buttons to do the same or more damage as my monk who has an 11 button rotation and has to tab target to every mob in a pack to maximize my damage. If they want WW to get more play, spreading the spinning crane buff using blackout or sun kick instead of having to tab target to everything is a good start.

[kamuimac]

If there were no numbers in the game, people would find other ways to measure power. We'd have nerds analyzing how fast a run can go, time it takes to kill x mob in y time. Tier lists would still exist, and they would probably be pretty similar because the differences are pretty drastic.



The WW changes are potentially good. It'll be a small bump in aoe (which we don't really need) and a massive bump in single target (which we definitely need). Honestly the spec probably needs a whole rework because it's significantly more work to do similar damage as every other spec. The scaling is fubar and the rotation is dumb and overly complicated. Destro hits one button and my mage hits 3 buttons to do the same or more damage as my monk who has an 11 button rotation and has to tab target to every mob in a pack to maximize my damage. If they want WW to get more play, spreading the spinning crane buff using blackout or sun kick instead of having to tab target to everything is a good start.

if you think that ww needs revork then what have to say specs like retribution paladins which are borderline unplayable or shadow priests which dont exist anymore because all rerolled holy to be able to play game. and neither got buffs -_-

[Goatfish]

if you think that ww needs revork then what have to say specs like retribution paladins which are borderline unplayable or shadow priests which dont exist anymore because all rerolled holy to be able to play game. and neither got buffs -_-

I haven't personally played ret, but I can say that shadow priests are far easier to play than windwalker monks, bring more utility, and seem to be middle of the pack for both raid and M+ rankings. They seem to be near the top for straight up boss damage if we look at fights like Skolex. The single target buffs are completely justified when at the top performance monks are almost 30% lower than the top classes and 5% lower than even the 2nd to worst single target spec.

The reason I saw WW needs a rework has everything to do with how it functions and less about its damage though. For a normal single target rotation shadow priests use like 6 buttons, windwalker uses 14. For an aoe rotation, a shadow priest uses like 4 buttons and doesn't really have to tab target, a windwalker still has to use 14 buttons and also has to tab target to hit each mob individually to spread the spinning crane kick conduit. Windwalker has also long had bad stat scaling issues and seems to always need buffs near the end of the xpack because they don't scale with gear as well as other specs.

[Alohaitsjeff]

Again nothing for Ret paladin. Other than the additional one second they added to the 2 piece set, I haven’t seen a single buff this patch. Barely anything the entire expansion. I’m seriously switching mains next expansion. Sick of this shit.

[cocomen2]

Sorry how do you get from "the constant buffing/nerfing of skills differently in PvP/PvE speaks to a deeper problem resulting from trying to unify both" to "lol what if gear didn't matter at all tho"? Who's talking about gear here, at all and in any way? Isn't this entire post about ABILITIES?

Don't mind that kid, he thinks that if gear not matter and pvp decided by skill of player that plays its a BAD thing, and wants only one-shot low ilvl people.... to prove that he worth something.

[Alkizon]

tank specialization

*rolls eyes and groans softly* what a stubborn thing again... what is "tank specialization"? Tank is role and specialization is specialization *growls* Everything works much easier with stat/itemization (first part) + class mechanic control, not like "let's just put here without logic that it will work like this"

clarify: they are still talking about literal division of specializations, which means scaling characteristics (and not only - see full sentence from quote), which means “allotеting” by default bunch of all sorts of nonsense that player should initially control manually (both with long-playing choice and momentary, but should be controlled, and not stand out according to default = be imposed by developers' decision); what used to be given out in small portions, in pieces, gradually/stage by stage (where each one is a small choice element), now given out only in complete set and with rocket size/speed (Mac vs PC design strategy comes to mind, but I don't like example) - binding to role, which means with cut/limited capabilities, contrary to understanding of class as roomy, but solid umbrella (stuff, which, in theory, should be your choice, you receive in ultimatum order (former talents), and stuff that you should receive by default isn't given to you (former spells), but is provided not just "as choice", but also in such way, that only small part of what is supposed to be available to you (spec as form of cut/defective class) - theater of absurd)

Also about SOC Investment Group: Vive La Revolution

[Daan]

Damn not a single comment about the WW change yet.

