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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goat7 View Post
    Well technically they did not keep their jobs.

    Most of them have quit.

    Blizzard did bring in a whole new team by purchasing Proletariat to work on WoW. IMO it is a little too late, game is shit, Blizzard is shit. Only reason why DI and Hearthstone have success is due to Whales and Addicts swiping them cards, the microtransaction money they are making is insane and also very fucking sad for the gaming industry. This is the biggest reason why they have been sold to Microsoft, Blizzard became a company that only cared for profits and doing so caused them to decline in active players across the board so they are getting out while they still worth $$$
    There's a lot that you seem to be confused about. Activision as a whole is being sold to Microsoft. That includes all of their IPs as well as Blizzard's. COD is a consistent money maker year after year, even if its in a slump right now because Vanguard was ass and so is the current Warzone map. It's not like they're just selling Blizzard to MS. Most of the WoW team is intact, so I'm not sure where you're getting the idea that most of them quit. The founders moved on after 30 years making the same 3 franchises, some devs were fired because they were perverts, and some people from various departments have left / changed projects / whatever. For the most part people are still there. You make it sound like they bought an entire dev team solely to replace a WoW team, and that's not really how it works. There are multiple teams working on WoW and it has worked that way for quite awhile now.

    Don't get me wrong, Shadowlands is in a really bad way, they no doubt lost a ton of money there, but we don't have to exaggerate to prove a point.

    I am pretty surprised that Hearthstone is still a money maker for them. Constructed is pretty dead, I often fight the same opponents day after day so it's not like the player base is huge. The other parts of the game aren't monetized very well at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Echo of Soul View Post
    Uuuh..WTF?
    It's a fun meme but there was no mass exodus to FFXIV. FFXIV saw a resurgence which is nice because it's a good MMO, but the overlap between FFXIV and WoW isn't very big. They appeal to two very different groups of MMO players. This is reflected in FFXIV's stream numbers which are abysmal compared to WoW's unless a certain balding streamer is streaming. FFXIV and WoW can both do well without cannibalizing each other. The quarterly report also reflected this. WoW players were playing TBC instead of Retail, not FFXIV instead of WoW.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Echo of Soul View Post
    ROFL, you REALLY believe that don't you?? KEKW
    I mean if they lied in the investor call it would be an actual crime. The number is pumped up because TBC is included in the sub now and a LOT of people are playing that, but it still set a 10 year record for them.
    AchaeaKoralin - Are you still out there? | Classic Priest

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    They are comparing two games instead of one that’s true, but they aren’t comparing the lowest sub counts of other expans as they say “at this point after launch” so 3 Quarters in.

    Q3 of last year was 3 Quarters into shadowlands launch (9months) if you compare that back to Wod they were still reporting subs 3 quarters in and that number was around 5.5M or some such, legion didn’t report numbers butt they said they were above Wod.

    So ya SL would be behind other modern expans but wow as a whole would still be rather high on subs.
    This is certainly a very... creative interpretation of that Earnings Call.
    With deep engagement across both Classic and Modern, WoW's overall subscriber base is stronger than we typically see at this point after a Modern expansion launch.
    Highlighting the important part here. Also doesn't explicitly define what is meant by a modern expansion so this statement could mean anything really. Even if it includes WoD, because they used the word "typically" it could still just mean that it's higher than BfA and Legion at that point (meaning 9 months in) which makes total sense since Classic only released 12 months into BfA (and more than doubled the game's overall subscribers at that point) and Legion didn't have any Classic game mode to "stabilize" the subscription numbers. In any way, you cannot deduce from this what sub numbers were like in comparison to WoD.
    And for 2021, World of Warcraft is on track to deliver its strongest engagement and net bookings outside of a Modern expansion year in a decade.
    This is the statement that explicitly includes WoD but it no longer talks about subscribers and instead shifts to "engagement and net bookings" which were likely driven by the fact that they heavily monetized TBC through the Dark Portal pass, level boost and paid character copies (effectively creating a mini expac launch outside of an expansion year).
    Last edited by Nerovar; 2022-08-02 at 06:52 PM.
    The absolute state of Warcraft lore in 2021:
    Kyrians: We need to keep chucking people into the Maw because it's our job.
    Also Kyrians: Why is the Maw growing stronger despite all our efforts?

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by RoKPaNda View Post
    There's a lot that you seem to be confused about. Activision as a whole is being sold to Microsoft. That includes all of their IPs as well as Blizzard's. COD is a consistent money maker year after year, even if its in a slump right now because Vanguard was ass and so is the current Warzone map. It's not like they're just selling Blizzard to MS. Most of the WoW team is intact, so I'm not sure where you're getting the idea that most of them quit. The founders moved on after 30 years making the same 3 franchises, some devs were fired because they were perverts, and some people from various departments have left / changed projects / whatever. For the most part people are still there. You make it sound like they bought an entire dev team solely to replace a WoW team, and that's not really how it works. There are multiple teams working on WoW and it has worked that way for quite awhile now.

    Don't get me wrong, Shadowlands is in a really bad way, they no doubt lost a ton of money there, but we don't have to exaggerate to prove a point.

    I am pretty surprised that Hearthstone is still a money maker for them. Constructed is pretty dead, I often fight the same opponents day after day so it's not like the player base is huge. The other parts of the game aren't monetized very well at all.



    It's a fun meme but there was no mass exodus to FFXIV. FFXIV saw a resurgence which is nice because it's a good MMO, but the overlap between FFXIV and WoW isn't very big. They appeal to two very different groups of MMO players. This is reflected in FFXIV's stream numbers which are abysmal compared to WoW's unless a certain balding streamer is streaming. FFXIV and WoW can both do well without cannibalizing each other. The quarterly report also reflected this. WoW players were playing TBC instead of Retail, not FFXIV instead of WoW.

    - - - Updated - - -



    I mean if they lied in the investor call it would be an actual crime. The number is pumped up because TBC is included in the sub now and a LOT of people are playing that, but it still set a 10 year record for them.
    It's a free country, it's well within your right to be delusional and believe that the game is doing fine

  4. #44
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    because they used the word "typically" it could still just mean that it's higher than BfA and Legion at that point (meaning 9 months in)
    They could absolutely just mean legion and BFA but that wouldn’t really change any thing as legion reported to do better then Wod even through they didn’t give us exact numbers like in Wod.

    This is the statement that explicitly includes WoD but it no longer talks about subscribers and instead shifts to "engagement and net bookings" which were likely driven by the fact that they heavily monetized TBC through the Dark Portal pass, level boost and paid character copies (effectively creating a mini expac launch outside of an expansion year).
    this part does include Wod but it also importantly includes mop, which was at about 6 or 7M at the time I believe.

    So with the separation between “modern” and “in a decade” and then legion preforming better then Wod I’d personally draw the conclusion that a “modern” wow expan goes back to Wod but not as far back as mop meaning subs would be under 6-7M but above 5M, of course counting Sl TBC and classic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Echo of Soul View Post
    It's a free country, it's well within your right to be delusional and believe that the game is doing fine
    The world isn't as black and white as “doing fine” or “had an exodus”.

    The facts of the matter from the investor reports show that while SL might be doing considerably worse then other expans Classic and classic TBC have kept sub numbers high even out pacing other solo expans.

    At beat you can say subs changed from Majorty retail players to classic players but nothing at all supports subs actually canceling and moving to another game until 2022 which is notably a lull in both retail and classic alike.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Dadwen View Post
    I suppose if you just played the hunter class by smashing your face into the keyboard they all play the same....
    No. But when I can switch back and forth and not only is my key press order nearly identical, but so is the timing, and when the only real difference is movement especially after the Aimed Shot movement nerf post-Wrath sans Tier 18...

    Quote Originally Posted by kranur View Post
    Yes, them as in Blizzard. It doesn't make any difference to me if all the employees want to make a good game but their boss asks them to make a profitable one instead. Crap is crap, I don't get to play the intention of the developers, I get to play the actual released product.
    Except those bean counters are at the holding company level, ActivisionBlizzard. A completely different entity.

  6. #46
    From another thread;

    Activision Blizzard, the parent company of Blizzard Entertainment in Irvine, posted a 28% drop in quarterly net revenue while net income was down 68% as the tapering of the pandemic led more people away from video games and inflation gave them less money to spend.

    Second-quarter revenue was $1.64 billion, down from $2.3 billion in the same period a year ago, while profit fell to $280 million from $876 million.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    They could absolutely just mean legion and BFA but that wouldn’t really change any thing as legion reported to do better then Wod even through they didn’t give us exact numbers like in Wod.
    Legion was reported to do "slightly better" than WoD after its release but they never talked about subscribers. If I remember correctly, they only referred to its performance in terms of "time played" back then which doesn't mean all that much since Legion came up with a lot of new grinds and side content while WoD is widely regarded as a barebones "raidlogging" expansion. Furthermore, they never really told us how Legion performed 9 months in so you can't really say anything with certainty here - especially not in regards to subscriptions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    this part does include Wod but it also importantly includes mop, which was at about 6 or 7M at the time I believe.
    It no longer talks about subscribers though.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    So with the separation between “modern” and “in a decade” and then legion preforming better then Wod I’d personally draw the conclusion that a “modern” wow expan goes back to Wod but not as far back as mop meaning subs would be under 6-7M but above 5M, of course counting Sl TBC and classic.
    Again, you cannot possibly deduce any of this from what they're telling us in the earnings call. The absolute best possible interpretation would mean that it performed better than MoP 9 months in (which would be above 7 million subs) at worst it means that it was merely doing better than BfA and Legion 9 months in (which we know very little about). However we do know that "World of Warcraft Classic drove the biggest quarterly increase to subscription plans in franchise history" while doubling the amount of subscriptions. Looking at the historical subscription data available to us this would mean that BfA at that point had at least 2.5 million subscribers (since that was the biggest jump that we know of in between MoP and WoD) so that is our lowest possible point.

    So all this definitely tells us is that Shadowlands had anywhere between 2.5 and 7 million subs 9 months in (including Classic subs). This isn't very meaningful.
    Last edited by Nerovar; 2022-08-02 at 07:43 PM.
    The absolute state of Warcraft lore in 2021:
    Kyrians: We need to keep chucking people into the Maw because it's our job.
    Also Kyrians: Why is the Maw growing stronger despite all our efforts?

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    They are comparing two games instead of one that’s true, but they aren’t comparing the lowest sub counts of other expans as they say “at this point after launch” so 3 Quarters in.

    Q3 of last year was 3 Quarters into shadowlands launch (9months) if you compare that back to Wod they were still reporting subs 3 quarters in and that number was around 5.5M or some such, legion didn’t report numbers butt they said they were above Wod.

    So ya SL would be behind other modern expans but wow as a whole would still be rather high on subs.
    I didn’t say lowest sub count of each expansion, I said the expansion with the lowest sub count at this point in time. As in 3 quarters in post BfA probably

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    If you can’t believe the investor reports you can’t believe any thing blizzard puts out and that’s what the investor reports say.
    Quote where they mention subscribers or subscriptions in the call.
    Quote Originally Posted by Exkrementor View Post
    Nobody uses Online forums anymore.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    From another thread;

    Activision Blizzard, the parent company of Blizzard Entertainment in Irvine, posted a 28% drop in quarterly net revenue while net income was down 68% as the tapering of the pandemic led more people away from video games and inflation gave them less money to spend.

    Second-quarter revenue was $1.64 billion, down from $2.3 billion in the same period a year ago, while profit fell to $280 million from $876 million.
    Yeah, they seem to be doing great, no loss of players AT ALL. Meanwhile their competitors grow but no nobody left

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    Kinda wish discussion of Blizzard's QRs was a restricted topic on this forum. Almost nobody uses the information from the QRs for anything other than weird ass guesses about the performance of WoW (despite none of the information being specific to it) or to support some impossibly shitty Bellular-tier "look at the numbers" take that nobody with higher than room temperature IQ would take seriously.

    We aren't investors, this information is useless to us as consumers.
    I am an investor (granted I don’t own millions of shares like some people do but I own hundreds), so yeah this does mean a lot to me. And the biggest take away is that the Activision side took the biggest hit this quarter and everyone can see that. And if you truly believe you need a PHD or to be a career investor in order to see that wow isn’t doing great then you probably need to go back to school.

