Page 1 of 19
1
2
3
11
... LastLast
  1. #1

    Necromancy is Not Necessarily Death Magic.

    So, doing the new quests in 9.2.5 there is an interesting lore tidbit that separates "necromancy" and "death magic":



    So, the lore is that necromancy is not the equivalent of death magic, and can be performed by other magic types, such as the Light and also by other magic types. I wonder how that will affect things in the long run. What are you guys' take on this?

  2. #2
    Immortal jackofwind's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Victoria, BC
    Posts
    7,682
    Makes sense to me, by definition it's only magic focused on raising/communicating with the dead. There's no reason it has to be "death" magic, "black" magic, or even inherently evil in nature. The act itself might be taboo in some societies but the magic doesn't need to be "bad" to achieve it.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    Because fuck you, that's why.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by jackofwind View Post
    Makes sense to me, by definition it's only magic focused on raising/communicating with the dead. There's no reason it has to be "death" magic, "black" magic, or even inherently evil in nature. The act itself might be taboo in some societies but the magic doesn't need to be "bad" to achieve it.
    In DnD spells to bring the dead back to life like Revivify are part of the school of necromancy magics.

  4. #4
    This reads like one of WoW's writers was browsing the lore section of this website and saw one of the 12 or so 47-page discussion threads about necromancy versus death magic then decided to quell the debate once and for all.
    Last edited by Relapses; 2022-06-02 at 03:46 AM.

  5. #5

  6. #6

    Necromancy from different types of magic.

    So with the new questline of undeads retaken Lordaeron we hear a Maldraxi saying that necromancy can be done with different types of magics and that got me thinking, we have actually seen several examples of other magics doing necromancy.

    we have seen the void summoning undeads in many times.

    we have Alextranza and the red dragonflight that can perform a weird type of necromancy using life magic.

    we have Calia that is a light undead.

    We have Guldan resurrecting Magtheridon with fel.

    In the old lore, Kelthuzad performed necromancy using arcane magic and you could think of it even now as Kelthuzad practicing necromancy using arcane magic at first and then switching to death magic because it was easier.

    and obviusly we have the typical necromancy through death magic.


    Do you know any other examples of different types of magic other than death performing acts of necromancy?? or do you think that there are arguments to refute that claim?.

  7. #7
    The Unstoppable Force Teriz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Dragon Isles
    Posts
    23,594
    So when a Death Knight uses Raise Dead, Apocalypse, or Army of the Dead, they're not using Necromancy?

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    So when a Death Knight uses Raise Dead, Apocalypse, or Army of the Dead, they're not using Necromancy?

    They are using necromancy, with Death magic being the fuel for the “art” kind of “spell” as Blizzard is now trying to spin it.


    What we saw with Calia in the “Before the Storm” novel was also necromancy… but the conduit being the Holy Light.


    EDIT: it’s admirable that Blizzard wants to disassociate necromancy with traditional “dark magic” or “death” tropes… even if it still is about reanimating the dead into undeath.

    However, I feel something like necromancy is so deeply established in fantasy/fiction with the undead/skeletons/zombies that it kind of loses its “oomph” this way.
    Last edited by KOUNTERPARTS; 2022-06-02 at 02:13 AM.

  9. #9
    I really REALLY dislike them continuing to blend together the faculties of the different magical schools like this. If Fel, Arcane, Light, Void, Life and Death spells can all accomplish the exact same things, what point is there in differentiating between them?

    Like hell if I'm going to be okay with people referring to my priest as a "necromancer" just because they have the ability to revive the dead
    Last edited by Skirdus; 2022-06-02 at 02:13 AM.


  10. #10
    Nothing changed for me, pretty much i always though that "Necromancy" is act of magic like "Teleportation" or "Summoning" and not being specific magic school.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bali View Post
    The legion, the old gods, heck even the holy light can make undead now. At this point is there anything that makes the scourge/necromancy special?
    Quote Originally Posted by cocomen2 View Post
    They never meant to be "special", any cosmic power able to same thing like others but just chose not to, difference only source of their power.

