Should Lordaeron City become neutral? [9.2.5 spoilers]

[Alanar]

Good bait, 3 pages already.
To the topic - right after new NE tree will be horde territory.

Ikr, very typical thread and a very pointless one tbh. It will stay forsaken.

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I'd rather have Gilneas back to be honest

Which you will.. signs are there. Gilneas is baddass imo.
Calia ordered to have the forsaken troops to be removed from those lands, so 1+1=2 imo.

[Nymrohd]

There is a lot of living people who can claim Lordaeron. It's not just the Forsaken. The Argent Crusade is largely people from Lordaeron as is what's left of the Scarlet Crusade. People from Lordaeron sought refuge in Stormwind, Theramore and Hillsbrad and for all the effort of the Horde, they did not kill ALL of them.

That said, I don't see why Lordaeron would be made neutral. What purpose would that serve? If they ever did some expansion where they only revamped EK north of the Thandol Span, it would still make more sense to have Dalaran land and make it the neutral city yet again than to make a neutral Lordaeron (and it would make more sense to have the two factions based on Gilneas and Silvermoon though with cross-faction maybe we are not getting separate capitals again).

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Calia ordered to have the forsaken troops to be removed from those lands, so 1+1=2 imo.

Calia promised to bring the issue to the Council. And she will. And Belmont and Faranell will laugh at her for a while, ask her if she is serious, then laugh some more.

[Futch]

This person plays void elf, next they're going to want to share Quel'Thalas and Silvermoon. it's the only reason they want Lordaeron City so bad. Alliance can take Gilneas, and Stromgarde. Alliance doesn't need Undercity.

[Lolites]

No, it's the founding capital of the Alliance and should return where it belongs.

i mean forsaken are literaly lordaeronians, they are the people who lived (and died and lived again) there, surely it belong to them by right, and they are now part of the horde...

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Because there are still living, breathing natives who still live within Lordaeron?

population size aside, surely lordaeronians who died there and "live" there after that too have much stronger claim than people who fled years ago...

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Should be aliance and those filthy undead should be put where they belong,in the ground!

Its rly funny if you think about it,in any realistic scenario the horde should have been decimated time and time again,but blizz had to pull out some weird deus ex everytime because of mUh GaMePlAy

last time alliance tried to take lordaeron only "deus ex machina" was Jaina on her flying ship, and without her alliance would be decimated...

[Vaedan]

The only "Forsaken" who are/were an Alliance race with any sort of relevance were Night Elves and lorewise, they are all still Horde.

I wouldn't say they are all Horde. Velonara said that all night elves who want to return are allowed to do so, which implies some will. Void elf dark rangers are not explained though, so we can only speculate on that matter. I don't really expect to see them at all in future, I guess they just got the option because blood elves did too, without any special lore reasons.

That being said, Lordaeron is clearly being rebuilded and retaken by the Horde with possible restoration of Gilneas for Alliance in future.

[Tanaria]

I wouldn't say they are all Horde. Velonara said that all night elves who want to return are allowed to do so, which implies some will. Void elf dark rangers are not explained though, so we can only speculate on that matter. I don't really expect to see them at all in future, I guess they just got the option because blood elves did too, without any special lore reasons.

That being said, Lordaeron is clearly being rebuilded and retaken by the Horde with possible restoration of Gilneas for Alliance in future.

But Delaryn also says that she doesn't even know if they will be accepted by the Alliance / Kaldorei and as far as we can see, the night elf dark rangers are Horde tagged.

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Well only because they didn't have access to them, the Forsaken are pragmatic and have a history (though as the Valkyr and sanlayn have shown, a bad one) of repurposing scourge stuff

They develop stuff anew. They didn't need Scourge buildings to develop their own plague - they could easily do it from within the underground of their former capital city.

[Unlimited Power]

So as we know, the Void elves will receive Dark Ranger customization options in 9.2.5 This means that, storywise, a portion of Dark Rangers that once served Sylvanas and the Forsaken, have defected to the Alliance. For many years, Horde players denied the Alliance any right to Lordaeron on the basis that all those who stayed to defend Lordaeron were now in the Horde (Forsaken).

However, now the Alliance has a new claim to Lordaeron, thanks to the aforementioned Dark Rangers who have joined the ranks of the Ren'dorei, and will be playable in 9.2.5.

We also know that High King Turalyon seeks to reclaim former holdings of the Alliance, after the success at Stromgarde, and Lordaeron City would count as a former holding (and former capital) of the Alliance.

Is it fair that Lordaeron remains in the hands of the Horde, when a portion of those who died defending it are now in the Alliance? I believe that Calia should simply share Lordaeron with the Alliance, after all it is only fair that those Dark Rangers would have the option to visit Lordaeron, even though they personally aligned more with the Alliance's ideals than the Horde's.

This is an idiotic premise. Should Horde have a partial claim to whatever grows from the seed given to Tyrande by the Winter Queen? After all, horde has played just as big of a role helping the Night Fae as alliance has, including helping Tyrande when her Night Warrior powers were running rampant.

The only one with any actual claim to Lordaeron are its former citizens, the Forsaken, as well as the rightful heir to the throne, Calia, who has taken her place in the Desolate Council as joint leader of the Forsaken.

I know it's hard for you, but you really need to think beyond your Alleria fanboyism/Void Elf roleplay sometimes.

[qwerty123456]

Lordaeron was abandoned by the alliance during the third war, actually. So nah, it wasnt.

And Undercity was abandoned and blighted by the Horde.

[Varodoc]

So it seems like most people here who disagree with me missed the latest news and skipped my OP, truly a pity.

"Only the Forsaken have rights to Lordaeron", a group of Forsaken Dark Rangers have now joined the Ren'dorei. Hence, Void elves now get Dark Ranger customization options. Thus, the Alliance gains the same rights to Lordaeron that the Horde had for years.

"Forsaken can only be Horde", false. Alonsus Faol, in Before the Storm, was stated to be a Forsaken, even though he swore allegiance not to the Horde, but to the neutral Conclave. Thus, the Ren'dorei Dark Rangers are still Forsaken. Forsaken are not defined by being part of the Horde. After all, they first tried to join the Alliance.

It seems to me that some people here simply can't move on with the times.

"Forsaken have always been Horde!!!" (ignoring Faol in Legion) the situation has now changed, with the Ren'dorei gaining some Forsaken in their ranks. Hence, why I can now make my Void elf look like a Dark Ranger.

This new patch recontextualizes everything we have ever known about Lordaeron, as some of its fallen defenders have now joined the Alliance's Ren'dorei.

Whether people here want to admit it or not, now the Horde no longer has exclusivity to Lordaeron.

[Tanaria]

So it seems like most people here who disagree with me missed the latest news and skipped my OP, truly a pity.

"Only the Forsaken have rights to Lordaeron", a group of Forsaken Dark Rangers have now joined the Ren'dorei. Hence, Void elves now get Dark Ranger customization options. Thus, the Alliance gains the same rights to Lordaeron that the Horde had for years.

"Forsaken can only be Horde", false. Alonsus Faol, in Before the Storm, was stated to be a Forsaken, even though he swore allegiance not to the Horde, but to the neutral Conclave. Thus, the Ren'dorei Dark Rangers are still Forsaken. Forsaken are not defined by being part of the Horde. After all, they first tried to join the Alliance.

It seems to me that some people here simply can't move on with the times.

"Forsaken have always been Horde!!!" (ignoring Faol in Legion) the situation has now changed, with the Ren'dorei gaining some Forsaken in their ranks. Hence, why I can now make my Void elf look like a Dark Ranger.

This new patch recontextualizes everything we have ever known about Lordaeron, as some of its fallen defenders have now joined the Alliance's Ren'dorei.

Whether people here want to admit it or not, now the Horde no longer has exclusivity to Lordaeron.

Except it does. Lordaeron's Forsaken controlled lands belong to the Forsaken - thereby, the Horde.

Your just to obsessed over Alleria, like all men who like the Windrunners - all cringey and creepy, that you secretly want an entire EK Alliance and to punish Forsaken and Sin'dorei fans just for being who they are and liking those races. You actively seek to punish players because you hate them and that is all you have ever done. Is posted hatred towards Forsaken and Sin'dorei fans, hoping they suffer and have their enjoyment depleted because that is your crusade.

