Oh Blizzard, how you have fallen (Diablo Immortal).

[Gaidax]

Amazon should earn money.
But Blizzard musn't.

Youtubers/streamers decided that long time ago(nobody even compared Immortal to Lost Ark so far).

Don't act like you have an opinion - you are nothing, but the voice these content creators.

In my opinion Lost Ark is almost just as shit as D:I and I played both.

Lost Ark absolutely does not shy away from selling power and employs quite a bit of D:I's repertoire to do so. D:I still elevates it to the next level, but Lost Ark absolutely is yet another case of this crap seeping into PC and what's worse becoming accepted there.

[RobertoCarlos]

In my opinion Lost Ark is almost just as shit as D:I and I played both.

Lost Ark absolutely does not shy away from selling power and employs quite a bit of D:I's repertoire to do so. D:I still elevates it to the next level, but Lost Ark absolutely is yet another case of this crap seeping into PC and what's worse becoming accepted there.

Thats my main gripe with this and marketing games to kids that have gambling and utilizing psychology tricks they've paid experts to research

Developers used to fear a backlash from gamers at the mere mention of "p2w"

Blizzard have been smart with this "mobile game". So Now that when D4 comes out they can milk the fuck out of that and everyone who was saying

"Its a mobile game thats what they are like!"

Will be saying

"They did it with Diablo immortal why are you still moaning about it now, thats like SO 2022...."

Sighhhh

[Darsyek]

It’s not about self control or lack of it. It’s about designing a game in such a way that everything literally forces you to spend money - while lying and calling the game free.

Take PoE for example. It’s “free” alright. However, the inventory that is available for free is simply not enough to play the game efficiently. The game is designed - purposely of course - in such a way that you’re either spending real money for extra inventory, or get stuck in a situation where you have to spend 90% of your playtime micromanaging the inventory (maps are a good example).

It the game free? No, because you essentially unable to enjoy it unless you spend real money. It’s a great game, but still a fraud.

As someone that has been playing Diablo Immortal for free and has not spent even a single penny on it, I'm going to have to disagree with you on basically your entire post. I have also played PoE for free and also enjoyed that game, also without ever spending a single penny. There is nothing in the game that "literally forces you to spend money." That would be called theft. It is entirely up to the player and their self-control whether they spend or not, Blizzard is quite literally incapable of forcing you or anyone else to spend money, at least not without massive lawsuits. Your enjoyment of the game isn't dictated by the cost. Many pay-to-play games are massively unfun, while many free-to-play, pay-for-cosmetic games are massively fun. If YOU are unable to enjoy the game without spending money, that is entirely a YOU problem. Again I want to make it clear, I agree that Diablo Immortal is heavy-handed on the monetization, but at no point does it "force" you to spend money on it.

[HansOlo]

Thats my main gripe with this and marketing games to kids that have gambling and utilizing psychology tricks they've paid experts to research

Developers used to fear a backlash from gamers at the mere mention of "p2w"

Blizzard have been smart with this "mobile game". So Now that when D4 comes out they can milk the fuck out of that and everyone who was saying

"Its a mobile game thats what they are like!"

Will be saying

"They did it with Diablo immortal why are you still moaning about it now, thats like SO 2022...."

Sighhhh

I can tell you what the secret trick is. Fun.

Fun costs money. You might not be old enough to remember the arcade halls - those were fun. And if you had all the money in the world, you would spend it all there.

[RobertoCarlos]

I can tell you what the secret trick is. Fun.

Fun costs money. You might not be old enough to remember the arcade halls - those were fun. And if you had all the money in the world, you would spend it all there.

Yeah thats not a fair comparison though. People have their own computers now AND pay for the product of the game.

Arcades you were paying to use the machine as much as playing the game.

Now we've gone backwards where we are no longer able to pay for the game for our PC or mobile and we pay for the service again.

So yay regression i guess?

[HansOlo]

Yeah thats not a fair comparison though. People have their own computers now AND pay for the product of the game.

Arcades you were paying to use the machine as much as playing the game.

Now we've gone backwards where we are no longer able to pay for the game for our PC or mobile and we pay for the service again.

So yay regression i guess?

No? You don't buy mobile games(atleast not the major ones). But you buy the fun part. That is the design philosophy. Very simple - been around for last 2000 years since the first gamble got introduced.

