1. #1

    So, is the escalation pyramid simply capped at 3 weeks?

    Would explain how some people return literally like clockwork, no matter how often they get suspended.
    “There you stand, the good man doing nothing. And while evil triumphs, and your rigid pacifism crumbles to blood stained dust, the only victory afforded to you is that you stuck true to your guns.”

  2. #2
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mekh View Post
    Would explain how some people return literally like clockwork, no matter how often they get suspended.
    Infraction points decay over time. There's a point at something like 25 points where you can hit a plateau, where if your behaviour is consistent and you keep getting 5-point hits, your points decay roughly as fast as you re-offend; you get hit and bumped to 30 points, triggering a 3-week ban, when that's up you re-offend within the week, but your oldest points also decay and drop you 5 points, so your new infraction bumps you back up to 30, giving you a 3-week ban. And repeat every month or so.

    I'm probably getting the specific point values wrong but that's the gist anyway. The alternative with non-decaying points would be a system where a reformed user could spend three years as a lovely community member and then call someone a "jerkoff" in one thread one time and get permabanned, which is obviously extreme.


  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Infraction points decay over time. There's a point at something like 25 points where you can hit a plateau, where if your behaviour is consistent and you keep getting 5-point hits, your points decay roughly as fast as you re-offend; you get hit and bumped to 30 points, triggering a 3-week ban, when that's up you re-offend within the week, but your oldest points also decay and drop you 5 points, so your new infraction bumps you back up to 30, giving you a 3-week ban. And repeat every month or so.

    I'm probably getting the specific point values wrong but that's the gist anyway. The alternative with non-decaying points would be a system where a reformed user could spend three years as a lovely community member and then call someone a "jerkoff" in one thread one time and get permabanned, which is obviously extreme.
    So, there isn't really a way to handle repeat offenders, at least not for the repetition. Well, that certainly is a system.
    “There you stand, the good man doing nothing. And while evil triumphs, and your rigid pacifism crumbles to blood stained dust, the only victory afforded to you is that you stuck true to your guns.”

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    Infraction points decay over time. There's a point at something like 25 points where you can hit a plateau, where if your behaviour is consistent and you keep getting 5-point hits, your points decay roughly as fast as you re-offend; you get hit and bumped to 30 points, triggering a 3-week ban, when that's up you re-offend within the week, but your oldest points also decay and drop you 5 points, so your new infraction bumps you back up to 30, giving you a 3-week ban. And repeat every month or so.

    I'm probably getting the specific point values wrong but that's the gist anyway. The alternative with non-decaying points would be a system where a reformed user could spend three years as a lovely community member and then call someone a "jerkoff" in one thread one time and get permabanned, which is obviously extreme.
    That happens here no matter what. You can go months without an infraction, and then say one thing somebody doesn't like, and BAM! You're banned. I've had it happen to me more than once, so don't try to tell me it doesn't happen. Some of us users are simply wearing targets on our backs every time we post here, whereas other posters (that we do report and ignore per the rules, and per the mod instructions) carry on being turd monkeys in every post, in every thread, and nothing is ever done.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mekh View Post
    So, there isn't really a way to handle repeat offenders, at least not for the repetition. Well, that certainly is a system.
    Really depends on if they like them or not. Look up Chicken Drummer and you'll see what I mean.
    How joyous to be in such a place! Where phishing is not only allowed, it is encouraged!

  5. #5
    I Don't Work Here Endus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ringthane View Post
    That happens here no matter what. You can go months without an infraction, and then say one thing somebody doesn't like, and BAM! You're banned. I've had it happen to me more than once, so don't try to tell me it doesn't happen. Some of us users are simply wearing targets on our backs every time we post here, whereas other posters (that we do report and ignore per the rules, and per the mod instructions) carry on being turd monkeys in every post, in every thread, and nothing is ever done.
    You can literally check your own points total. Click on "Settings" in the top corner, then scroll down past your subscribed threads, and you have a list of your infractions. The title bar contains an entry for how many points you have total.

