Defund the Police U.S or anywhere?

[Endus]

Not really, but as usual you do you and you understand very little of the world surrounding you.

The slogan sucks. Period. Reform the Police would be a much better slogan because it actually means that and you could even insert a defunding in the reform if the reform is successful.

Who does not want a "better Police", a more effective Police ? See ? It is not that hard.

And Obama is still in better place than you to say that "Defund the Police" is a bad slogan.

Why is "Defund the Police" a bad slogan?

And, simultaneously, I'm gonna expect you to explain why "Defund Planned Parenthood" is not a bad slogan, since the word's been used in multiple actual bills in the last decade seeking to achieve that goal?

You keep deflecting and refusing to answer this shit, because you know you're dishonest about it.

The "Defund the Police" movement is not about having "better police". It's about having "fewer police and more better-trained specialists". I know you'd really like it if we gave up on that idea and went with your idea instead, but we don't see the value in what you're saying or that your opinion is in any way a counterpoint.

And sorry, no matter how many times you bring up some Democrat saying something, I'm not an empty ideologue who blindly follows whatever my political leadership says I should. Why would Obama disagreeing with me convince me of anything? It just suggests to me he's wrong. Because he's human, not an infallible agent of God or some nonsense. It's really fucking weird that you think Obama having an opinion should convince me of anything. That's not how rational thinking works, dude. I don't care who said a thing, I care about the internal rationality of the thing that was said. I'm not gonna fall for your naked appeal to authority. It's absolute fucking nonsense and nobody rational would change their minds on anything just "because Obama said so". Come the fuck on.

[Specialka]

Why is "Defund the Police" a bad slogan?

And, simultaneously, I'm gonna expect you to explain why "Defund Planned Parenthood" is not a bad slogan, since the word's been used in multiple actual bills in the last decade seeking to achieve that goal?

You keep deflecting and refusing to answer this shit, because you know you're dishonest about it.

And sorry, no matter how many times you bring up some Democrat saying something, I'm not an empty ideologue who blindly follows whatever my political leadership says I should. Why would Obama disagreeing with me convince me of anything? It just suggests to me he's wrong. Because he's human, not an infallible agent of God or some nonsense. It's really fucking weird that you think Obama having an opinion should convince me of anything. That's not how rational thinking works, dude. I don't care who said a thing, I care about the internal rationality of the thing that was said.

It is not about convincing you. It is about convincing everyone else. Some people can't just be convinced because they think they are always right about everything (Remind you of something ?).

Btw, your critic of Obama can be applied to you as well. Tell us why we should believe you about what you are saying about the word "Defund"?

[Endus]

It is not about convincing you. It is about convincing everyone else. Some people can't just be convinced because they think they are always right about everything (Remind you of something ?).

Who do you think you're convincing?

You can't even rationally explain why it's not okay for left-wingers to use "Defund" but it's totally okay for Republicans to use it.

[Specialka]

Who do you think you're convincing?

You can't even rationally explain why it's not okay for left-wingers to use "Defund" but it's totally okay for Republicans to use it.

Mostly any reasonable person around. There is not that much reasonable person on these boards anyway.

[LilSaihah]

If we defund the Police what would an alternative look like?

Local warlords or corporate-owned private police forces.

[unfilteredJW]

Mostly any reasonable person around. There is not that much reasonable person on these boards anyway.

This is projection.

[Shadowferal]

Except I mean "defund". I mean reducing police presence. That's the movement.

And it failed in the one place you'd think it wouldn't; in Minneapolis.

And in more "liberal" Philadelphia, it's not even a consideration as they want more police on the streets.

"Reform" is a more positive word to use.

[Forogil]

Mostly any reasonable person around. There is not that much reasonable person on these boards anyway.

Well, even among the members on these boards it is failing - as evidenced at the top of the page.

- - - Updated - - -

And it failed in the one place you'd think it wouldn't; in Minneapolis.

And in more "liberal" Philadelphia, it's not even a consideration as they want more police on the streets.

And San Francisco as well.

https://www.economist.com/briefing/2...oderate-or-die

London Breed, the city’s moderate-leaning mayor, has begun forcefully arguing for more police—not fewer, as was once voguish in progressive circles. “The reign of criminals who are destroying our city, it is time for it to come to an end,” she said in December.

(And more strongly in the corresponding leader.)

[Specialka]

Well, even among the members on these boards it is failing - as evidenced at the top of the page.