Speechless that a spec being part of the world first M+ groups is getting a buff while Boomkin/Feral/Retri/Shadow are still untouched.

[ElDoorO]

They tried that in Legion. Gear didn't matter in PvP, it was terrible... One of the worst things they ever did to the game. It's why it only lasted in Legion lol

I'm beginning to thinkt hey simply need to remove PvP entirely and push it into another game with a WoW back-end.

Most, actually good, PvP'ers I know actually enjoyed a more balanced PvP combat. The ones that didn't were the usual ego driver "I worked hard so the others could be miserable" type attitudes.

But as we all know -- PvP and PvE is, overwhelmingly, less about skill and more about gear. It's why so many people take so long to down Mythic and, often, need both gear and nerfs to bosses to succeed.

[ketsui]

All classes now generate more threat when in a tank specialization.

Since when you could lose aggro as a a tank on retail? LOL
It is literally impossible from Cata.

front end of a bell curve when it comes to comprehension

[Powerogue]

As a monk, **** yeah!

As an outlaw rogue, lol at them being nerfed even harder in pvp, I haven't gotten a single pvp kill the entire expansion on that character.

[Mendzia]

front end of a bell curve when it comes to comprehension

Care to explain then instead insulting?

[spdr]

As an outlaw rogue, lol at them being nerfed even harder in pvp, I haven't gotten a single pvp kill the entire expansion on that character.

This is a you problem buddy.

[Powerogue]

This is a you problem buddy.

Well I did pretty good in Legion, then it's been hot garbage every expansion since. I'd blame it on not having the crit out of stealth legendary crafted but even then it takes several seconds of build up putting on things like SND and RTB before outlaw can start dealing dps and by then that effect would be gone.

I had just written outlaw off as an objectively horrible PvP spec since that point.

[Thes]

Well I did pretty good in Legion, then it's been hot garbage every expansion since. I'd blame it on not having the crit out of stealth legendary crafted but even then it takes several seconds of build up putting on things like SND and RTB before outlaw can start dealing dps and by then that effect would be gone.

I had just written outlaw off as an objectively horrible PvP spec since that point.

Outlaw is absolutely broken in PVP right now.

For the amount of damage and control, it needs to be squishier. But it's like a tank.

[Recovery]

even more than that.. they still dont nerf assa rogue just because its not as op in 3s but in 2s its like most broken dmg spec by far.. simply oneshots with every vendetta..

Simply not true. While assa is very good and does have 1 shot potential (does nothing outside of vendetta) id rather Q into assa where there is counter play than a DK, DH, or warr - where youre just eventually dead regardless of what you do.

Unholy DK by far and away has the scariest CDs in game.

- - - Updated - - -

Care to explain then instead insulting?

Ill explain.

If you have the ability to do any type of damage whatsoever in an M+ run, you'll see that aggro isnt so easily held by a tank. This is the reason night elf is meta. We have to meld on our cds because we rip right off tanks with no issue. I invite you to come tank a 20 with my warrior and ill show you how easily you DONT hold threat. lol - in case you didnt realize, its rarely single target threat anyone is referring to. Its Aoe threat - which is 98% of M+ pulls.

- - - Updated - - -

Well I did pretty good in Legion, then it's been hot garbage every expansion since. I'd blame it on not having the crit out of stealth legendary crafted but even then it takes several seconds of build up putting on things like SND and RTB before outlaw can start dealing dps and by then that effect would be gone.

I had just written outlaw off as an objectively horrible PvP spec since that point.

You probably should figure out what youre doing wrong.

Coming from a rogue main, Outlaw is the literal best PVP spec in the game in current iteration.

[survivalist]

4 % buff to BM . when it needs like 60 % buff to compete with MM and survival

they must be laughing so hard in the office while writing those

like how can we mock playerbase

youre crazy if you think bm isnt just as good in pvp as the other 2 lol. well unless you mean pve and idk then cause i dont pve at all.