1. #3241
    Quote Originally Posted by Witchblade77 View Post
    this game honestly has two things going for it. combat is fun, but it also happens to be essentially D3 combat slightly sped up or so it feels like at the moment. and its a new story in a diablo world, even though its relatively short and side stories are mostly repetitive. but once you finish the story, what is there left? and yes you can say there isn't much left in D3 either, but at least if I'm into the whole collecting loot thing - D3 actualy drops it. and if I want to try harder difficulties, I'm not forced to group for them I can even craft a lot of the gear, including sets - something DI doesn't have.

    pvp you say? well... if not for that whole p2w system, you have highly limited times when you can even participate in pvp at all and if you cannot play during those times, you are fucked, and then there IS a p2w system on top of that.

    the game is fun for a bit and then you realize just how shallow and tedious it gets and... /shrug. monetization in DI is awful. but... its not even close to an amazing game even if you take it out of equation
    This pretty much. All Diablo games suffer from the exact same problem and that is no meaningful endgame.
    You get better gear, turn the difficulty up, get better gear, turn the difficulty up, get better gear, turn the difficulty up and so on. The big problem is that difficulty 1 is the same shit as difficulty 10000, with only higher numbers, so there's little to no point to keep going. D2 at least had the resistances and stuff which made it a little different.
    D:I had a chance because it has PvP, but since the P2W elements are not disabled in PvP it's just pure shit. Like wtf is the point to pvp if the biggest factor to success is which team spent the most money?

  2. #3242
    The Unstoppable Force Elim Garak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veggie50 View Post
    This only works if you define “good” to mean “profittable”.
    Wrong. You have to go a level above profits - to see what's actually profitable. Bad games are not profitable, and if a bad game developer goes with the "box price" scam to sell a piece of shit by hyping the nonexistent game (these things happened in the past) they get scorched. Similar things happen with crowdfunding, *cough* star citizen *cough*

    So if a game is profitable, and it's not a box price scam - it's objectively good game. Even if you don't like it. That's just your subjective taste.
    All right, gentleperchildren, let's review. The year is 2024 - that's two-zero-two-four, as in the 21st Century's perfect vision - and I am sorry to say the world has become a pussy-whipped, Brady Bunch version of itself, run by a bunch of still-masked clots ridden infertile senile sissies who want the Last Ukrainian to die so they can get on with the War on China, with some middle-eastern genocide on the side

  3. #3243
    The Unstoppable Force PC2's Avatar
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    I finally got my character up to paragon level 100! I do think they are improving the progression system for each Diablo game and I think that some of the new features in Diablo Immortal will make it into Diablo 4.

    I just looked at my credit card statement and found that I've spent on average $15 a week. People act like this is bad because it's more costly than an average game, but personally I'm glad to be funding a MMORPG. That's what pays the developers and gives them incentive to make more content.
    Last edited by PC2; 2022-07-24 at 09:22 PM.

  4. #3244
    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    Wrong. You have to go a level above profits - to see what's actually profitable. Bad games are not profitable, and if a bad game developer goes with the "box price" scam to sell a piece of shit by hyping the nonexistent game (these things happened in the past) they get scorched. Similar things happen with crowdfunding, *cough* star citizen *cough*

    So if a game is profitable, and it's not a box price scam - it's objectively good game. Even if you don't like it. That's just your subjective taste.
    “Wrong, …[proceeds to equate good to profitable]

  5. #3245
    The Unstoppable Force Elim Garak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Veggie50 View Post
    “Wrong, …[proceeds to equate good to profitable]
    Wrong. Try reading again. Start with the book Logic 101.
    Not every good game is profitable but every profitable (non-scam) game is good.
    All right, gentleperchildren, let's review. The year is 2024 - that's two-zero-two-four, as in the 21st Century's perfect vision - and I am sorry to say the world has become a pussy-whipped, Brady Bunch version of itself, run by a bunch of still-masked clots ridden infertile senile sissies who want the Last Ukrainian to die so they can get on with the War on China, with some middle-eastern genocide on the side

  6. #3246
    Quote Originally Posted by PC2 View Post
    I finally got my character up to paragon level 100! I do think they are improving the progression system for each Diablo game and I think that some of the new features in Diablo Immortal will make it into Diablo 4.

