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  1. #1

    Why do I need to support the Horde rebuilding Tirisfal as an Alliance player?

    I have no idea what is going on in the minds of Blizzards story writes, I really do not.
    It was just one expansion ago that we fought to destroy UC, now we help the forsaken to restore Lordaeron despite nothing has changed in the meantime?

    I will not even start with all the other problems the alliance story ONCE AGAIN has and that only seems to be getting worse every single patch, but the whole PREMISE of this questline is so dumb, I ONCE AGAIN can't believe somebody approved it to be released.

  2. #2
    Mechagnome Recovery's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    I have no idea what is going on in the minds of Blizzards story writes, I really do not.
    It was just one expansion ago that we fought to destroy UC, now we help the forsaken to restore Lordaeron despite nothing has changed in the meantime?

    I will not even start with all the other problems the alliance story ONCE AGAIN has and that only seems to be getting worse every single patch, but the whole PREMISE of this questline is so dumb, I ONCE AGAIN can't believe somebody approved it to be released.
    Calia has ties to both the alliance and the Horde. She is a Menethil. She is also "forsaken". This patch ties in cross faction partnerships. The cinematics literally mention the future of the forsaken being bright due to Calia's relationship with the alliance. Look around Lordaeron, there are little easter eggs. One such is a certain Proudmoore staged awkwardly in a corner with a story about how Jaina recommended him to serve Calia.

    It's honestly not that hard to understand. Alliances are made and broken and truces are formed daily in the real world. What makes the warcraft world any different? Albeit lame story writing, it makes sense.
    Last edited by Recovery; 2022-06-01 at 11:52 AM.

  3. #3
    No, it really does not make sense. Once again, I understand why it is good for the Forsaken and the Horde. I just do not get why I, as an Alliance player, would want to support her?
    She is literally a figure that played almost no role at all in the alliance story and even if it was, helping HER is different than helping the Forsaken. As before, they are still enemies of life and while I could understand a truce situation in where they are not actively being hunted down, actually SUPPORTING them reclaiming the Undercity, just so that the Horde as one of their Bastions restored for the next inevitable war, doesn't make any sense at all.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    I have no idea what is going on in the minds of Blizzards story writes, I really do not.
    Well, that is not an issue with the story.

    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    It was just one expansion ago that we fought to destroy UC, now we help the forsaken to restore Lordaeron despite nothing has changed in the meantime?
    Ah, you haven't played the last two expansions then, well in those two expansion a lot happened to ease the main war between the factions.

    Won't spoil it for you, but it turns out ok.

    To Americans: This November, vote like your life depends on it, because it does.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by schwarzkopf View Post

    Ah, you haven't played the last two expansions then, well in those two expansion a lot happened to ease the main war between the factions.

    Won't spoil it for you, but it turns out ok.
    We had BfA which told the story of the Horde being irredeemable evil and supporting Sylvanas until the very last moment, when SHE ditched THEM (except a very few who rebelled before that, but only after Baine was taken prisoner by her and only because of that, not because of the atrocities she ordered).
    Then we had SL where the Horde/Alliance story was not touched at all and instead focused on Sylvanas and how to humiliate the Alliance again and again.

    I understand there is no WAR currently (for whatever reason, that too makes no sense), but there is a huge leap between "let's not kill each other anymore on sight" and "let us help you rebuild your fortresses that you used in the last war against us."

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by schwarzkopf View Post
    Won't spoil it for you, but it turns out ok.
    Did it really? Seems to me like there are a still a lot of unresolved issues and many, many, many innocent casualties. There's a lot to be said about Blizzard's storytelling, but my biggest personal gripe is how quickly they go to "everything is fine again" mode after the big bad has been disposed of. They made such a big fuss about building up how horrible the BfA war was, how many innocent people died and how the Alliance and Horde alike were running out of soldiers - and now everything is okay because an armistice was signed?

    It's simply not believable to me. I don't mind peace, but anything more than the most tenuous and frail peace the two factions have ever experienced just doesn't seem plausible.

  7. #7
    but hey, besides helping your factions enemy rebuild you also get an awesome seed! yay?
    No matter how relevant the post, I will stop reading after 'should of'.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    I understand there is no WAR currently (for whatever reason, that too makes no sense), but there is a huge leap between "let's not kill each other anymore on sight" and "let us help you rebuild your fortresses that you used in the last war against us."
    The two key story parts you missed are Calia Menethil and an attempt to unit the foresaken, and retake their home, and that of Sylvanas and the Jailer and her repentance and on going redemption.

    SPOILERS:
    So the UC and Tedrasil are both going to be rebuilt, and the horde and alliance are now realising that there are bigger issues than their petty wars which in the past had been led by those under the influence of other powers.


    It all makes sense to me.

    To Americans: This November, vote like your life depends on it, because it does.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Enter Name Here View Post
    but hey, besides helping your factions enemy rebuild you also get an awesome seed! yay?
    What even is the seed for? Teldrassil was meant as a replacement for Nordrassil but they have the original world tree back now, so why is it such a big deal that they can grow another?

