Oh Blizzard, how you have fallen (Diablo Immortal).

[Clone]

One of the things I found quite funny when trying it was when I cleared a dungeon for the first time my REWARD is a discount bundle in the shop. My reward for clearing a dungeon is the opportunity to spend money. Oh but at a discount, ya know cus they want you to be used to spending money early. Even if it's just a little. Get that taste.

From what I briefly saw of the game and the videos I have seen of others playing Blizzard has doubled down on every predatory, disgusting behaviour that P2W games have. The mental tricks of luring people in with rewards, dailies, small free tastes of what it'd be play to spend money, cheap 1-time only bundles to get you into spending just a little to get the ball rolling, every penny spent is some form of gambling mechanic to get those gambling addicts hooked etc. etc... Every mechanic in the game, every prompt, every action is designed with trying to get the player to spend money ahead of anything else.

Diablo Immortal is everything bad about current-gen games, games whos mechanics are more focused on mental warefare with the player to make as much money as possible and it saddens me than the company and game at the forefront of all these disgusting behavours is both the company and game series that I once loved.

I understand companies exist to make money, but that doesn't excuse disgusting behaviour and these predatory mechanics are exactly that. I just want game companies to be about making good games again. People should spend money on your game because your game is good and they want to support it, not because they was coaxed into spending it.

A f2p has microtransactions, oh the horror! What happened to the good old days where you download a full game for free and called it a day.

[Jester Joe]

Expecting F2P games not being P2W is kinda wrong...

but the discount coupon as a reward from a game for a real life currency shop is more than stupid.

From what others are saying, OP was misleading about that.

That you get other rewards, and they just tack on "Oh, and we have a bundle for new players that's at a discounted rate!".

Which is about on par with every F2P game.

[Delever]

There's consoles that go mobile now, you know that right? And even on the phone itself, there's still other options. Minecraft, Bloons, Stardew Valley, Terraria, Slay the Spire, and that's just yanking a few off of the top paid apps list.

My dude, you know very well the market that I was talking about and it does not involve mobile consoles. What you are doing right now is just selectively trying to find incredibly specific things to justify why you made the unrelated comment in the first place instead of just admiting that in your eagerness to get into a forum argument you disregarded/did not read the part where I mentioned I was specifically talking about the mobile market.

When someone says "mobile market" literally nobody means mobile and handhed consoles but they are talking about cell phones. I know its incredibly hard to admit that you are wrong on a forum epsecially when your name is one tone lighter green than everyone elses but please try to be reasonable instead of continuing this.

All of the games you mentioned are ports that are paid on the cellphone much like the final fantasy remake games and do not represent the mobile market that is riddled with ridiculous amounts of predatory micro transactions.

[crusadernero]

It's not so much defending, but just accepting the fact that it is a valid and successful business plan. If people wouldn't be willing to pay to progress, they wouldn't be doing it. I'm not willing to spend much money on p2w games and don't really understand why someone would either, but that doesn't mean it's evil and harmful to make games that have those elements.

So is gambling, and that are(in many cases) heavily regulated around the world. Im not saying there shouldnt be any of it, but there needs to be some kind of regulation with this. Its not a good practice at all and even though you or anyone else either dont play these games or put money in them, it does affect us gamers one way or another.

There are many cases were people have gotten addicted and overspendt, ruining theyre own life. There are young people(teens, kids) who on the regular get easily tempted to empty parents credit cards. You can find many examples of that regarding the FIFA games.

Its very easy to just "spend a dollar here and there" and think it wont matter. But it does and the way these game behave is that they suck alot of people into something they truly dont want in the end. It is a harmful practice and shouldnt be let alone to flourish.

Its obvious that DI is a decent f2p game, and thats rather a given. Thats how you get players sucked in. Present a decent game, let them have some fun with it, then the money starts being a factor. Before we know it we get extra in-game credit when logging into these games, like on gambling sites or the classic "whatever you put in, we will double it!".

[Elim Garak]

So let me get this straight... first F2P mobile game you played ever?

It's free. You play it for free. You don't want to buy anything - fine. But you dare complain they try to sell you something?

How about that - if you enjoy the game as much as, say D3, buy stuff worth $60 in the shop (as if you bought the game) and enjoy. Not necessarily in one go. You can pace your patronage.

Sounds fair?

[Lathspell]

My dude, you know very well the market that I was talking about and it does not involve mobile consoles. What you are doing right now is just selectively trying to find incredibly specific things to justify why you made the unrelated comment in the first place instead of just admiting that in your eagerness to get into a forum argument you disregarded/did not read the part where I mentioned I was specifically talking about the mobile market.

When someone says "mobile market" literally nobody means mobile and handhed consoles but they are talking about cell phones. I know its incredibly hard to admit that you are wrong on a forum epsecially when your name is one tone lighter green than everyone elses but please try to be reasonable instead of continuing this.