[Alanar]

There is a lot of living people who can claim Lordaeron. It's not just the Forsaken. The Argent Crusade is largely people from Lordaeron as is what's left of the Scarlet Crusade. People from Lordaeron sought refuge in Stormwind, Theramore and Hillsbrad and for all the effort of the Horde, they did not kill ALL of them.

That said, I don't see why Lordaeron would be made neutral. What purpose would that serve? If they ever did some expansion where they only revamped EK north of the Thandol Span, it would still make more sense to have Dalaran land and make it the neutral city yet again than to make a neutral Lordaeron (and it would make more sense to have the two factions based on Gilneas and Silvermoon though with cross-faction maybe we are not getting separate capitals again).

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Calia promised to bring the issue to the Council. And she will. And Belmont and Faranell will laugh at her for a while, ask her if she is serious, then laugh some more.

It will happen regardless or else there would be no mention of it. The forsaken who are still there probably have no idea why they are still in gilneas in the first place lmao. Gilneas will be back in alliance hands in the future, which is actually a good thing as it serves no purpose right now.

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Except it does. Lordaeron's Forsaken controlled lands belong to the Forsaken - thereby, the Horde.

Your just to obsessed over Alleria, like all men who like the Windrunners - all cringey and creepy, that you secretly want an entire EK Alliance and to punish Forsaken and Sin'dorei fans just for being who they are and liking those races. You actively seek to punish players because you hate them and that is all you have ever done. Is posted hatred towards Forsaken and Sin'dorei fans, hoping they suffer and have their enjoyment depleted because that is your crusade.

He tries to bite back as a devensive mechanism he has created for himself because he knows pretty much everyone hates void elves( he never forget to mention that as some sort of reminder to everyone lol) as they were an asspull and dont fit anywhere. Void elves are given those option purely because of high elf dark rangers. Void elf dark rangers are literally an rp element over an rp element while still being called void elves.

Its just a sad story..

[Nymrohd]

It will happen regardless or else there would be no mention of it. The forsaken who are still there probably have no idea why they are in gilneas in the first place as it was just orderd by sylvanas lmao. Gilneas will be back in alliance hands in the future, which is actually a good thing as it serves no purpose right now.

Can I say how funny I find it that I was clicking on different Forsaken NPCs in new Brill to be greeted with "For the Banshee Queen!", "Dark Lady watch over you."?

[Lolites]

a group of Forsaken Dark Rangers have now joined the Ren'dorei. Hence, Void elves now get Dark Ranger customization options. Thus, the Alliance gains the same rights to Lordaeron that the Horde had for years.

eh... what? they are not lordaeronians, but elfs, so how the hell did they get right to land that was never theirs? they had rights as members of forsaken (which they imo gave up when leaving - its like changing citizenship, you dont retain rights of citizens of country you are no longer citizen of) but claim to the land? definitely not

and before you mention sylvanas, she didnt get to be leader of forsaken due to her claim to land - she had none - she simply took the control, took the land and ruled, and forsaken folowed her

[Varodoc]

eh... what? they are not lordaeronians, but elfs, so how the hell did they get right to land that was never theirs? they had rights as members of forsaken (which they imo gave up when leaving - its like changing citizenship, you dont retain rights of citizens of country you are no longer citizen of) but claim to the land? definitely not

and before you mention sylvanas, she didnt get to be leader of forsaken due to her claim to land - she had none - she simply took the control, took the land and ruled, and forsaken folowed her

Sylvanas stated that all Forsaken have a right to Lordaeron.

The Dark Rangers are Forsaken.

Thus, the Dark Rangers have a right to Lordaeron.

[Vaedan]

Ikr, very typical thread and a very pointless one tbh. It will stay forsaken.

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Which you will.. signs are there. Gilneas is baddass imo.
Calia ordered to have the forsaken troops to be removed from those lands, so 1+1=2 imo.

I also wonder if Calia will push to use plague eaters on other blighted lands, like Gilneas and Southshore.

Gilneas is certainly going to be retaken by the Alliance, it will be possibly a gesture of good will from Forsaken to leave the place and possibly clean it of Blight.

Southshore, however, can be different case. Alliance would like to resettle it I guess. It makes sense, since it is just between Gilneas and recently rebuilded Stromgarde... TBH, I'd really like to see both worgen and Forsaken increase their activities in northern EK, building new settlements and restoring their own old kingdoms.

Let humans stay south in Stormwind.

[Nymrohd]

I also wonder if Calia will push to use plague eaters on other blighted lands, like Gilneas and Southshore.

Gilneas is certainly going to be retaken by the Alliance, it will be possibly a gesture of good will from Forsaken to leave the place and possibly clean it of Blight.

Southshore, however, can be different case. Alliance would like to resettle it I guess. It makes sense, since it is just between Gilneas and recently rebuilded Stromgarde... TBH, I'd really like to see both worgen and Forsaken increase their activities in northern EK, building new settlements and restoring their own old kingdoms.

Let humans stay south in Stormwind.

I don't think the Horde can force humans to stay south of Stormwind. I do think it's fair to keep them behind the Gilnean and Thoradin walls though. Cleanly defined, defensible borders.
And realistically there is a nation of humans in the Eastern Kingdoms already; the Argent Crusade. It has extensive lands in Hearthglen and Tyr's Hand and is actually having some success in cleansing the land from Blight.

[Iain]

I'd like it to become a covenant hub. Like restricted to two covenants that get along well, and out of bounds to anyone else (who in their turn get their equally interesting hubs of course, like Gilneas, or a new world tree, or the Mechagon).

Cleanly defined, defensible borders.

That's the diplomatically rational solution. Gameplay wise and lorewise it's more fun to have a patchwork of hotly contested territories.

[RobertMugabe]

So it seems like most people here who disagree with me missed the latest news and skipped my OP, truly a pity.

"Only the Forsaken have rights to Lordaeron", a group of Forsaken Dark Rangers have now joined the Ren'dorei. Hence, Void elves now get Dark Ranger customization options. Thus, the Alliance gains the same rights to Lordaeron that the Horde had for years.

"Forsaken can only be Horde", false. Alonsus Faol, in Before the Storm, was stated to be a Forsaken, even though he swore allegiance not to the Horde, but to the neutral Conclave. Thus, the Ren'dorei Dark Rangers are still Forsaken. Forsaken are not defined by being part of the Horde. After all, they first tried to join the Alliance.

It seems to me that some people here simply can't move on with the times.

"Forsaken have always been Horde!!!" (ignoring Faol in Legion) the situation has now changed, with the Ren'dorei gaining some Forsaken in their ranks. Hence, why I can now make my Void elf look like a Dark Ranger.

This new patch recontextualizes everything we have ever known about Lordaeron, as some of its fallen defenders have now joined the Alliance's Ren'dorei.

Whether people here want to admit it or not, now the Horde no longer has exclusivity to Lordaeron.

You sound like you're about to go to court and sue Blizzard over that.

The fact is that Blizzard has decided that in their lore, their game, the Horde alone now owns Tirisfal Glades, once again.

[Vaedan]

I don't think the Horde can force humans to stay south of Stormwind. I do think it's fair to keep them behind the Gilnean and Thoradin walls though. Cleanly defined, defensible borders.
And realistically there is a nation of humans in the Eastern Kingdoms already; the Argent Crusade. It has extensive lands in Hearthglen and Tyr's Hand and is actually having some success in cleansing the land from Blight.

Sure, Horde can't force humans to stay there, unless they want another faction war, which seem unlikely. From Alliance PoV, I'd like to see more of gilnean expansion in northern EK for once, since we've been following regular humans for most of time and it's getting really old.

Argent Crusade is neutral organisation which does not have hostile relations with Forsaken. It also have members of other races, thalassians and undead as wrll, so it's not pure human kingdom too.

[RobertMugabe]

I'd like it to become a covenant hub. Like restricted to two covenants that get along well, and out of bounds to anyone else (who in their turn get their equally interesting hubs of course, like Gilneas, or a new world tree, or the Mechagon).

I was hoping for Blizzard to do that, but to Silvermoon instead.