[RobertoCarlos]

No? You don't buy mobile games(atleast not the major ones). But you buy the fun part. That is the design philosophy. Very simple - been around for last 2000 years since the first gamble got introduced.

Can anyone come up with a better answer than "Thats what mobile games do!"

Why?

Why is it ok to be free to play and target whales to the point these games are making upwards 100k+ a month?

Why do PC and mobile have to be in their own lanes? Because they sure as shit are gonna be bringing more of these monetization practices into PC games after the success with mobile.

[HansOlo]

Can anyone come up with a better answer than "Thats what mobile games do!"

Why?

Why is it ok to be free to play and target whales to the point these games are making upwards 100k+ a month?

Why do PC and mobile have to be in their own lanes? Because they sure as shit are gonna be bringing more of these monetization practices into PC games after the success with mobile.

I can? Here look at this post:

Amazon should earn money.
But Blizzard musn't.

Youtubers/streamers decided that long time ago(nobody even compared Immortal to Lost Ark so far).

Don't act like you have an opinion - you are nothing, but the voice these content creators.

[RobertoCarlos]

I can? Here look at this post:

Thats not an answer.

And I'm really struggling to see what your point is by quoting that.

What does amazon have to do anything? Reeks of whataboutism.

[HansOlo]

Thats not an answer.

And I'm really struggling to see what your point is by quoting that.

What does amazon have to do anything? Reeks of whataboutism.

Try this one:

Genuine question:

1)Why do you pay for Netflix? -
OR - How would you run a buisness like Netflix(buy it once as you say?).

2)Payment of the devs, marketing, HR, management and every other involved team(do you believe companies consists of bunch of geeks in a basement)?

3)Payment of the the facilities - i.e the office and everything related to run a building?

4)Who will pay the IT infrastructure, so that the game can actually run(i.e constant maintenance of the servers and callcenters)?

You see - I think it's all 'Netflix' - game companies just have the chance to squeeze more out of it. And they should - they make good money from it(actually they make much than Netflix and all the services).

There are not here to give you freespins - they are here to run a buisness.

Answer these - maybe you find your own answers.

[rhorle]

"They did it with Diablo immortal why are you still moaning about it now, thats like SO 2022...."

Well you are still moaning about it and Blizzard did pay to win in 2014 with Hearthstone. So they have two mobile titles with pay to win. Diablo 3 is the non-mobile title that had pay to win in the form of the real money auction house.

[RobertoCarlos]

Try this one:

You're comparing netflix which is totally different.

They've taken on massive debt to be a front runner in a new industry. Their business model doesnt even look sustainable as evident by their constant sub member price hike.

Tell it to me like im a 5 year old how thats the same thing as an established industry giant with near unlimited resources and backing needs to out source to china to have them create a mobile game that uses state of the art predatory practises.

- - - Updated - - -

Well you are still moaning about it and Blizzard did pay to win in 2014 with Hearthstone. So they have two mobile titles with pay to win. Diablo 3 is the non-mobile title that had pay to win in the form of the real money auction house.

See what i mean? my point exactly. "They did it back in 2014!"

Grandfathered principle is fine I guess. Cant make this stuff up.

[rhorle]

See what i mean? my point exactly. "They did it back in 2014!" Grandfathered principle is fine I guess. Cant make this stuff up.

So complaining over the past 8 years didn't change anything why do you think do so will change things now? Your point is flawed. Blizzard already was terrible yet you, and others, still played and consumed Blizzards content. Or even worse you, and others, quit playing and consuming content but still devote energy towards surrounding yourself with Blizzard things even though you hate everything they stand for.

[RobertoCarlos]

So complaining over the past 8 years didn't change anything why do you think do so will change things now? Your point is flawed. Blizzard already was terrible yet you, and others, still played and consumed Blizzards content. Or even worse you, and others, quit playing and consuming content but still devote energy towards surrounding yourself with Blizzard things even though you hate everything they stand for.

Look I wont disagree with you that me detesting them on a forum is pointless.

Trust me lad I understand my opinion means fuck all when whales are throwing their credit cards at this stuff.

[HansOlo]

You're comparing netflix which is totally different.

They've taken on massive debt to be a front runner in a new industry. Their business model doesnt even look sustainable as evident by their constant sub member price hike.

Tell it to me like im a 5 year old how thats the same thing as an established industry giant with near unlimited resources and backing needs to out source to china to have them create a mobile game that uses state of the art predatory practises.

- - - Updated - - -



See what i mean? my point exactly. "They did it back in 2014!"

Grandfathered principle is fine I guess. Cant make this stuff up.

Not the same?

Okay... I'm not convinced. They are providing a platform, you login to a server, you gain access to the resource.

Both require same technology. And running this - requires substantial staffing, a datacenter, management team and call center(most likely a catina, cleaners, office bills etc.).

So tell me - why does Netflix cost or how should Blizzard earn money in this case?

[rhorle]

Look I wont disagree with you that me detesting them on a forum is pointless.

So move on then. Why surround yourself with things about a company you detest? It is amusing how some of those complaining the loudest about the predatory addictiveness of DI are themselves addicted to hating on Blizzard.

[RobertoCarlos]

Not the same?

Okay... I'm not convinced. They are providing a platform, you are log in to a server, you gain access to the resource.

Both require same technology.

So tell me - why does Netflix cost or how should Blizzard earn money in this case?

Ok ill try run with your analogy.

Firstly one is a sub cost that provides entertainment and some of that entertainment is exclusive to netflix such as stranger things, queens gambit etc.

The other is a mobile game that is free to play via download on a mobile or PC.

Right away diablo sounds like its ahead right because its free entertainment? I can't disagree with that logic.

The problem arises when I like said entertainment and I cant go any further other than throwing LUDICROUS amounts of money at it because its designed that way BECAUSE its free to play. Id rather pay a flat out price or a sub to gain access to unlimited content and not be gated by casino slots. Ya feel me

- - - Updated - - -

So move on then. Why surround yourself with things about a company you detest? It is amusing how some of those complaining the loudest about the predatory addictiveness of DI are themselves addicted to hating on Blizzard.

Because diablo is easily one of the my favouite IP's of all time and i want to still be semi optimistic for d4 I guess even though everything points to it being a shit show.

Shame on me for having hope still i guess

[HansOlo]

Ok ill try run with your analogy.

Firstly one is a sub cost that provides entertainment and some of that entertainment is exclusive to netflix such as stranger things, queens gambit etc.

The other is a mobile game that is free to play via download on a mobile or PC.

Right away diablo sounds like its ahead right because its free entertainment? I can't disagree with that logic.

The problem arises when I like said entertainment and I cant go any further other than throwing LUDICROUS amounts of money at it because its designed that way BECAUSE its free to play. Id rather pay a flat out price or a sub to gain access to unlimited content and not be gated by casino slots. Ya feel me

1 whale pays 100 people. If that's so - they should squeezed the crap out of people. Good for them - they know how to run buisness.

They did do thier market research and they decided that they can charge this much. Good for them.

[Drudi]

As someone that has been playing Diablo Immortal for free and has not spent even a single penny on it, I'm going to have to disagree with you on basically your entire post. I have also played PoE for free and also enjoyed that game, also without ever spending a single penny. There is nothing in the game that "literally forces you to spend money." That would be called theft. It is entirely up to the player and their self-control whether they spend or not, Blizzard is quite literally incapable of forcing you or anyone else to spend money, at least not without massive lawsuits. Your enjoyment of the game isn't dictated by the cost. Many pay-to-play games are massively unfun, while many free-to-play, pay-for-cosmetic games are massively fun. If YOU are unable to enjoy the game without spending money, that is entirely a YOU problem. Again I want to make it clear, I agree that Diablo Immortal is heavy-handed on the monetization, but at no point does it "force" you to spend money on it.

No reason to argue with you since you’re not informed, as your opinion on Poe shows. You can START the game for free. But once you get to the endgame - mapping - you are either buying inventory slots or slowing your progress by dedicating 90% of your time to inventory management.
And no, this is not playing, because you obviously can’t enjoy the game this way.

- - - Updated - - -

No? You don't buy mobile games(atleast not the major ones). But you buy the fun part. That is the design philosophy. Very simple - been around for last 2000 years since the first gamble got introduced.

No problem here with paying for the fun. But then stop calling the game free, as it’s not free anymore

[RobertoCarlos]

1 whale pays 100 people. If that's so - they should squeezed the crap out of people. Good for them - they know how to run buisness.

They did do thier market research and they decided that they can charge this much. Good for them.

"Good for them"

While the industry goes down the drain pipe?

No thanks.