Page 1 of 5
1
2
3
... LastLast
  1. #1

    What do you want from the talents??

    To be clear this is not about balance. Balance can change day to day. I want to know what you want in terms of playstyle.

    For me Monk is my baby and I like other hybrids so for monk I want the class tree to have the semi used abilities from each spec available at the top like RSK, keg smash, and renewing mist. Ideally I also want to see how they handle movement because triple chi torpedo and flying serpent kick into tigers last was fun for 9.0 testing. There might be a possibility of stagger existing in the general tree as well which boosts our survivability. My main hope is for aoe/st to be different builds and a return of controlled Clones with chi explosion.

    Paladin will likely have word of glory, templars verdict, and shield of the righteous at the top. Also possible that crusader strike is a talent and holy can build without it. The aoe build for ret could have the projectile divine storm while single target holds final verdict.

    Shaman with 2h enhancement is a possibility along with a cannon elemental spec. Make enhancement have a choice between powering up raptors or going full on hard hitting strikes. Make elemental able to choose between fire for ST and lightning for aoe.

    Those are my three big classes and I want to know what others want

    If I see "2h enhancement is too weak" or "X will outperform Y" I'm just going to assume you can't read

  2. #2
    Bring back some classic skills from older expansions/sets and even new favourites like Fleshcraft (choose 1 of the cov skills).

    Prevent a cookie cutter build, but this i wishful thinking.

    Make it a feature that will last for at east 3 more expansions.

    I would prefer there were no specializations and your specialization were handled like in Classic/TBC through your talent tree.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Alithia View Post
    Bring back some classic skills from older expansions/sets and even new favourites like Fleshcraft (choose 1 of the cov skills).

    Prevent a cookie cutter build, but this i wishful thinking.

    Make it a feature that will last for at east 3 more expansions.

    I would prefer there were no specializations and your specialization were handled like in Classic/TBC through your talent tree.
    I don't see any reason they would remove the talent trees after DF

    Cookie cutter builds will always exist but 9/10 players would end up performing the same with a slightly different build

    I'm ready for alpha this week and 5 classes available for the first week because they aren't done with the rest

  4. #4
    Immortal TEHPALLYTANK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Texas(I wish it were CO)
    Posts
    7,466
    For them to not turn into the abomination that are the talent trees for Dragonflight, but I'm not holding out any hope for that.

    I'd like to see Symbiosis at least brought back for Druids, stick it at the bottom of the class tree to make it seem more special for people who never got to experience it. A functional version of Divine Intervention might be interesting (functional as in "it doesn't kill you to cast it"). Sticking some sort of powerful and interesting talent at the bottom of the class tree, and having it be the only choice there, to give people some illusion of getting something amazing (or actually give people something amazing).

    Anything to mitigate the terrible joke that is ripping up the spellbook, slapping it into a talent tree, and calling it "new".
    Quote Originally Posted by Bigbamboozal View Post
    Intelligence is like four wheel drive, it's not going to make you unstoppable, it just sort of tends to get you stuck in more remote places.
    Quote Originally Posted by MerinPally View Post
    If you want to be disgusted, next time you kiss someone remember you've got your mouth on the end of a tube which has shit at the other end, held back by a couple of valves.

  5. #5
    Your spellbook alone should allow you to be a fully functioning class performing your role as expected.

    Talents should allow you to enhance a specific aspect of your spec, e.g. if you want more cleave, or more st, or more survivability, etc.

    Playing "build-a-spellbook" is a sure-way to get a disaster. Before people didnt use their utility because maybe they didnt know how, but had the opportunity to learn. Now they have an excuse to never learn how to use that utility as they can pick talents that give them more throughput.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by klaps_05 View Post
    Now they have an excuse to never learn how to use that utility as they can pick talents that give them more throughput.
    Like, no, they can't.

    There's like 10 spells per class talent tree that possibly provide throughput - you won't even make it past certain thresholds if you only go for throughput. It's literally impossible to end up without at least some for of utility. Like, you can't get to the 2nd section in the Druid tree if you only go for throughput - and even if you were to just randomly click shit and then go for throughput in the 2nd section again... you'd again be 8 points short after taking all the throughput before being able to go into section 3.

    Yes, you can skip shit like Typhoon, Cyclone or Hibernate - but the way the tree is built and threshold restrictions work, you'd have to make actual consciencious choices to go out of your way to not get these spells. Like, you'd have to decide that you're a Moonkin and you, for some reason, also want to be a Cat - but the players who'd do that are beyond saving anyways, so who cares.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Gasparde View Post
    Like, no, they can't.