All of the games you mentioned are ports that are paid on the cellphone much like the final fantasy remake games and do not represent the mobile market that is riddled with ridiculous amounts of predatory micro transactions.

Existence of micro-transactions doesn't make them predatory. I mean even games like Candy Crush which is like the worst offender is completely playable free-to-play. If you have zero patience and a very strong competetive spirit then I suppose these games can be bad for you, because you have to beat everything asap and that costs a years wages pretty much.

[Jester Joe]

My dude, you know very well the market that I was talking about and it does not involve mobile consoles. What you are doing right now is just selectively trying to find incredibly specific things to justify why you made the unrelated comment in the first place instead of just admiting that in your eagerness to get into a forum argument you disregarded/did not read the part where I mentioned I was specifically talking about the mobile market.

Do you often think that people only disagree with you because they didn't read what you said? Coz that would be pretty arrogant of you, but based on the rest of your post, it seems pretty clear that's exactly what you are.

When someone says "mobile market" literally nobody means mobile and handhed consoles but they are talking about cell phones. I know its incredibly hard to admit that you are wrong on a forum epsecially when your name is one tone lighter green than everyone elses but please try to be reasonable instead of continuing this.

Except it's exactly what is meant. That's WHY people for years were constantly comparing Nintendo sales with phone games, because mobility competes with each other.

The fact that you have to stoop to a "holier than thou" argument and personal insults just proves that you literally have no actual point.

All of the games you mentioned are ports that are paid on the cellphone much like the final fantasy remake games and do not represent the mobile market that is riddled with ridiculous amounts of predatory micro transactions.

Except again, you said that there's NO alternative. There is. You can't move the goalpost now.

[Lathspell]

So is gambling, and that are(in many cases) heavily regulated around the world. Im not saying there shouldnt be any of it, but there needs to be some kind of regulation with this. Its not a good practice at all and even though you or anyone else either dont play these games or put money in them, it does affect us gamers one way or another.

There are many cases were people have gotten addicted and overspendt, ruining theyre own life. There are young people(teens, kids) who on the regular get easily tempted to empty parents credit cards. You can find many examples of that regarding the FIFA games.

Its very easy to just "spend a dollar here and there" and think it wont matter. But it does and the way these game behave is that they suck alot of people into something they truly dont want in the end. It is a harmful practice and shouldnt be let alone to flourish.

Its obvious that DI is a decent f2p game, and thats rather a given. Thats how you get players sucked in. Present a decent game, let them have some fun with it, then the money starts being a factor. Before we know it we get extra in-game credit when logging into these games, like on gambling sites or the classic "whatever you put in, we will double it!".

Kids emptying parent's cards is very easily stopped by requiring permission on every purchase. My kids come to me and ask if they can buy something in a game and if it's ok I put in the password. Gambling is also a bit different, because there is the illusion of making the money back somehow. Everyone knows that every penny you put into a p2w game is gone, so it's not the same in that regard imo.

[chiddie]

We will see what happens in endgame but as of now (I’m level 21) I’ve not felt forced to buy anything in the slightest.

I think you can clear the campaign without even knowing the shop exists.

[Jester Joe]

And you're everything wrong with gaming at the moment. Perfectly happy to keep shelling out money to unlock things an upfront cost gave you thr ability to unlock. Why not charge 20 for the game and remove all the HEAVY monetization?

Because people, such as yourself, are happily dropping money on crap like this.

So you'd rather buy a game and still have microtransactions in it? Because then to some others, they'd say you're the issue with gaming.

And it's not like this game would have came out with a $20 price tag.

[Lathspell]

And you're everything wrong with gaming at the moment. Perfectly happy to keep shelling out money to unlock things an upfront cost gave you thr ability to unlock. Why not charge 20 for the game and remove all the HEAVY monetization?

Because people, such as yourself, are happily dropping money on crap like this.

I would imagine the reason that charging 20€ for the game and losing mtx would seriously reduce the amount of players and therefore revenue. They got 10's of millions trying the game because it's free.

[crusadernero]

Kids emptying parent's cards is very easily stopped by requiring permission on every purchase. My kids come to me and ask if they can buy something in a game and if it's ok I put in the password. Gambling is also a bit different, because there is the illusion of making the money back somehow. Everyone knows that every penny you put into a p2w game is gone, so it's not the same in that regard imo.

Sure, its good those things are in place. Not everyone gets by so easily though.

Well - in DI you put in money in the hopes of getting something in return. You dont even know if you'll get it or not. So, gambling. People dont put in money for nothing, they are buying a product that hopefully gives them something. Its not more money in return, but items, mats +++

[rhorle]

Well - in DI you put in money in the hopes of getting something in return. You dont even know if you'll get it or not. So, gambling. People dont put in money for nothing, they are buying a product that hopefully gives them something. Its not more money in return, but items, mats +++

Doesn't that mean that the subscription to a game like WoW is gambling? You put in money in the hopes to get something back We all play games for some reason. Some want to pay to get their way, others want to grind and earn it. There is a reason why Game Genie, Game Shark, and other devices were bought back in the day. People want shortcuts and are willing to pay.