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    No, it really does not make sense. Once again, I understand why it is good for the Forsaken and the Horde. I just do not get why I, as an Alliance player, would want to support her?
    She is literally a figure that played almost no role at all in the alliance story and even if it was, helping HER is different than helping the Forsaken. As before, they are still enemies of life and while I could understand a truce situation in where they are not actively being hunted down, actually SUPPORTING them reclaiming the Undercity, just so that the Horde as one of their Bastions restored for the next inevitable war, doesn't make any sense at all.
    Then don't? Don't do the quests.

  11. #11
    Herald of the Titans Rendark's Avatar
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    You know you don't have to do the quest right? When who ever in the alliance asks you to help just walk away.

  12. #12
    The people who complain the most about the lore are the ones who know enough about it to have questions, but don't delve deeply enough into it to find out the whys and whatfors but instead just stop and complain that it doesn't make sense.
    The most difficult thing to do is accept that there is nothing wrong with things you don't like and accept that people can like things you don't.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by schwarzkopf View Post
    The two key story parts you missed are Calia Menethil and an attempt to unit the foresaken, and retake their home, and that of Sylvanas and the Jailer and her repentance and on going redemption.
    Again, I GET THAT.
    All of that is part of the Horde and reasons why as a Horde player you should support is.
    Simply does not work for an Alliance player on this specific task. Sorry, but no - helping the former enemy to rebuild their forces, literal weeks after the war ended, after all that they have done - no. Just no.

    Play the same story line 10 years laters after 10 years of non aggression and maybe I could buy it. But right now? No way.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    I have no idea what is going on in the minds of Blizzards story writes, I really do not.
    It was just one expansion ago that we fought to destroy UC, now we help the forsaken to restore Lordaeron despite nothing has changed in the meantime?

    I will not even start with all the other problems the alliance story ONCE AGAIN has and that only seems to be getting worse every single patch, but the whole PREMISE of this questline is so dumb, I ONCE AGAIN can't believe somebody approved it to be released.
    Wait for cutscene about orc planting that seed WQueen give NElves. Same logic as blue player help rebuilding Lordaeron

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Rendark View Post
    You know you don't have to do the quest right? When who ever in the alliance asks you to help just walk away.
    This is not really how either story discussions (which we do in this part of the forum) or feedback works in general.

  16. #16
    Same reason why we allowed Velen to restore the Sunwell and save the Blood elves.

    Same reason why we helped Vol'jin and his rebels.

    Same reason why we helped Saurfang and his rebels.

    Horde bias.

    This is obviously a Horde-centric story and it's always been. The Alliance only acts as punching bags to kick off the "Evil Horde" segment and then as sidekicks when the "Good Rebellion Horde" segment begins.

    The world revolves around the Horde and the Alliance is just another cog in the machine that spins around the Horde.

    Horde players have definitely been eating well in the last few expansions since Cataclysm.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    Simply does not work for an Alliance player on this specific task.
    It does, it makes sense given what I just said ... but I can't explain it any clearer sorry.

    To Americans: This November, vote like your life depends on it, because it does.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Varodoc View Post
    Same reason why we helped Vol'jin and his rebels.

    Same reason why we helped Saurfang and his rebels.
    Those were 2 different things.

    First of all, Vol'jin openly opposed Garrosh nearly from the very beginning and he did so, because he fundamentally believed, his actions were wrong in GENERAL, against the alliance AS WELL as against the "lesser races" of the Horde.

    Supporting Saurfang and his Rebels also made sense, because it gave the Alliance additional soldiers and means to topple the head of the opposing army.

    I'm not arguing against cooperation AT ALL, but this specific part of cooperation just way, way, way too much way too soon.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Accendor View Post
    Those were 2 different things.

    First of all, Vol'jin openly opposed Garrosh nearly from the very beginning and he did so, because he fundamentally believed, his actions were wrong in GENERAL, against the alliance AS WELL as against the "lesser races" of the Horde.

    Supporting Saurfang and his Rebels also made sense, because it gave the Alliance additional soldiers and means to topple the head of the opposing army.

    I'm not arguing against cooperation AT ALL, but this specific part of cooperation just way, way, way too much way too soon.
    We didn't need to help them.

    For instance, we could have let loyalists and rebels slaughter each other then come in at the end to finish off whoever was left standing.

    WotLK Varian wouldn't have been so kind and generous towards the rebels.

  20. #20
    You will help the Horde build up its military again so they can nuke your cities two expansions later because it is the right thing to do. Have you learned nothing from the game's narrative about coming together in spite of our differences?
    The absolute state of Warcraft lore in 2021:
    Kyrians: We need to keep chucking people into the Maw because it's our job.
    Also Kyrians: Why is the Maw growing stronger despite all our efforts?

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