    There's like 10 spells per class talent tree that possibly provide throughput - you won't even make it past certain thresholds if you only go for throughput. It's literally impossible to end up without at least some for of utility. Like, you can't get to the 2nd section in the Druid tree if you only go for throughput - and even if you were to just randomly click shit and then go for throughput in the 2nd section again... you'd again be 8 points short after taking all the throughput before being able to go into section 3.

    Yes, you can skip shit like Typhoon, Cyclone or Hibernate - but the way the tree is built and threshold restrictions work, you'd have to make actual consciencious choices to go out of your way to not get these spells. Like, you'd have to decide that you're a Moonkin and you, for some reason, also want to be a Cat - but the players who'd do that are beyond saving anyways, so who cares.
    I've run into a common theme in the people against this style of talent tree where certain abilities are now optional and they play up the small amount of people who won't take useful utility spells as some big portion of the player base that will ruin the game or the choices are actually punishments by removing certain skills from baseline.

    Apparently choice is bad if it's actual choices that effect gameplay and not just x% increases

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Forum Man View Post
    Apparently choice is bad if it's actual choices that effect gameplay and not just x% increases
    I think the real fear is the opposite of that.

    That they're NOT actual choices, because certain utilities are too valuable to pass up.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Biomega View Post
    I think the real fear is the opposite of that.

    That they're NOT actual choices, because certain utilities are too valuable to pass up.
    Depends on the need
    Innervate? You won't pass up in raid or m+ but you can in casual play
    Interrupts? If the boss has no interruptable spells then it's unnecessary (most trash that needs Interrupts can be stunned or others will do it)
    Amz for dk? Not if the damage is physical

    People are looking at the system as just something to use to remake current playstyles and that's sad because for some specs it opens up so much more...unless everything ends up cluttered like priest because Blizzard doesn't know when to stop. Heck you can now mix talents that used to be on the same row

    The option to not grab something double chains of ice to get an execute is fun to me

  10. #10
    I honestly don’t care about the details. I care about the philosophy. I want a system that persists and isn’t redesigned every patch of the expansion before getting thrown out. I do not want this perpetual drain on design efforts. And that’s what I’m getting, regardless of how good the system is.

  11. #11
    I want talents to give enough room to make different "flavors" of any spec.

    Discipline, since its newly released, actually does a good job of this that I really like. It has ALOT of talents (something the DK and druid trees do not) and allows you to specialize your priest how YOU want to play it. Do you want to really focus on shields and heals? You can. Do you want to specialize in dealing damage? You can. Do you want to mix and match between them? You can!

    I want more "big talents" down low in the tree to prevent you from taking all of them, but make them strong and valuable. I want to feel like I can specialize in parts of my bear, but can't get everything that matters and force me to choose.

    For example, 4 elements of Bear are Direct Damage, Damage over Time, Damage Reduction, Healing. Let me specialize into any 2 of these heavily, 3 if I don't pick certain good talents, or have to balance all 4 but am not able to really get major picks for any give one.

    Let specs pick how they want to play, make different archetypes fun inside specs, and make it so that there is a REASON to play different talent setups within the same spec.

    I want a good reason to play a rot-dot-self healing bear that is both different and valuable compared to a mangle spamming direct damage DR bear.

    Give talents that support multiple playstyles that allow you to customize instead of just "the same shit we have now, but NOW you can pick WRONG"

  12. #12
    For me most important is that we no longer have to think about picking right covenant, soulbind, conduit, talent and it will be just talents, ready on max level. Hopefully talents will be easy to switch - in rested area, but saved variables on the fly (with easy import). And will be nice to have some flexibilty with droping utility you don't need in current situation for bigger dps (or vice versa).

    But forget about balance. It would be pointless task to satisfy wow community.. and then ALL people who care would pick best combination anyway. It's different than Azerite or covenants where choice was connected to your luck or not so easy to revert. Now they can focus on balancing specs instead making job 10x harder for themselves.

  13. #13
    Talents are heading in the right direction. Based on what I saw from DK and Priest. The more possibilities the better.

    Demon Hunter (because it only has 2 specs) will have to be nerfed 10x in the beta. Imagine a Havoc Tank...
    Last edited by Fantazma; 2022-07-04 at 09:07 PM.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Fantazma View Post
    Talents are heading in the right direction. Based on what I saw from DK and Priest. The more possibilities the better.

    Demon Hunter (because it only has 2 specs) will have to be nerfed 10x in the beta. Imagine a Havoc Tank...
    I'm thinking DH general tree will be
    One side movement and a few general dps abilities
    The other side has defensive and utility like CC and darkness

    Havoc tree will see the return of legion artifact ability
    Probably a choice between a demon form focus and a quick hitting focus

  15. #15
    Spam Assassin! MoanaLisa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Tralfamadore
    Posts
    32,188
    Flexibility mostly.
    Two rules for living: "Don't go around hurting each other. Try to understand things." — William Least Heat-Moon (Blue Highways)

  16. #16
    I want to go back to the feeling a getting something when you level, to get stronger as you level, not weaker like we do right now. Especially on a alt, getting level cap mean feeling that blue/purple bar a the bottom 10 times. You don't get anything really fun for doing so, sometime a +20% from that one low dps skill, that it. And it's not rose tainted glass nostalgia, we can see the difference between Classic and Retail.

    Yes, in Classic, either classic, TBC, or WotLK, you start with a broken (not in the good sense) class that only start to have all his tools around level 40 to 50, maybe even higher if a skill solved a gapping issue was added in TBC or LK. You feel like every level is a walk toward getting better, getting stronger, to fight the stronger enemy in the next zone. In retail, you class get his basic tools set around level 20-30, so now you have 30 level of either gravy or just nothing to go. At least it's not 90 more level to go like previous level cap. And you don't feel stronger either. The world quest you did at level 51 is now harder at level 58-59 for some reason... That just awful.

    I know talent won't solve all the issue, scaling was a good idea, but it did remove that feeling of getting into harder and harder zone. And we will be back at square one in 2-3 expansion when they won't be able to keep the pace of giving us 10 talents point each expansion.
    MMO-Champion, once the place to get WoW News, now the home of the haters and their clickbait and doomsaying threads

  17. #17
    Soulswap and Soulburn:Soulswap from MoP back for affliction. Also maybe a way to burn extra Soul shards for instant Seed of Corruption. Would be nice in arena.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Zequill View Post
    I want to go back to the feeling a getting something when you level, to get stronger as you level, not weaker like we do right now. Especially on a alt, getting level cap mean feeling that blue/purple bar a the bottom 10 times. You don't get anything really fun for doing so, sometime a +20% from that one low dps skill, that it. And it's not rose tainted glass nostalgia, we can see the difference between Classic and Retail.

    Yes, in Classic, either classic, TBC, or WotLK, you start with a broken (not in the good sense) class that only start to have all his tools around level 40 to 50, maybe even higher if a skill solved a gapping issue was added in TBC or LK. You feel like every level is a walk toward getting better, getting stronger, to fight the stronger enemy in the next zone. In retail, you class get his basic tools set around level 20-30, so now you have 30 level of either gravy or just nothing to go. At least it's not 90 more level to go like previous level cap. And you don't feel stronger either. The world quest you did at level 51 is now harder at level 58-59 for some reason... That just awful.

    I know talent won't solve all the issue, scaling was a good idea, but it did remove that feeling of getting into harder and harder zone. And we will be back at square one in 2-3 expansion when they won't be able to keep the pace of giving us 10 talents point each expansion.
    Last time we got permanent power gain was WoD

  19. #19
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2015
    Location
    Land of moose and goose.
    Posts
    20,421
    I want things like we see in the priest tree coop thematics like the old god idols or turning holy spells to shadow.

    But on a more specific note, a holy pally talent that gives you a mini avenging crusader that’s always up and scales
    With mastery, blessings for all specs, a way to lose holy Power for ret, seals.

    For hunters, some sort of managed ammo, duel wielding survival, A old survival esc dot build for Mm, snake trap.

    For shamans, gust of wind, 2h enh, more totems and a way to drop them all at once not just move them, spectral rams.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    I want things like we see in the priest tree coop thematics like the old god idols or turning holy spells to shadow.

    But on a more specific note, a holy pally talent that gives you a mini avenging crusader that’s always up and scales
    With mastery, blessings for all specs, a way to lose holy Power for ret, seals.

    For hunters, some sort of managed ammo, duel wielding survival, A old survival esc dot build for Mm, snake trap.

    For shamans, gust of wind, 2h enh, more totems and a way to drop them all at once not just move them, spectral rams.
    I miss seals...honestly I am hoping for the return of a lot of flavor
    Stances
    Seals
    Weapon styles like 2h enhance and smf

    I'm happy with what we have seen so far because hopium

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •