What is there for casuals?

[Echo of Soul]

Nothing. I was hoping that the profession revamp was going to bring something but it turns out you still have to raid in order to craft anything decent. Looks like I'll have to play FFXIV for yet another expansion in order to get good gear as a casual. It's a shame really since I'd much rather be playing WoW but we keep being treated like second class citizens over there for the 4th or 5th expansion in a row, I wish that Ion's anti casual design philosophy would've never made it into the game.

[Celement]

Nothing. I was hoping that the profession revamp was going to bring something but it turns out you still have to raid in order to craft anything decent. Looks like I'll have to play FFXIV for yet another expansion in order to get good gear as a casual. It's a shame really since I'd much rather be playing WoW but we keep being treated like second class citizens over there for the 4th or 5th expansion in a row, I wish that Ion's anti casual design philosophy would've never made it into the game.

Did you ever consider people don't want you playing wow?

Having people constantly wanting to fuck up the difficulty curve because they can't handle the concept of better players having a normal gear curve hasn't been a positive to the game as a whole.

[overjoyed-goose]

The answer to "What is there for casuals" is the same for what is there for everyone else: raids, m+ and pvp mostly.

Being a casual doesn't mean you can't do content. If you don't want to do any of the content on the game, then I have no idea why you're torturing yourself as wow is a shit game for everything else.

[dragonflight10]

Nothing. I was hoping that the profession revamp was going to bring something but it turns out you still have to raid in order to craft anything decent. Looks like I'll have to play FFXIV for yet another expansion in order to get good gear as a casual. It's a shame really since I'd much rather be playing WoW but we keep being treated like second class citizens over there for the 4th or 5th expansion in a row, I wish that Ion's anti casual design philosophy would've never made it into the game.

Since when blizzard gave casuals really good gear ? i hear all this people complaining but it's stupid tbh

in most games you do hard content you get good rewards ( gear/xmog/achievements etc) Why do people here expect blizzard to cater to them ? please give me an answer

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The answer to "What is there for casuals" is the same for what is there for everyone else: raids, m+ and pvp mostly.

Being a casual doesn't mean you can't do content. If you don't want to do any of the content on the game, then I have no idea why you're torturing yourself as wow is a shit game for everything else.

Exactly, its baffling
There was a post around Sanctum of dominion raid about a guy ranting that there is nothing for casuals and this guy didn't want to do raids/bgs/dungeons like he didn't want to queue for heroics also he didn't want to do the new zone because it's boring/hard to him xD
issue is he kept replying and demanding that blizz cater to him
this Vocal minority is hurting the game for quiet a while now.

[WowIsDead64]

The answer to "What is there for casuals" is the same for what is there for everyone else: raids, m+ and pvp mostly.

Being a casual doesn't mean you can't do content. If you don't want to do any of the content on the game, then I have no idea why you're torturing yourself as wow is a shit game for everything else.

I personally don't like minority-majority arguments, because they can't be proven, so they're empty. But. Cata was exact time, when this question was risen. Because WotLK was very casual-friendly and Cata started to return "back" (it was myth though) to hardcore Vanilla/TBC. And when casual players asked Blizzard to nerf game and Blizzard actually did it, hardcore players started to ask Blizzard, who was majority of playerbase and who was vocal minority. There was some infographic. It was only official infographic from Blizzard themselves. Since then they avoid publishing such sensitive info. It's hard to find now. But. If I remember correctly, 60% of playerbase was kissing squirrels. Of course it's no longer true. Because game has 10-20% of it's former playerbase now. Part of reason - exactly because Blizzard alienated all their casual players due to making game casual-unfriendly since MOP.

[overjoyed-goose]

I personally don't like minority-majority arguments, because they can't be proven, so they're empty. But. Cata was exact time, when this question was risen. Because WotLK was very casual-friendly and Cata started to return "back" (it was myth though) to hardcore Vanilla/TBC. And when casual players asked Blizzard to nerf game and Blizzard actually did it, hardcore players started to ask Blizzard, who was majority of playerbase and who was vocal minority. There was some infographic. It was only official infographic from Blizzard themselves. Since then they avoid publishing such sensitive info. It's hard to find now. But. If I remember correctly, 60% of playerbase was kissing squirrels. Of course it's no longer true. Because game has 10-20% of it's former playerbase now. Part of reason - exactly because Blizzard alienated all their casual players due to making game casual-unfriendly since MOP.

Weirdly when I asked on another thread I was told that MoP had the best casual progression path, and no one mentioned wrath. I quit at the start of wrath, so could you tell us how it was more casual friendly?

[WowIsDead64]

Weirdly when I asked on another thread I was told that MoP had the best casual progression path, and no one mentioned wrath. I quit at the start of wrath, so could you tell us how it was more casual friendly?

That's "generation" problem. There are more players, who started to play in MOP and didn't see WotLK, than players, who started to play in WotLK. Simple thing. New players always perceive game as is. After another 10 years of Wow's history (if Blizzard won't bury it), there will be players, who will say, that BFA and SL were the best xpacks ever made.

Again. WotLK didn't have any mandatory content. And content was tuned for "babies" according to that time's memes. MOP was first xpack in Wow's history with mandatory FOMO crap, that was taking about 1 hour of casuals' lives per character. It was also first xpack in Wow's history, that implemented so called "sandbox" design, that actually revolves around making outdoor content more group-oriented and solo-unfriendly, i.e. around taking it away from casual players and using is as supplemental for hardcores (to make sitting in M+/raid queues less boring).

[Echo of Soul]

Did you ever consider people don't want you playing wow?

Having people constantly wanting to fuck up the difficulty curve because they can't handle the concept of better players having a normal gear curve hasn't been a positive to the game as a whole.

Worked fine in Wrath

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Since when blizzard gave casuals really good gear ? i hear all this people complaining but it's stupid tbh

in most games you do hard content you get good rewards ( gear/xmog/achievements etc) Why do people here expect blizzard to cater to them ? please give me an answer

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Exactly, its baffling
There was a post around Sanctum of dominion raid about a guy ranting that there is nothing for casuals and this guy didn't want to do raids/bgs/dungeons like he didn't want to queue for heroics also he didn't want to do the new zone because it's boring/hard to him xD
issue is he kept replying and demanding that blizz cater to him
this Vocal minority is hurting the game for quiet a while now.

Wrath, cata, even fucking MOP you could get the second best gear in the game over a long period of time.

[Celement]

Worked fine in Wrath

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Wrath, cata, even fucking MOP you could get the second best gear in the game over a long period of time.

What worked fine in wrath..?

Do you mean having only a easy raid tier to start?

[Echo of Soul]

What worked fine in wrath..?

Do you mean having only a easy raid tier to start?

Getting the second best gear in the game from doing easy content over a long periods of time. Didn't break shit

[Venziir]

DF seems to have more "casual content" (what ever the shit that is) than TBC, WOTLK, Cataclysm, WoD and partly even MoP....

[Celement]

Getting the second best gear in the game from doing easy content over a long periods of time. Didn't break shit

You mean the garbage that orginally brought gearscore into the game...?

[ohwell]

Casuals or more appropriate casual-bads which are the majority are constantly creating their own demise.

"The game is too hard/time consuming xyz" so Blizzard gives them 10yrs worth of catchup, welfare, auto complete and zombie mode zergfests in both dungeons and raids, than they just turn around and start screaming about content droughts lol.

The game literally invalidates everything each patch just to make sure that casual-bads don't get left behind, god forbid they have to actually do content to progress, no the alternative to them is much better, spend 1 day clearing LFR then complain that there is no content until next tier which they can just teleport straight too with catchup.




U joke but there are casuals that are actually good

A casual who is good at the game can spend 3 hours and do more content than a bad casual does in 20 hours

It's just the perception is so warped because 98% of them are the bad variant, like Resident Evil

Yes, but most of the people who claim to be casuals on here are the people who spend 80 hours a week in game but then can't complete a +2. The actual name for that type of player isn't casual, it's a bad player who is trying to warp the game to their desires.

You're absolutely right in that good players can be casual. Hell a lot of heroic/mythic raiders log less hours a week than the people who claim to be casual.

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Worked fine in Wrath

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Wrath, cata, even fucking MOP you could get the second best gear in the game over a long period of time.

Except in those cases said gear was not just handed out like people claimed until at least around Ulduar or later. There is this persistent nonsense that people were getting REALLY good gear and at a higher rate than the great vault offered when in reality if you were really not raiding, you were taking a long time to get said gear and a lot of it was poorly itemized.

[klaps_05]

The profession revamp looks like some nice casual player content OP. And without a bunch of convoluted systems and borrowed power systems, it looks like it will be easier to make and level alts to do more stuff with more professions I'm hoping.

Main problem with it is that instead of making an unlimited system when it comes to power, it will be severely limited unless you do mythic/highest keys. and they threw in extra timegating on learning recipes, so leveling it multiple times on alts will be annoying.

One other aspect ppl arent considering is there are MANY ppl who just like to have a simple profession like alchemy and just craft some flasks, pots, etc. This wont really be possible anymore as the profession will actually need micromanaging because of the new structure. Additionally, with each pot/herb having 3 ranks, costs will be significantly higher.

[Echo of Soul]

You mean the garbage that orginally brought gearscore into the game...?

Yes, along with 10 times the amount of players the game has today. That garbage.

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Except in those cases said gear was not just handed out like people claimed until at least around Ulduar or later. There is this persistent nonsense that people were getting REALLY good gear and at a higher rate than the great vault offered when in reality if you were really not raiding, you were taking a long time to get said gear and a lot of it was poorly itemized.

If you don't do premade high end content like raiding, m+ or RBGs the great vault doesn't give you jack shit. The Wrath model awarded the second best gear in the game at a very slow but steady pace from doing queued or solo casual content.

The great vault is meant for the hardcore players, just like the new crafting changes. The casuals get fuck all once again which is why most of us probably will keep playing FFXIV where we're not treated like second class citizens and get access to the second best gear in the game slowly.

[Niwes]

I find that the less the game demands of my time, the more time I actually spend in the game.

i have to say, without any exaggeration and with lot’s of honesty: this is the best, and for my personal gaming experience the most true, statement i ever heard about wow. very well said! and VERY true for me.

[bullseyed]

Eh, just because someone has a 3k score doesn't mean anything. I have a few friends who have high ratings simply because they were carried and couldn't tell you what mechanics are in the dungeons.

An argument from anecdote is an informal logical fallacy, where anecdotal evidence is presented as an argument; without any other contributory evidence or reasoning. This type of argument is considered as an informal logical fallacy as it is unpersuasive – since the anecdote could be made up, misconstrued or be a statistical outlier which is insignificant when further evidence is considered. This fallacy can often be found in conjunction with the hasty generalisation fallacy – where the hasty generalisation is made from unsubstantiated anecdotes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argument_from_anecdote