- - - Updated - - -


And San Francisco as well.

https://www.economist.com/briefing/2...oderate-or-die

(And more strongly in the corresponding leader.)

True, the more reasonable person on these boards already know it is a bad slogan.

[Shadowferal]

Imagine believing yourself reasoned while missing the entire point of defund the police campaign, lmao.

English language shouldn't need an interpreter.

[Shadowferal]

It's a slogan, it does the job it needs to: It gets people talking, and discussing, said point. If all you do is look at those three words and come to a grand conclusion, then you need more than an interpreter, oh reasoned one.

And as Obama said, they heard the slogan and that was the moment they shut you out. High crime areas don't want to hear it.

[Forogil]

Funnily enough, the USA is far from having the most police officers per capita.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...olice_officers

That's really shocking - one often get the impression that the US had lots of law enforcement officers, but instead it is even below the world median (prison population is a different matter - although that has decreased a bit).

Combined with the other factors it more and more seems like the police in the US is a cheap over-stretched solution that isn't working.

[Shadowferal]

A lot of people don't want to hear a lot of things, but those who are *cough cough* reasoned, will listen, and have that discussion. Imagine thinking a fucking SLOGAN is going to just enlighten ignorant people.

As already said more liberal cities aren't going to hear you.
Portland Sees Spike in Gun Violence; Some Say Defunding of Police is to Blame

Portland police warned that other cities that have made a similar choice saw spikes in homicides. Stockton, California, began disbanding and defunding police units dedicated to gun violence in 2010. Stockton then saw record homicide rates in 2011 and 2012. Data reported by the Stockton police shows homicides significantly declines after the city restored the units.

-----
As a result, Portland among U.S. cities adding funds back into police departments

“Many Portlanders no longer feel safe,” Mayor Ted Wheeler said. “And it is our duty, as leaders of this city, to take action and deliver better results within our crisis response system.”

Portland isn’t the only liberal city doing an about-face on police spending. From New York City to Los Angeles — in cities that had some of the largest Black Lives Matter protests, and some with an extensive history of police brutality — police departments are seeing their finances partially restored in response to rising homicides, an officer exodus and political pressures.

In recent mayoral elections, some winning candidates have pledged to bolster public safety budgets. In Minneapolis, where Floyd was killed, voters rejected a proposal to replace the police department with a new Department of Public Safety.

[Specialka]

That's really shocking - one often get the impression that the US had lots of law enforcement officers, but instead it is even below the world median (prison population is a different matter - although that has decreased a bit).

Combined with the other factors it more and more seems like the police in the US is a cheap over-stretched solution that isn't working.

Maybe it should be "Fund the Police" for a slogan /s. As in more training and more bodies. While copying what is working for European Police though the context is different.

[Forogil]

And political candidates (even the ones that favored it) - don't want to list it as one of their issues - look at https://www.ocasiocortez.com/issues
(Yes, I know it is not really an issue for congress etc, but still.)

[deepr]

"Defund the police" in a country with a high crime rate, where everyone and their grandmother has guns and where there's a mass shooting every week.
Sounds like a great idea.

[Evil Midnight Bomber]

You have fucking mass shootings every Tuesday and Thursday and you want to defund the police.

lol.

Funding the police to stand around while kids get shot doesn't seem like a great investment.

[Captain N]

It continues to baffle me how many people can misunderstand something even after it is explained.

I'll take willful ignorance for $500, Alex.

[Endus]

It continues to baffle me how many people can misunderstand something even after it is explained.

As we got into with SpecialKa; they understand, they just want a police state and oppose it on principle, but know that advocating more knees on necks isn't gonna win them any friends here, so we get this absolute bad-faith malarkey about it being a "bad slogan", because "defund" is a bad word, despite Republicans using it constantly and clearly not actually believing that bullshit.

[Specialka]

As we got into with SpecialKa; they understand, they just want a police state and oppose it on principle, but know that advocating more knees on necks isn't gonna win them any friends here, so we get this absolute bad-faith malarkey about it being a "bad slogan", because "defund" is a bad word, despite Republicans using it constantly and clearly not actually believing that bullshit.

More bad faith from you, not really surprised though. As it has been said by multiple people, "Defund the Police" is a bad slogan because it is not self explanatory and worse, can be use against itself by detractors like Republican. "Reform the Police" would be a far better alternative. Period. I know you do not get it, but I keep trying.

Btw, the fact that you are not infracted after all the shit you throw at other posters is baffling.