World of Warcrafts Biggest Problem...and its not Blizzard

[Coldkil]

It's both. Players have their share of guilt as Blizzard have. They decided to design the game in a way, and players validated it.

Right now most players got tired of this and stopped playing (doesn't mean "jumped onto other MMOs" , literally just stopped playing WoW) so things are changing.

The only thing that works is when people don't spend money and they lose revenue.

[Rad1um]

Your implications are clear and they match EXACTLY...

I cant carry this conversation for you anymore.


Peace and have a good life.

[rrayy]

It's both. Players have their share of guilt as Blizzard have. They decided to design the game in a way, and players validated it.

Right now most players got tired of this and stopped playing (doesn't mean "jumped onto other MMOs" , literally just stopped playing WoW) so things are changing.

The only thing that works is when people don't spend money and they lose revenue.

Or people simply had new family and time comittments, got older, or other things that caused them to stop playing.

People leave for many reasons, not just the opinion you project onto them.

[Myradin]

It was very much the community.

Literally the only thing that they did was add difficulties.

This. I remember people calling end game the 'real game' with leveling just being the tutorial, back in original TBC.

[Airickson]

The game cultivates the playerbase, not the other way around.

[Coldkil]

Or people simply had new family and time comittments, got older, or other things that caused them to stop playing.

People leave for many reasons, not just the opinion you project onto them.

What i said doesn't exclude your point. I am not talking about the people that naturally leaves the game and the playerbase changing, but the fact that Blizzard and playersbase have built up this "relationship" where bad design while being complained about is still validated by the fact enough people still play and Blizzard makes money out of the game. The good old "vote with your wallet".

Point is, the last investor call has been pretty harsh on the company situation. Double digit revenue loss and MAU loss. These reasons are way more powerful than people writing essays on forums or youtubers doing videos.

[rrayy]

What i said doesn't exclude your point. I am not talking about the people that naturally leaves the game and the playerbase changing, but the fact that Blizzard and playersbase have built up this "relationship" where bad design while being complained about is still validated by the fact enough people still play and Blizzard makes money out of the game. The good old "vote with your wallet".

Point is, the last investor call has been pretty harsh on the company situation. Double digit revenue loss and MAU loss. These reasons are way more powerful than people writing essays on forums or youtubers doing videos.

Well the scandal might factor into that pretty heavily, don't you think? And again, te do have those losses, but what % of that was because of game design? You don't know and that is my point. For all you know that it is a minority that leave over game design which means your argument starts to fall flat.

[KOUNTERPARTS]

I'm truly happy for the OP of this thread, who had this platform to get all of this off of their chest, with little to no consequence or retaliation. /s
Sad to see they have not responded to the conversation they started.

[Raidoser]

Well the scandal might factor into that pretty heavily, don't you think? And again, te do have those losses, but what % of that was because of game design? You don't know and that is my point. For all you know that it is a minority that leave over game design which means your argument starts to fall flat.

Every time i've seen a wow refugee talk in others MMO(ESO, FF14 and GW2) the main argument was how boring and bland wow became and how much fun they have now in their new main MMO and how much they regret not having switched game earlier.
Very rarely the blizzard scandal come as the reasons why they stopped playing wow, it may have pushed them in their decision but it doesn't look like the main culprit.

[Coldkil]

Well the scandal might factor into that pretty heavily, don't you think? And again, te do have those losses, but what % of that was because of game design? You don't know and that is my point. For all you know that it is a minority that leave over game design which means your argument starts to fall flat.

Same thing applies to your reasoning. How many actually left for the scandal? We don't know, it's just educated guesses.

I agree though that it's not a single oultlier, but a multitude of factors that brought us to this point.

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Every time i've seen a wow refugee talk in others MMO(ESO, FF14 and GW2) the main argument was how boring and bland wow became and how much fun they have now in their new main MMO and how much they regret not having switched game earlier.
Very rarely the blizzard scandal come as the reasons why they stopped playing wow, it may have pushed them in their decision but it doesn't look like the main culprit.

I think playing a single game for years ends with burnout, and it's pretty natural to find the old known thing boring and the new one better/more enjoyable.

Must be said other games took years to reach a level where they could at least compete with wow and people started to have actual options.

[Ashana Darkmoon]

I'm truly happy for the OP of this thread, who had this platform to get all of this off of their chest, with little to no consequence or retaliation. /s
Sad to see they have not responded to the conversation they started.

lol!

Bait ones never seem to get closed do they

[Erios]

Well i stepped away from this post after making it and anyone who doubted what i had to say just read this thread. The very first comment i received was toxic. Assuming its a fake new account when in fact i have never had an mmo champion account ive always read the forums but never engaged in posts due to the toxic people around (hence the literal first commenter) Im not saying blizzard isnt at fault i even said that in my post. Im saying the toxic player base is the reason people left in droves.

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Part of having an online forum is for people to vent and start a discussion. But from every single person who's responded thus far, none of you are prepared for a discussion only an argument.

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lol!

Bait ones never seem to get closed do they

I wish i were bating but i had other obligations (being a business owner sucks all your time away) just now got to come back to my post. So glad so many players came to prove my point.

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Ugh. This is the same type post #10,000 and the fact that you started a new account just to post it, tells me you weren't even confident when you decided to post.

i spent time writing this post with the only intent to express how i feel about the game currently. You took time out of your day to comment on it. i didnt make you do it.

No, this isn't your first account, sell that snake oil to another...

Ive read wow news here for years but never made an account believe me or dont i really dont care.

Blizzard got greedy. Thats it, thats the problem. You dont "BALANCE" a class by adding game tokens, forcing people who love their alts to re-grind practically everything you already did before and making it damn near impossible to change your mind about something (early on with changing covenants) because Blizzard implemented a punishment system for those who felt that covenant wasn't for them.

You have always had to farm rep on each individual character and you have always had to request on every single character. That should not change. Your characters are separate.

Broken PvP abilities? I didn't write that code, did anyone else here? No, im sorry, we didn't choose this.

No you just complained so much about the abilities being in the game in the first place or them being used in raids that they needed to be restricted to PVP.

Short sighted post.

The player base is a reflection of the product and as you can see, the product is crap, the player base is crap, but none of us chose the shitty decisions Blizzard implemented so they can sink our game time for more money.

The game was great then entitled people came in expecting everything to be handed to them on a silver platter. Ever consider that your characters are seperate...so of course you need to do things on them separately.

All this is but a fraction of the issues and that has zero to do with the player base and everything to do with the fact that Blizzard has always and will always do whatever the hell they want because they love money more than they love providing players with a good time.

Well considering they wouldnt do it if the player base didnt buy it. Stop buying crap and they will stop making it.

Dont yall have 100,000 dollar credit card limits for our new game?

Diablo Immortal is disgusting...but here's an idea...dont play it

[hulkgor]

My biggest issue with World of Warcraft is the playerbase itself!

Nah, not really. Started playing at betas, love the game, but my life and availability changed completely, and the big group of friends and guild i had the most fun with have slowly dripped away from the game, so that hinders my current enjoyment. Just isn't the same thing anymore.

It still has the best group pve content and gameplay of any game, and i'll do a raid tier here and there, but it just doesn't keep me subbed all the time now.

But yea, the playerbase sucks!

[KOUNTERPARTS]

This thread is irony incarnate.

[DarkAmbient]

Blizzard is 100% responsible for the state of the game. They plan it, they design it, they decide what goes in and what doesn't.

[OokOok]

WoW's biggest problem is loot isn't account bound.

If you didn't have to do the same grind over and over and over on every character it wouldn't be bad. Being limited to play 1 class and only 1 class is a terrible design, you either become a slave to a repeat grind system and be able to play multiple classes or you become a slave to one class

[Rad1um]

Diablo Immortal is disgusting...but here's an idea...dont play it

Dont like what I have to say? Here's an idea, dont reply ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[cparle87]

Every time i've seen a wow refugee talk in others MMO(ESO, FF14 and GW2) the main argument was how boring and bland wow became and how much fun they have now in their new main MMO and how much they regret not having switched game earlier.
Very rarely the blizzard scandal come as the reasons why they stopped playing wow, it may have pushed them in their decision but it doesn't look like the main culprit.

A game you've played for years and seen everything a dozen times is stale and a brand new game you don't know anything about and have never seen anything in it is exciting? Say it ain't so.

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WoW's biggest problem is loot isn't account bound.

If you didn't have to do the same grind over and over and over on every character it wouldn't be bad. Being limited to play 1 class and only 1 class is a terrible design, you either become a slave to a repeat grind system and be able to play multiple classes or you become a slave to one class

And the opposite end of the spectrum we have the guys who decry "the removal of all RPG aspects" who would be even more upset if things were changed to the way you seem to want it. Funny how a player base with millions of people can have people wanting the exact opposite things.

[Erios]

Dont like what I have to say? Here's an idea, dont reply ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

its my thread lol kind of my job to reply when i see fit.

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Bait thread is bait. 1/10 for effort.

really wish it was bait but i typed all that out.

[arkanon]

It's a little more complicated than that. For a lot of wows history, it was leagues ahead of the competition. People had invested a lot of time and money into wow, and unless another game offered something equally as good or better, they went straight back to wow. Honestly, it wasn't until ff14 had a couple of expansions under it's belt and one completely failed launch that they had a real competitor.

Because of this, blizzard just saw the hard numbers, and the numbers were good. Many players were not happy, but they kept paying their sub and kept trying to love the game the same as they used to. But eventually, other games pulled then away, 1 by 1, 5 at a time, guilds collapsed, and they started targeting the game more and more towards the players who remained. Many of those players prefered small group content and solo play, so those became more and more competitive from a loot perspective, u til eventually they became the most efficient way to gear up.

It was a very gradual process - and many long term players started to become dissolutioned - their guild was dead, half the players had left, they tried to match up with a 'sister guild', but it was not the same. The little community they once had with a really nice atmosphere and comfortable environment was gone. Now they were playing with a bunch of people 15 years younger than then who wanted to speed run everything and played 10 hours a day, like many of us once did. They didn't feel welcome in a game they had invested 20 years of their free time into. Home wasn't home anymore.

Now when they log in they are bombarded by popups about daily tasks, weekly tasks, multiple gameplay paths and gearing paths, communities, discords, boosts and carries, countless difficulties, and a world that has been split into a bunch of set pieces instead of a living world. So many systems on top of systems parallel to other systems but don't worry about THAT system because it's from LAST tier so ignore that system, but you do need to unlock that system to access the new tiers system, but throw away that currency because there are 3 new currencies for this tier.

Ultimately, the communities only "mistake" was supporting a product they were not happy with for years and years. I see it all the time - "this game sucks and has since mop - when my 6month sub runs out I'm done!" Mate, if the game has sucked since mop, why the fuck are you still playing it and laying blizzard for a game you hate? If you don't like the game, why the hell did you commit and pay for a SIX MONTH sub?

If people actually quit and stopped giving blizzard money when they stopped enjoying the game, things would look quite different.

The idea that it's the communities fault the game is designed the way it is, is complete bullshit. It's the devs responsibility to reject any requests from the community they know, from experience, as the experts, would not be good for the overall health if the game.

There are people on this forum who genuinely think the right thing for blizzard to do is have a repeatable WQ where you pick one flower and get a bis mythic raid item. They genuinely think this would be good for a casual player. It's blizzards responsibility to read such a request, and say "nope, that's a bad idea".