    I just looked at my credit card statement and found that I've spent on average $15 a week. People act like this is bad because it's more costly than an average game, but personally I'm glad to be funding a MMORPG. That's what pays the developers and gives them incentive to make more content.
    When WoW was making its record profits that didnt translate into more content.

    It translates into bonuses for high brass at the company and shareholders invested

  7. #3247
    Quote Originally Posted by RobertoCarlos View Post
    When WoW was making its record profits that didnt translate into more content.

    It translates into bonuses for high brass at the company and shareholders invested
    Exactly. Companies don't exist to make "good products". They exist to make profits for their owners. And the more profit the better.
    And the goods and service they provide aren't the goal, they are the means to make profit.

    People should stop being little children and treat Blizzard as their best buddy who betrayed them.
    People should grow up and treat Blizzard just like their internet provider or grocery store.

  8. #3248
    Quote Originally Posted by kranur View Post
    This pretty much. All Diablo games suffer from the exact same problem and that is no meaningful endgame.
    You get better gear, turn the difficulty up, get better gear, turn the difficulty up, get better gear, turn the difficulty up and so on. The big problem is that difficulty 1 is the same shit as difficulty 10000, with only higher numbers, so there's little to no point to keep going. D2 at least had the resistances and stuff which made it a little different.
    D:I had a chance because it has PvP, but since the P2W elements are not disabled in PvP it's just pure shit. Like wtf is the point to pvp if the biggest factor to success is which team spent the most money?
    The meaningful endgame of DI is the Cycle of Strife. A small part of it is PvP.

  9. #3249
    Quote Originally Posted by Minifie View Post
    Damn calling D:I a scam game is legit, probably one of the better descriptors for it.
    Oh do tell, what exactly is the "scam" part?

    Is the game taking your money without permission?

    Are the purchases not as described?

  10. #3250
    Quote Originally Posted by Minifie View Post
    take it up with:

    D:I is not a good game, ergo it has to be a scam game by this logic. QED
    Ah, so no answer. Got it.

  11. #3251
    The Unstoppable Force Elim Garak's Avatar
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    DI is not a scam game and it's profitable therefore it's good.
    All right, gentleperchildren, let's review. The year is 2024 - that's two-zero-two-four, as in the 21st Century's perfect vision - and I am sorry to say the world has become a pussy-whipped, Brady Bunch version of itself, run by a bunch of still-masked clots ridden infertile senile sissies who want the Last Ukrainian to die so they can get on with the War on China, with some middle-eastern genocide on the side

  12. #3252
    The Unstoppable Force Elim Garak's Avatar
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    First of all, nothing in what I said suggests that a scam game is automatically bad. A good game can be used as a bait in a scam.
    Second. I was specifically talking about "box price" scam.
    Lastly. DI is free to play.

    So, in what way DI is a scam? And how does that mean it's a bad game?
    All right, gentleperchildren, let's review. The year is 2024 - that's two-zero-two-four, as in the 21st Century's perfect vision - and I am sorry to say the world has become a pussy-whipped, Brady Bunch version of itself, run by a bunch of still-masked clots ridden infertile senile sissies who want the Last Ukrainian to die so they can get on with the War on China, with some middle-eastern genocide on the side

  13. #3253
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    This thread isn't about President Biden, Donald Trump, or any other unrelated real-world politics. Return to the topic at hand: discussing Diablo: Immortal.
    "We're more of the love, blood, and rhetoric school. Well, we can do you blood and love without the rhetoric, and we can do you blood and rhetoric without the love, and we can do you all three concurrent or consecutive. But we can't give you love and rhetoric without the blood. Blood is compulsory. They're all blood, you see." ― Tom Stoppard, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead

  14. #3254
    The Unstoppable Force Elim Garak's Avatar
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    I advise you to go read again that bit where I say that a profitable scam game is automatically good. It should take you forever to find that bit, enough for your strawman to dissolve into fertilizer.
    All right, gentleperchildren, let's review. The year is 2024 - that's two-zero-two-four, as in the 21st Century's perfect vision - and I am sorry to say the world has become a pussy-whipped, Brady Bunch version of itself, run by a bunch of still-masked clots ridden infertile senile sissies who want the Last Ukrainian to die so they can get on with the War on China, with some middle-eastern genocide on the side

  15. #3255
    Speaking of "misappropriating words", TIL that completely free game is a scam.