    It isn’t doom and gloom, the game is obviously in a low spot even if it was in a great place for players because we are at the tail end of two expansions and we will see some massive numbers at the end of Q4 with dragonflight and wotlk but regardless, wow isn’t doing great.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    Is it bad that I think this would be a good thing?
    It would be a bad thing for investors who want to see what the parent company is doing with their studios. I mean if you don’t even know how to read them in the first place then I guess it will be a good thing that you have less to read? Idk

  12. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Somic View Post
    I am an investor (granted I don’t own millions of shares like some people do but I own hundreds), so yeah this does mean a lot to me. And the biggest take away is that the Activision side took the biggest hit this quarter and everyone can see that. And if you truly believe you need a PHD or to be a career investor in order to see that wow isn’t doing great then you probably need to go back to school.

    It isn’t doom and gloom, the game is obviously in a low spot even if it was in a great place for players because we are at the tail end of two expansions and we will see some massive numbers at the end of Q4 with dragonflight and wotlk but regardless, wow isn’t doing great.

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    It would be a bad thing for investors who want to see what the parent company is doing with their studios. I mean if you don’t even know how to read them in the first place then I guess it will be a good thing that you have less to read? Idk
    I want there to be less dogshit tier takes that try to deconstruct the human genome to prove unequivocally that WoW is really like totally actually (for reals) dead this time. If that means "real investors" like you have less information then I'm willing to make that sacrifice.

  13. #53
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by arkanon View Post
    Quote where they mention subscribers or subscriptions in the call.
    Already posted it on the first page but here if you missed it.

    Within the Warcraft franchise, World of Warcraft reach and engagement continues to benefit from the combination of the Modern game and Classic under a single subscription. The two games offer players more ways to engage and create more opportunities for our teams to deliver compelling experiences to fans of the franchise. With deep engagement across both Classic and Modern, WoW's overall subscriber base is stronger than we typically see at this point after a Modern expansion launch.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    I want there to be less dogshit tier takes that try to deconstruct the human genome to prove unequivocally that WoW is really like totally actually (for reals) dead this time. If that means "real investors" like you have less information then I'm willing to make that sacrifice.
    Well for one, wow is objectively not doing as great as great as it should be with two titles attached to its name. If someone comes in here and exaggerates that and you take it seriously then I guess that’s on you.

    The thing about it for me though as an investor, is that I can clearly see one of their biggest money makers (cod) is struggling seriously. So if I see them about to make massive mistakes with the cod title or not supplement this with a new title then I can start selling. Same thing with wow. I can very VERY clearly see that the only thing keeping wow in a healthy state (a healthy state to an investor is growth not stagnation keep in mind) is classic wow. If classic wow wasn’t attached to the sub then the Warcraft title would be going down. I’m not saying omg the game is dying, but it isn’t growing which isn’t a good thing whether you want to hear it or not.

    So with this call, I know that dragonflight and wotlk release will look great on my Q4 earnings. The thing about that is, knowing what I know about wow and this earnings call, is that if blizzard doesn’t come up with something great for classic wow immediately following wotlk or do something massive with retail, then it might be time to back out. Especially if even cod took a massive hit this time around.

    I’m not a career investor, but I can at the very least see this.

  15. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeenox View Post
    Blizzard’s second quarter segment revenue and operating income were lower year-over-year but higher versus the first quarter. World of Warcraft net bookings declined versus a year-ago quarter that included the launch of Burning Crusade Classic, offsetting year-over-year growth for Hearthstone and the contribution from the June launch of Diablo Immortal.

    It is widely reported that DI has brought in more than $100 million. Hearthstone had growth. This was offset by a decline in WoW. So WoW lost more than $100 million last quarter? And this quarter was better than the last. How do the people running WoW keep their jobs?
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    From another thread;

    Activision Blizzard, the parent company of Blizzard Entertainment in Irvine, posted a 28% drop in quarterly net revenue while net income was down 68% as the tapering of the pandemic led more people away from video games and inflation gave them less money to spend.

    Second-quarter revenue was $1.64 billion, down from $2.3 billion in the same period a year ago, while profit fell to $280 million from $876 million.
    It's not that easy to conclude.

    Activision Blizzard is a very solid buisness - in fact, the prediction points on expanding(contradicting the pessimistic audiance). Expanding in buisness means that you hire more people, buy studios/other businesses, release new products etc.

    According to the graph, they would practically beat the average growth of the market by 4-6%.

    Earnings are forecast to grow 12.42% per year

    Earnings grew by 7.1% over the past year
    https://simplywall.st/stocks/us/medi...ision-blizzard

    Comparing it to Final Fantasy(Square Enix) -
    Earnings are forecast to decline by an average of 1.6% per year for the next 3 years
    https://simplywall.st/stocks/jp/medi...oldings-shares

    This is based on generating income/growth - i.e FF might be less aggressive on earnings compared to WoW. FF might even be a better product - but this is a business and people needs to earn money.

    The conclussion would be, that Square Enix is expected to lose against the market for sometime(if not they release a new game, involve aggressive micro transactions, attract more players etc.). Ultimately, this could lead to decline of a product/business.

    Just compare any other company to Activision Blizzard - I took FF as the example as it's often compared to WoW(might not be a fair comparision, as Activision Blizzard has multiple games in the relevant market and with much bigger/wider audiance).

    We can only conclude that Activision Blizzard is very strong in the competition, despite YouTube algorithm/haters, the scandals and couple of bad releases. They can afford the screw-ups and troll you back.
    Last edited by HansOlo; 2022-08-02 at 09:44 PM.

  16. #56
    The Unstoppable Force Lorgar Aurelian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    Legion was reported to do "slightly better" than WoD after its release but they never talked about subscribers. If I remember correctly, they only referred to its performance in terms of "time played"
    went back to check and you are right though it does say that, though it also says it was out preforming the prior expan.
    World of Warcraft® time spent grew Y/Y, and LegionTM continues to outperform the prior
    expansion
    Quote Originally Posted by Nerovar View Post
    So all this definitely tells us is that Shadowlands had anywhere between 2.5 and 7 million subs 9 months in (including Classic subs). This isn't very meaningful.
    So I went ahead and did some further digging into old reports.

    In Q4 2015 they stopped reporting subs at 5.5.
    in Q1 2016 they don't mention them at all.
    in Q2 they report double digit growth In MUA, not subs since it's post token but effectively the same thing.
    in Q3 they report another 30% MAU growth (legion lunch).
    in Q4 another 20% MAU growth.
    in Q1 2017 no report of growth but it does say "overall performance is slightly ahead of the prior expansion"

    so over all it's technically possible for the number to have dropped to say 2.5M in Q1 of 2016 or Q1-2 of 2017 Id say it's a bit unlikely given all the growth they reported in 2016 which would put the Q4 2016 number some where in the 8m ball park assuming Q1 2016 didn't drop below 5M. Meaning legion would have to have lost 6M in two quaters to be at 2.5 at the date in question and that would have to be better performance then wod which obviously isn't possible.



    https://investor.activision.com/events-presentations all the reports for any one who wants to check the Quarters them self's.
    Last edited by Lorgar Aurelian; 2022-08-02 at 08:55 PM.
    All I ever wanted was the truth. Remember those words as you read the ones that follow. I never set out to topple my father's kingdom of lies from a sense of misplaced pride. I never wanted to bleed the species to its marrow, reaving half the galaxy clean of human life in this bitter crusade. I never desired any of this, though I know the reasons for which it must be done. But all I ever wanted was the truth.

  17. #57
    Who is exaggerating?

    Most of the WoW team that worked on WoW during Legion (the last thing WoW did right) has quit and the majority of them said Blizzard is shit but in a nice way going out the door.

    Recent Blizzard products: Warcraft 3 Refunded: one of the worst games in history.
    Diablo Immortal: greedy awful p2w dog crap of a game.
    Heroes of the Storm: dead for the most part due to lack of support.
    WoW Shadowlands: Awful
    WoW BFA: God Awful
    WoW Dragonflight: So far looks really awful, re skinned zones that are "new", re skin demon hunter metamorph "new class", old talent trees
    = new talent trees. Dont worry tho u get P2W professions and u can DRAGONFLY WEEEEEEEE.
    Overwatch: So bad they are trying to revamp it with Overwatch 2.
    WoW Classic: Prolly the best product they offer, just a re release and just making money of Nostalgia addicts.
    Hearthstone: Plz take my money
    Lets all just agree that Microsoft acquisition cannot come fast enough.

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Goat7 View Post
    Who is exaggerating?

    Most of the WoW team that worked on WoW during Legion (the last thing WoW did right) has quit and the majority of them said Blizzard is shit but in a nice way going out the door.

    Recent Blizzard products: Warcraft 3 Refunded: one of the worst games in history.
    Diablo Immortal: greedy awful p2w dog crap of a game.
    Heroes of the Storm: dead for the most part due to lack of support.
    WoW Shadowlands: Awful
    WoW BFA: God Awful
    WoW Dragonflight: So far looks really awful, re skinned zones that are "new", re skin demon hunter metamorph "new class", old talent trees
    = new talent trees. Dont worry tho u get P2W professions and u can DRAGONFLY WEEEEEEEE.
    Overwatch: So bad they are trying to revamp it with Overwatch 2.
    WoW Classic: Prolly the best product they offer, just a re release and just making money of Nostalgia addicts.
    Hearthstone: Plz take my money
    Lets all just agree that Microsoft acquisition cannot come fast enough.
    Read my post above. The facts are more relevant in this topic, than personal taste of what product is good.

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Goat7 View Post
    Who is exaggerating?

    Most of the WoW team that worked on WoW during Legion (the last thing WoW did right) has quit and the majority of them said Blizzard is shit but in a nice way going out the door.

    Recent Blizzard products: Warcraft 3 Refunded: one of the worst games in history.
    Diablo Immortal: greedy awful p2w dog crap of a game.
    Heroes of the Storm: dead for the most part due to lack of support.
    WoW Shadowlands: Awful
    WoW BFA: God Awful
    WoW Dragonflight: So far looks really awful, re skinned zones that are "new", re skin demon hunter metamorph "new class", old talent trees
    = new talent trees. Dont worry tho u get P2W professions and u can DRAGONFLY WEEEEEEEE.
    Overwatch: So bad they are trying to revamp it with Overwatch 2.
    WoW Classic: Prolly the best product they offer, just a re release and just making money of Nostalgia addicts.
    Hearthstone: Plz take my money
    Lets all just agree that Microsoft acquisition cannot come fast enough.
    Seems like you're exaggerating.

    The only two games there that won't be contested are D:I and WC3R.

    You also somehow forgot D2R which was well received.

    I get people love to meme on BfA and SL, but at worst they were mediocre. If you think they're awful, I'd say you have to genuinely play awful games then to see the difference.

    And Overwatchs only criticism has been lack of support because they were focusing too much on OW2. Theres nothing about the state of the game that forced a sequel to keep it going, you're really reaching there

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Lorgar Aurelian View Post
    went back to check and you are right though it does say that, though it also says it was out preforming the prior expan.




    So I went ahead and did some further digging into old reports.

    In Q4 2015 they stopped reporting subs at 5.5.
    in Q1 2016 they don't mention them at all.
    in Q2 they report double digit growth In MUA, not subs since it's post token but effectively the same thing.
    in Q3 they report another 30% MAU growth (legion lunch).
    in Q4 another 20% MAU growth.
    in Q1 2017 no report of growth but it does say "overall performance is slightly ahead of the prior expansion"

    so over all it's technically possible for the number to have dropped to say 2.5M in Q1 of 2016 or Q1-2 of 2017 Id say it's a bit unlikely given all the growth they reported in 2016 which would put the Q4 2016 number some where in the 8m ball park assuming Q1 2016 didn't drop below 5M. Meaning legion would have to have lost 6M in two quaters to be at 2.5 at the date in question and that would have to be better performance then wod which obviously isn't possible.



    https://investor.activision.com/events-presentations all the reports for any one who wants to check the Quarters them self's.
    Ok bud I hate to sound rude but you have no idea how to read these.

    You are reading growth or quarter-quarters and year-year and conflating them as the same thing.

    When you mention in 2016 it had “double digit growth” and then “30% more” and then “20% more” all that add up to is a 10% growth of all of 2016. And we all know after they stopped announcing subs is when WoW took a massive massive hit becasue of how hard wod fell. So I’ll be super generous and say Q1 of 2016 had 4 million subs, then it ended it with 4.4 not anywhere close to 8. You are off by about double the subs simply by not being able to read the calls lol.

    And I’m being super, super, SUPER generous with the wod fall off as well too.

    It even says it in the q4 call that 2016 saw a 10% increase. You’re reading it all wrong, probably out of bias I’m not quite sure.

    Also they didn’t stop reporting subs on q4 2015 it was right after q3 2015 so subs weren’t mentioned for two quarters.
    Last edited by Somic; 2022-08-02 at 10:27 PM.

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