[GreatNameForSmurfingExTee]

And every time I see a fanboi post like yours, pretending that this is fine as the new model for gaming, I imagine how much fat cock you suck all day long.

Did I say it's fine? Please, learn to read before you use a forum. Thanks
Seems like you are mad that nobody wants to touch you. Poor boy, here, have some sugar to your salt.

(...) And people are unfortunately predictable animals with impulses that are easy to manipulate, that's nature. But when one becomes aware of an abusive practice becoming widespread, it's not very helpful to say "well, I know better, so it's okay", while many others fall for it.

Yes, people are stupid. Everybody knows how it works and still fall for it. Thanks for that imput.

Nextup: Here is why social media is bad, i found an article on social media.

[Zardas]

Really sad to see that people are ready to justify such shitty business practices and can't even envision the fact that f2p mobile game doesn't necessarily means full microtransactions.

Rally waiting for the release of PoE mobile so you'll realize how such a thing isn't a necessary evil, even for an action-rpg.

[crusadernero]

Doesn't that mean that the subscription to a game like WoW is gambling? You put in money in the hopes to get something back We all play games for some reason. Some want to pay to get their way, others want to grind and earn it. There is a reason why Game Genie, Game Shark, and other devices were bought back in the day. People want shortcuts and are willing to pay.

No, of course not. With the sub you get access to everything in the game. You dont need to buy special items to upgrade your legendary. You dont need to spend real money to progress. You dont have looooooooooooong grinds if you decide you dont want to pay for it. But - wow also have things that easily could be considered p2w, but thats another debate for another thread.

Obviously people want to pay for convenience, especially when games that actually are quite fun more or less forces(tempt you) to spend money for progression.

[Dhrizzle]

Is that what Immortal has ? xp potions ? You probably have no idea what the game is like with such obvious trolling.

No idea I haven't checked out the cash shop yet. The person I was replying to was upset about stuff you can buy in a game that gives you shortcuts as if it was something new. I think they said it was the only way they could cope or something.

- - - Updated - - -

You not being able to do end game content without paying. Or waiting a long time. Your option to max a character is either pay 100k or wait 80 years.

What's the difference in power from playing normal and waiting 80 years?

[Nerph-]

Oh, no need to mention that the other part is one of most infamous Chinese company ..

Why do I need to mention NetEase when said poster I was quoting was saying "this is not really Blizzard", when Blizzard is literally the co-developer and publisher? I was replying that this is "really Blizzard", whoever the other developer is doesn't matter.

[chorx]

I think the game itself is fine. $15 for a battlepass, $10/mo for the "premium" access (premium daily rewards). So long as you arent busting a load in the shop, I don't see why $60 for three months worth of game is such a bad proposition. I'm not going to be buying these chests, I'll just see how the game feels after giving it a fair shot and make give an educated opinion after I've had the chance to make one.

It's too early to say the game is "pay to win". Yes, if you don't pay money you're going to be throttled, If its the option between locking people out if they dont pay or letting them log in and mess around, I'd vote for the latter, but the game should not be viewed from the lens of "free". There's a very clear subscription model to participate with the content at a fun pace.

Edit: There's also no such thing as "Free". Nobody should value the time they give somebody or their thing at $0.

[Celestian]

One of the things I found quite funny when trying it was when I cleared a dungeon for the first time my REWARD is a discount bundle in the shop. My reward for clearing a dungeon is the opportunity to spend money. Oh but at a discount, ya know cus they want you to be used to spending money early. Even if it's just a little. Get that taste.

From what I briefly saw of the game and the videos I have seen of others playing Blizzard has doubled down on every predatory, disgusting behaviour that P2W games have. The mental tricks of luring people in with rewards, dailies, small free tastes of what it'd be play to spend money, cheap 1-time only bundles to get you into spending just a little to get the ball rolling, every penny spent is some form of gambling mechanic to get those gambling addicts hooked etc. etc... Every mechanic in the game, every prompt, every action is designed with trying to get the player to spend money ahead of anything else.

Diablo Immortal is everything bad about current-gen games, games whos mechanics are more focused on mental warefare with the player to make as much money as possible and it saddens me than the company and game at the forefront of all these disgusting behavours is both the company and game series that I once loved.

I understand companies exist to make money, but that doesn't excuse disgusting behaviour and these predatory mechanics are exactly that. I just want game companies to be about making good games again. People should spend money on your game because your game is good and they want to support it, not because they was coaxed into spending it.

I couldn't agree more.
All of this makes the real game quite meta. Since the real feat is not beating the odds within this game but to withstand the temptation to pay them real money outside of this game. It's a character-test. And Blizzard has tried hard to deliver an end-boss in this regard.