    Seriously, a lot of you have simply had stupid arguments. I mean, dislike D:I, dislike MTX, that's fine. That's your view, and that's fine.

    But your arguments about it just get stupider and stupider. Some of you keep trying to find some way to make your views on it into this cosmic truth, and it gets worse and worse with every iteration.

  16. #3256
    Dunno if someone mentioned it or not - but apparently DI was released in China earlier today

  17. #3257
    Quote Originally Posted by Minifie View Post
    Literally right here buddy, if you are still struggling I, once again, would recommend fundamentals of grammar and english, because it is visible how sorely lacking your capabilities are.
    > Is asked to find specific quote

    > Quotes something entirely different.

    > "ur capabilities r lackin bruh"

  18. #3258
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    The meaningful endgame of DI is the Cycle of Strife. A small part of it is PvP.
    with vault raiding now being against immortal players rather then npc's - I'd say about half of it is pvp based. the problem is... you have generally limited activities available for it and half of them are only available during very limited time windows. battlegrounds, vault, shadow wars, assembly all have specific very limited windows of play. so if your schedule doesn't mesh with it, what do you do?

  19. #3259
    Quote Originally Posted by Witchblade77 View Post
    with vault raiding now being against immortal players rather then npc's - I'd say about half of it is pvp based. the problem is... you have generally limited activities available for it and half of them are only available during very limited time windows. battlegrounds, vault, shadow wars, assembly all have specific very limited windows of play. so if your schedule doesn't mesh with it, what do you do?
    Shadows rarely if ever pvp in Vault. The standard strategy is stay safe and clear floor 3 then leave. Only people who stay past that are noobs or whales. As an immortal we barely ever get to defend.
    BGs are available 8 or 10 hours per day (not sure, it's 2 hours 4-5 times per day). Vault is available 4 hours per day. Kion's, Shadow Wars and Rite of Exile are more limited but then again they are not for everyone (and Shadow War is set by the players, not the game).
    But these are only a part of the Cycle. Most of your time is spent doing Daily Goals or Contracts (and Path of Blood) and as always doing endgame tasks. Dungeon grinding remains a good choice for sets. Most people I know spend most of their time either dungeon grinding if they can get a good team (and especially a sprint barbarian), grinding in the open world for legendaries and xp alone or in small groups or just spamming BGs.

    If you are a casual player your best task after doing bounties is probably just that; grind in the open world. It's the basic gameplay loop of ARPGs after all; find mobs, kill mobs. I once reached a 2k mob killing streak with a friend and we only broke it because we were afraid a couple legendaries on the ground might despawn and we needed to go salvage.

    As for P2W on BGs. Frustrated at how easily I got killed in PvP as a DH last week I just switched my paragon to full Gladiator tree. The effect was insane. I went from being a free kill to a completely different playstyle where I could easily just pull back the moment my health dipped, heal and come back with cooldowns available to kill more people. I've had a streak of wins, most as MVP. So I think how you build matters. Now I fully expect that if I try to do a Challenge Rift that is 300+ CR above mine I will fail miserable without my PvE paragons but honestly I think that will be my playstyle; push challenge rifts half the week, switch and push BGs the rest. How you build your character matters more than the gear.
    Last edited by Nymrohd; 2022-07-26 at 08:26 AM.

  20. #3260
    so basically either boring mindless grind or hope you will be online at the right time to play something other then boring mindless grind and get lucky enough to not go up against people who spent more money then you did.

    and no in my experience gear matters as much if not more then build does. because your gear determines both how hard you hit AND how hard you GET hit.

    P.S. the fact that the normal strategy for vault now is for shadows not to complete it and for immortals to not even get to participate at all because shadows understandably don't even try to complete it... is not a good design. and the issue, once again stems from disparity created by monetization.

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