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  1. #141
    Epic! Malania's Avatar
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    Can't tell if stupid or being trolled. =/

  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by Celement View Post
    How does the current leveling help with that?
    It doesnt. They need to bring difficulty back in the game that would teach the players to play again. Green lvl mobs should be dead in few hits, yellow should take some time and force you to use some of your kit. Orange mobs should take all your kit and clever use of game mechanics.

  3. #143
    The point of this product called wow is to provide revenue to the shareholders. Revenue is generated through subscription, title sales and in-game sales including gold sales.

    What is so surprising in designing a product in such a way so it would generate most revenue?..

    Long leveling = extra sub time = revenue
    Gated story content = extra sub time = revenue
    Paid level ups as a shortcut to avoid long leveling = revenue
    Implementing features that suppress team play and substitute it with lobby-game scenarios = harder gearing = incentive to buy gold for GDKP gearing runs = revenue

    Everything is aimed at revenue. Customer satisfaction is secondary and only important as long as it does not result in revenue loss

  4. #144
    Bloodsail Admiral bloodkin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drudi View Post
    The point of this product called wow is to provide revenue to the shareholders. Revenue is generated through subscription, title sales and in-game sales including gold sales.

    What is so surprising in designing a product in such a way so it would generate most revenue?..

    Long leveling = extra sub time = revenue
    Gated story content = extra sub time = revenue
    Paid level ups as a shortcut to avoid long leveling = revenue
    Implementing features that suppress team play and substitute it with lobby-game scenarios = harder gearing = incentive to buy gold for GDKP gearing runs = revenue

    Everything is aimed at revenue. Customer satisfaction is secondary and only important as long as it does not result in revenue loss
    This is exactly were the problems start: the game is no longer designed for the entertainment of the consumer, but as a revenue generator for investors. Thus, it will over time lose it's appeal and entertainment value and so it's revenue as players leave. WoW's biggest danger to it's continued existence isn't just the playerbase leaving, it's the playerbase loosing trust in the company that it would continue to treat WoW with the same values it has done in the past. Players that leave out of boredom will come back if the game is fixed, players that leave because they no longer trust the company/devs will bot come back unless structural changes are made to both the game and the company.
    'Something's awry.' -Duhgan 'Bel' beltayn

    'A Man choses, a Slave obeys.' -Andrew Rayn

  5. #145
    A better question is why have levels at all?

    The leveling experience is there for tourists and reviewers. For people who actually play the game long term, the "leveling" experience is nothing. Probably 0.01% of their game time.
    Last edited by Swnem; 2022-08-01 at 12:20 PM.

  6. #146
    Quote Originally Posted by Ringthane View Post
    But I thought WoW was "pay 2 win"! You mean, you're not paying to jump straight to max level with the best gear, mounts, and everything else? How can this be? Why did people lie to me?

    Come on, people. Please try to do better.
    No it just takes a while and alot of money but youll get there.
    Quote Originally Posted by rhorle View Post
    At no point have I claimed people weren't getting gold from the token or that gold can not be used to acquire power.
    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    p2w is not inherently unfair.

  7. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by Khaza-R View Post
    It isn't. Material application trumps conjecture absolutely. So until you can bring up actual propositions of leveling being obseleted, even on MMOs that might have financially failed, you're really just talking into the void. As hard as you might trying to convince yourself otherwise.
    This makes no sense.

    Are you seriously saying that any example, even a failed one, would convince you? That's ridiculous.

    If you don't want to argue properly, that's fine. But don't spout nonsense. That's not helping anyone.

  8. #148
    I can't imagine a game in a similar genre that doesn't have levels.

  9. #149
    Scarab Lord
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    Don't worry, the winds of wisdom 50% bonus xp buff will be gone again soon.
    If you knew the candle was fire then the meal was cooked a long time ago.

  10. #150
    They really should remove the open world and add a Starcraft like UI Lobby with an integrated chat interface where you chose the dungeon / raid / pvp map you want to play. Thats the real game, after all, and they could make much more dungeons/raids per expansion by doing this.

  11. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by Deneios View Post
    It doesnt. They need to bring difficulty back in the game that would teach the players to play again. Green lvl mobs should be dead in few hits, yellow should take some time and force you to use some of your kit. Orange mobs should take all your kit and clever use of game mechanics.
    what do you mean "bring back" previously leveling wasnt difficult just TEDIOUS...
    back in vanila as a priest orange mobs "difficulty" was i used absorb, dot, and wand it to death over loooong time... or on lock voidwalker+dots+healing vw and you could kill anything just took you shitloads of time...

    im not again leveling (and open world) content to be difficult but it wouldnt be "back", it would be first time

  12. #152

  13. #153
    Leveling happens between expacs to mask the gear reset. You can't just release tiers forever or else in like 2-3 expacs people will be sititng at 100% crit/haste/mastery.

  14. #154
    I just leveled as a Prot Paladin. It took 12 hours, total. I leveled mostly through dungeons by starting expansions which had good dungeon quests - Wrath, Cata, Mists. And then quested some in WoD and ran dungeons there since it's the weekly time walking.

    12 hours.

    i have well over 100 days played on my first Prot Pally and scores of days spread across other characters.

    12 hours...

    Yeah, i can deal with it.

  15. #155
    Quote Originally Posted by Drudi View Post
    The point of this product called wow is to provide revenue to the shareholders. Revenue is generated through subscription, title sales and in-game sales including gold sales.

    What is so surprising in designing a product in such a way so it would generate most revenue?..

    Long leveling = extra sub time = revenue
    Gated story content = extra sub time = revenue
    Paid level ups as a shortcut to avoid long leveling = revenue
    Implementing features that suppress team play and substitute it with lobby-game scenarios = harder gearing = incentive to buy gold for GDKP gearing runs = revenue

    Everything is aimed at revenue. Customer satisfaction is secondary and only important as long as it does not result in revenue loss
    Even though this is a huge over simplification, I agree with the point, except as an investor I prefer profit over revenue. Usually one follows the other, but not always.

  16. #156
    they got a point though, when the current game just revolves around the latest expansion.
    and everything prior not only being made redundant, but actively being trimmed, why still have that 1 to 50 grind when the game is only about 50 to 60?

  17. #157
    1-50 is completely fine. 50-60 on the other hand feels slow and boring.

  18. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by RobertMugabe View Post
    1-50 is completely fine. 50-60 on the other hand feels slow and boring.
    I agree and that makes me 0_о, when Blizzard say, that DF will be even slower.

  19. #159
    The levelling process in WoW being a largely irrelevant step to the game. I agree.

  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by Swnem View Post
    For people who actually play the game long term, the "leveling" experience is nothing. Probably 0.01% of their game time.
    I'd argue leveling exists to a greater extent than that, however it's now hidden as different systems. Artifact/Azerite/Anima Power is literally just an XP bar and world quests replace regular quests.

    Instead of farming for gold or mats people are farming alternate progression systems instead.

    Linear single-player questing makes up the majority of the current levelling experience and while it's a great tool for storytelling, once you've experienced it it's going to be the exact same every time give or take.

    I think a positive change would be to expand upon some endgame gameplay players like, and implement that in the levelling experience. For example new battlegrounds and less linear dungeons, content where you're playing with other people that varies and holds long term interest. Collecting gear and character upgrades that are still relevant even once you hit level cap would mitigate the feeling that "anything before level cap is a waste of time".

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