    If you have 15 points or more after points are issued, you get a temporary ban. The duration is set by the points total. Most infractions are worth 5, really bad behaviour can get more up to and including an instant permaban, though that's for things like actionable death threats or posting child porn or the like, generally.

    Nobody has any "targets". People are treated pretty darn fairly.


  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    You can literally check your own points total. Click on "Settings" in the top corner, then scroll down past your subscribed threads, and you have a list of your infractions. The title bar contains an entry for how many points you have total.

    If you have 15 points or more after points are issued, you get a temporary ban. The duration is set by the points total. Most infractions are worth 5, really bad behaviour can get more up to and including an instant permaban, though that's for things like actionable death threats or posting child porn or the like, generally.

    Nobody has any "targets". People are treated pretty darn fairly.
    For all the talk about maintaining an atmosphere that's conductive to reasonable discussion, with no additional penalty for repeat offenders, there seems no real intent to curb the behaviour of those who are most detrimental to said atmosphere.
    “There you stand, the good man doing nothing. And while evil triumphs, and your rigid pacifism crumbles to blood stained dust, the only victory afforded to you is that you stuck true to your guns.”

  7. #7
    If you get banned for the same infractions(i.e. you get banned twice before one can expire) there needs to be escalation in the moderation. If all an account does is go from ban to ban are they really adding anything worthwhile to the site? How much extra stress are they causing for the volunteers that avoid doing their jobs?

  8. #8
    I don't get what you assume would be the right course of action.

    If you permaban someone then it is much more likely he is instantly returning with a new account.
    If you suspend him for some reasonable time and he cares about his account and accountname then it's likely he is going to wait. If you suspend him for too long then he will just create a new account, same as permaban.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Puri View Post
    I don't get what you assume would be the right course of action.

    If you permaban someone then it is much more likely he is instantly returning with a new account.
    If you suspend him for some reasonable time and he cares about his account and accountname then it's likely he is going to wait. If you suspend him for too long then he will just create a new account, same as permaban.
    Then clap the new accounts as well. You don’t just let people troll non-stop because it drives away users.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas82 View Post
    Then clap the new accounts as well. You don’t just let people troll non-stop because it drives away users.
    It takes 10 seconds to create some temp email and create a new account here, it takes some infractions and manual supervision to ban someone. It's a lost race.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Puri View Post
    It takes 10 seconds to create some temp email and create a new account here.
    You know what takes even less time? Banning those accounts. Betting you 20 bucks, somebody prepared to kill a new account will do so faster than somebody trying to make one and post.
    “There you stand, the good man doing nothing. And while evil triumphs, and your rigid pacifism crumbles to blood stained dust, the only victory afforded to you is that you stuck true to your guns.”

  12. #12
    Free Food!?!?! Tziva's Avatar
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    No, it is not. Ban duration can go longer, and if you reach a high enough threshhold of active infraction points, it triggers a permanent ban. And, yes, we do action and close evade and alt accounts when we find them.

    The point of the infraction system working the way it does is to give people a chance to improve if they are able to behave themselves long enough that old infractions expire. However, if they don't improve, they will end up spending the grand majority of their time banned before being permanently banned.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ringthane View Post
    That happens here no matter what. You can go months without an infraction, and then say one thing somebody doesn't like, and BAM! You're banned. I've had it happen to me more than once, so don't try to tell me it doesn't happen
    This is not possible unless you are receiving high value (10 point or greater) infractions or multiple infractions within those few months. Bans don't trigger unless you have 15 total active points, which is three "normal" infractions. 5 point infractions wear off after 90 days, so you would need to receive all three of those infractions within that time period for a ban to be triggered at all.

    Other than with spambots, mods cannot just apply bans. They issue specific infractions that have a point value attached and ban duration is automated based on the total of active points. If one receives a ban, it's because they are already sitting on at least ten active infraction points.
    Last edited by Tziva; 2022-06-20 at 07:51 PM. Reason: added quote response for clarify
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