    Lets say we got David and Mike, both of them can create "chair" but only one of them made it his speciality.
    Just swap Chair ->Necromancy, David and Mike -> Death and Light.

  11. #11
    The Unstoppable Force FelPlague's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Ontario,Canada
    Posts
    24,375
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    So when a Death Knight uses Raise Dead, Apocalypse, or Army of the Dead, they're not using Necromancy?
    how the fuck did you come to that conclusion?

  12. #12
    Over 9000! Kathranis's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Austin, Texas
    Posts
    9,250
    I mean, would you then consider Holy Fire a form of pyromancy?

    Like, if you're specifically describing necromancy as "animating the dead" through whatever means, I guess it's fair. It's just that necromancy literally means "death magic."

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Ielenia View Post
    So, doing the new quests in 9.2.5 there is an interesting lore tidbit that separates "necromancy" and "death magic":



    So, the lore is that necromancy is not the equivalent of death magic, and can be performed by other magic types, such as the Light and also by other magic types. I wonder how that will affect things in the long run. What are you guys' take on this?
    Makes sense to me. We've seen several different schools of magic do the same things, from raising the dead as undead to true resurrection. It's pretty straightforward and an interesting take. You can use whatever school of magic you practice to do a certain act and it's all the same thing.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    So when a Death Knight uses Raise Dead, Apocalypse, or Army of the Dead, they're not using Necromancy?
    No. It's necromancy. So is raising the dead with the void like the void elves did or how Calia was raised. What she's saying is necromancy is the act of bringing life to dead flesh. Doesn't matter what school of magic you use. Light, Death, Void, Nature. It's all Necromancy.

    Or to paraphrase the thread title. Death magic can be used for necromancy, but not all necromancy is death magic.
    The most difficult thing to do is accept that there is nothing wrong with things you don't like and accept that people can like things you don't.

  14. #14
    Herald of the Titans Rendark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    2,715
    This is just them trying and failing to make me like Calia.

  15. #15
    Basically they're separating the effects of magic from its source.

  16. #16
    Scarab Lord Oneirophobia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Northern Ontario, CAN
    Posts
    4,902
    This shouldn't come as a surprise to anybody. We have demons and the fel raising the dead since the warcraft RTS games and continuing to do so even in Legion at Black Rook, we have critters from the void and void elves reanimating the dead with void magic, we even have botani raising the dead with nature magic in Everbloom.

    It does sort of beg the question, "what exactly is death magic?" though...

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Skirdus View Post
    I really REALLY dislike them continuing to blend together the faculties of the different magical schools like this. If Fel, Arcane, Light, Void, Life and Death spells can all accomplish the exact same things, what point is there in differentiating between them?

    Like hell if I'm going to be okay with people referring to my priest as a "necromancer" just because they have the ability to revive the dead
    No one calls Clerics in D&D necromancers for having resurrection spells despite all those spells being labeled as necromancy. Heck, in some editions all healing spells were labeled as necromancy.

    The chart in Chronicle is more about the forces of the universe than schools of magic though. The splitting of magic into so many forms beyond the more traditional "Divine" and "Not-Divine" really only lightly started in early WoW due to classes all having unique spells, with chronicle somewhat backing this up, but as others in this thread have mentioned, we've seen Demons and Void creatures raising the dead perfectly for the entirety of wow's lifespan and into the RTS games.

    If anything locking things into different categories is actually more of a retcon.

  18. #18
    Well we had that one Void Elf raise a devilsaur through void magic
    Quote Originally Posted by Teriz View Post
    Since Arthas used Frostmourne, which is a Runeblade, and Frostmourne's power eminates from those runes, that made him a Runemaster by default.

  19. #19
    So blizzard is opening the doors to new Forsaken types in the future? Add in some dark rangers possibly going back to the Night Elves and you might just get them as a new class in the future, necromancy powered by Elune.

    Just realized that points to Night Elf warlocks.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by enigma77 View Post
    Garbage lore.
    This has been something many folks understood as an in-universe reality since at least The Burning Crusade — the fact that you don't really know much about the lore, doesn't make it "garbage".

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •