Dracthyr classes

[Varx]

Have we actually seen any footage of the Dracthyr holding weapons in their draconic form yet? I've not seen any if so, but I may have missed them.

Otherwise, what you've said is largely the point I'm making. If Evokers need to do those same quests, Blizz will have to make something so that they can do so, otherwise the race/class is going to feel like it's missing something animation-wise in the near future. Once those are in, I'm not sure I see any other good reason not to open the flood gates to new Dracthyr classes. The sooner Blizz fixes that & puts decent weapon placements/animations on the Dracthyr model, the less dev time they'll have to waste trying to force a temporary solution for such quests in the future.

Yes they can unsheath them. They're not like druid forms. They're a legit race. Except they got perma kyrian wings.

What if the unsheathing animation was like they use dragon magic to dematerialize their weapon. That'd be neat.

Like how zovaal summons his mace in sotfo.

[Teriz]

Dude come on... One class for one race and vice versa.... I'll be surprised that lasts past 11.3.

I won't be, considering that that was the entire point of creating said race and class in the first place.

But anyway. Rouges and warriors aren't throwing their shoulder pads at people. Hell you can be naked and still roll heads. What matters is the weapons. Which they can still use obviously.

Not the point. The point is that Rogue and Warrior players want to see their weaponry and armor at all times. The Dracthyr model doesn't allow that, and Blizzard will never spend the time and resources to make the vast amount of armor and weapons work with the Dracthyr model. Again, the vast majority of Warrior and Rogue (and other classes) players will avoid the Dracthyr option like the plague due to that limitation.

A dracthyr warrior is a dragon that swings a sword because they weren't Chad enough to be an evoker.

And thank you for providing yet another reason a potential warrior player would skip the Dracthyr race.

They have armor in their visage form like their evoker siblings but magically "lose" it when in dragon form but still magically gain their benefit. Just like how mechagnomes still benefit from their boots and leg armor even though they somehow lose it. My head cannon is that they digitize it and absorb it, lol.

Uh no, it's just like the dragons of WoW. For example, Wrathion is wearing clothes and has a sword in Visage form, and it completely vanishes when he turns into his true draconic form. Dracthyr are no different.

[Varx]

I won't be, considering that that was the entire point of creating said race and class in the first place.



Not the point. The point is that Rogue and Warrior players want to see their weaponry and armor at all times. The Dracthyr model doesn't allow that, and Blizzard will never spend the time and resources to make the vast amount of armor and weapons work with the Dracthyr model. Again, the vast majority of Warrior and Rogue (and other classes) players will avoid the Dracthyr option like the plague due to that limitation.



And thank you for providing yet another reason a potential warrior player would skip the Dracthyr race.



Uh no, it's just like the dragons of WoW. For example, Wrathion is wearing clothes and has a sword in Visage form, and it completely vanishes when he turns into his true draconic form. Dracthyr are no different.

The only reason it makes no sense now is because dracthyr haven't gotten the chance to be other classes. But that won't be the case now that they've rejoined the world. Seems like the time frame from an expansion is long enough to have them start appearing given that they're joining H and A ranks.

You don't think evoker players wanna see their armor in dragon form? I've seen lots of players asking for armor even for evokers.

But blizzard doesn't need to do that. Leave it as is for evokers and other classes. That's part of the fantasy for all dragons right? Whether a an evoker or not they don't have typical armor.

And if that bothers you as a player then obviously don't roll a dracthyr then... It wouldn't bother me. Especially if I have the option to freely Morpho from visage to dragon form at will. The dragon form has plenty of customization options anyway.

Dracthyr are not like vanilla dragons, I dunno why you compare the two like they're one and the same. Dragons don't have opsable thumbs last I checked. Dracthyr do

[Snufflupagus]

Panda DKs took a loooong time, fellas.

[Teriz]

The only reason it makes no sense now is because dracthyr haven't gotten the chance to be other classes. But that won't be the case now that they've rejoined the world. Seems like the time frame from an expansion is long enough to have them start appearing given that they're joining H and A ranks.

You don't think evoker players wanna see their armor in dragon form? I've seen lots of players asking for armor even for evokers.

You seem to be missing the point here; Standard WoW armor and weaponry does not work on the Dracthyr forms, and classes like Warriors, Rogues, Shaman, DKs, etc. demand the player model to show armor and weaponry at all times.

But blizzard doesn't need to do that. Leave it as is for evokers and other classes. That's part of the fantasy for all dragons right? Whether a an evoker or not they don't have typical armor.

Yes they do! If you're making a race compatible with Warriors or Rogues, that race HAS to be able to show weapons and armor.

And if that bothers you as a player then obviously don't roll a dracthyr then... It wouldn't bother me.

Again, that is NOT a viable solution to the problems with giving this race the option to be other classes.

Dracthyr are not like vanilla dragons, I dunno why you compare the two like they're one and the same. Dragons don't have opsable thumbs last I checked. Dracthyr do

I compare the two because the Dracthyr were literally designed to give the player the ability to play as a dragon. The race gives the player the body of a dragon, the evoker class gives the player the abilities of a dragon. They're two sides of a whole, which is why it is a bizarre idea to make one side something that has nothing to do with the other. Dracthyr Evokers were simply not designed that way.

[Varx]

You seem to be missing the point here; Standard WoW armor and weaponry does not work on the Dracthyr forms, and classes like Warriors, Rogues, Shaman, DKs, etc. demand the player model to show armor and weaponry at all times.



Yes they do! If you're making a race compatible with Warriors or Rogues, that race HAS to be able to show weapons and armor.



Again, that is NOT a viable solution to the problems with giving this race the option to be other classes.



I compare the two because the Dracthyr were literally designed to give the player the ability to play as a dragon. The race gives the player the body of a dragon, the evoker class gives the player the abilities of a dragon. They're two sides of a whole, which is why it is a bizarre idea to make one side something that has nothing to do with the other. Dracthyr Evokers were simply not designed that way.

Dude weapons do work on dracthyr....

Where is the demand anywhere that says you need to show armor on a dracthyr if it was a warrior? On other races sure. But not on a dracthyr. Why does that bother you so much.

Theres nothing wrong with dracthyr warriors not having armor in their dragon form. They'd clearly still get the same benefit the same way mechagnomes do.

Reason: MAGIC.

What does matter is weapons, which even now they can use in dragon form.

Yeah sure, but then even in the lore, not ever dracthyr is an evoker. Which means in the lore eventually H and A dracs will be pursing those alternate paths.

You seem to ignore that it just claim that blizzard simply won't do it because DH still only have 2 races.

It took panadren 4 expansions to become DKs, while DF is the 3rd expansion since legion.

Give it time my dude.

I'm not saying to give dracthyr other classes now. But it will eventually happen. Just how pnadaren eventually became DKs with a new lore scenario to justify it.

Same with non dracthyr evokers.

How?

A council of dracthyr evokers empowers mortal races to use their abilities.

To use abilities that require dracthyr anatomy the human evoker, or w/e other race, manifest a draconic ethereal form that allows them to do said abilities.

Like how DH morph into meta to cast eye beam.

Then turn back to normal after the end of the spell.

Each. Race could have a different colored dragon form. Like a voidy one for velves, or a red and black for orcs.

[Teriz]

Dude weapons do work on dracthyr....

They don't sheathe, they disappear, which breaks immersion, and is frankly lame. Also armor doesn't work on the model. You may be fine with a bipedal dragon with limited armor swinging weapons that vanish out of combat, but the vast majority of players will not.

And what's worse, that's the best case scenario.

Where is the demand anywhere that says you need to show armor on a dracthyr if it was a warrior? On other races sure. But not on a dracthyr. Why does that bother you so much.

Are you seriously going to argue that a Warrior or Rogue player doesn't care about their armor or gear? That's kind of the point of those classes.

Theres nothing wrong with dracthyr warriors not having armor in their dragon form. They'd clearly still get the same benefit the same way mechagnomes do.

Mechagnomes are also the least played race in the game.

You seem to ignore that it just claim that blizzard simply won't do it because DH still only have 2 races.p

No, I'm saying Blizzard won't do it because the payoff isn't worth the effort.

It took panadren 4 expansions to become DKs, while DF is the 3rd expansion since legion.

Which is completely irrelevant on multiple levels. Nothing stopped Pandaren from being DKs except a lore issue. We're talking about multiple mechanical issues standing in the way of giving Dracthry other classes.

[Varx]

They don't sheathe, they disappear, which breaks immersion, and is frankly lame. Also armor doesn't work on the model. You may be fine with a bipedal dragon with limited armor swinging weapons that vanish out of combat, but the vast majority of players will not.

And what's worse, that's the best case scenario.



Are you seriously going to argue that a Warrior or Rogue player doesn't care about their armor or gear? That's kind of the point of those classes.



Mechagnomes are also the least played race in the game.



No, I'm saying Blizzard won't do it because the payoff isn't worth the effort.



Which is completely irrelevant on multiple levels. Nothing stopped Pandaren from being DKs except a lore issue. We're talking about multiple mechanical issues standing in the way of giving Dracthry other classes.

It's not a mechanical issue. It's a taste issue with players.

Look if an evoker doesn't wear armor in dragon form then a warrior not wearing armor in dragon form is fine too.

I'm pretty damn sure there will be players who still race change since they still get to play a freaking dragon. And those who don't care for it don't have to.

As for the unsheathing. Back items like kyr wings cause the same issue and blizzard keep making special back pieces.

Plus just give them a special sheathing animation where the weapon or shield dematerialize in dragon magic. Like how zovaal summons his mace right before his fight. There you go.

If armor was such a big deal then they would have allowed evoker to have armor then. And I've seen plenty of threads asking for that.

So if they're cool With armorless evokers then they'd be cool with armorless warrior's in dragon form.

You gonna tell me the cost to open up more drac classes won't pay off in race change revenue?

Come on man...

[Teriz]

It's not a mechanical issue. It's a taste issue with players.

Deciding between an Orc Warrior or a Tauren warrior is a matter of taste. Your weapons having to vanish completely because of massive clipping with the racial model is a mechanical issue.

Look if an evoker doesn't wear armor in dragon form then a warrior not wearing armor in dragon form is fine too.

Look at Wrathion, Kalecgos, or Alexstraza in dragon form. See much armor on them? Now look at Saurfang, Varian, or Garrosh. See armor and weapons everywhere? I do.

I'm pretty damn sure there will be players who still race change since they still get to play a freaking dragon. And those who don't care for it don't have to.

You play an Evoker if you want to be a dragon, not a warrior.

As for the unsheathing. Back items like kyr wings cause the same issue and blizzard keep making special back pieces.

Back items =\= physical attribute of the race.

If armor was such a big deal then they would have allowed evoker to have armor then. And I've seen plenty of threads asking for that.

Again, dragons don’t need to wear armor or wield weapons. Warriors and Rogues do.

[Nightshade711]

So you view optional Barbershop gear as actual armor?

Okay.....

Yes… I view armor as armor.

As for the class itself, last I checked, the Evoker has the abilities of actual dragons. I'm pretty sure that was the class you were railing against for several months before the reveal.

Last I recall I wanted a class that let us use dragon magic and a Drakonid/humanoid dragonkin race to go alongside it.
Seems like I got both of those.

Again, if Blizzard ever intended for Dracthyr to be other classes, they'd be other classes now. With that said, I'm not going to waste time trying to convince you otherwise.

They’ve already said they’re not other classes now because lore wise it doesn’t make sense because of their starting zone.
But Ion himself already said that Dracthyr can become other classes after DF when they’d likely be rolled into Exile’s reach.
Just like everything else about the Dracthyr you’ll be proven wrong.

One big problem you're going to have is getting gear unto the Dracthyr model. 2H weapons, Shields, Cloaks, and other gear clip with the wings and the tail right off the bat. I don't see Blizzard wasting time fixing that issue, especially when the Dracthyr work just fine as being only Evokers.

This already isn’t an issue on the Alpha.

If so many players cared about “seeing their weapons all the time” then people would be complaining about the special back pieces yet I don’t see any complaints.

Also Dracthyr rogues will be able to see their weapons all the time anyways, as they don’t use 2H weapons. They’re sheathed on the hip which is always visible on a Dracthyr.

[Teriz]

Last I recall I wanted a class that let us use dragon magic and a Drakonid/humanoid dragonkin race to go alongside it.
Seems like I got both of those.

Really? That’s not what you said here;

While I doubt it’ll happen
I’d like it if they did 1&2 together.

We haven’t had a new, unique race since MoP so I would be surprised if we didn’t get a new unique race next expansion. (Still could go the AR route with having to unlock them, but I’d still prefer them to be a core race that you can play from the start)

For classes for the Drakonid race, we’d certainly have:
Warriors, Hunters, Mages, Shamans & Druids (Dragonsworn too obv if they’re added)
But I could easily see Rogues, Monks, and DKs being a thing too.

Paladins/priests probably wouldn’t be a thing unless/until an eventual Light/Void expansion bc Velen had visions of the dragons fighting in the Army of the Light, which would logically include their followers like the Dragonspawn/Drakonids/other Dragonkin

https://www.mmo-champion.com/threads...vs-Dragonborne

And if anyone was confused, this was #1;

Essentially Dragonsworn are mortals who pledge their allegiance to dragons, and in doing so are granting powers and abilities from their sworn dragonflight. So a mortal sworn to the Blue dragonflight would get arcane powers, while a mortal sworn to the bronze dragonflight would get temporal powers. One major example of Dragonsworn are the Timewalkers from the Timless Isle who showed up in MoP.

The Dracthyr are nothing like that at all.

They’ve already said they’re not other classes now because lore wise it doesn’t make sense because of their starting zone.
But Ion himself already said that Dracthyr can become other classes after DF when they’d likely be rolled into Exile’s reach.

Yeah, he literally never said that.

This already isn’t an issue on the Alpha.

If so many players cared about “seeing their weapons all the time” then people would be complaining about the special back pieces yet I don’t see any complaints.

There’s a difference between options and mechanical limitations.

Also Dracthyr rogues will be able to see their weapons all the time anyways, as they don’t use 2H weapons. They’re sheathed on the hip which is always visible on a Dracthyr.

Incorrect. There are some daggers and 1h swords that sheathe in the back of the model.

[Varx]

Deciding between an Orc Warrior or a Tauren warrior is a matter of taste. Your weapons having to vanish completely because of massive clipping with the racial model is a mechanical issue.



Look at Wrathion, Kalecgos, or Alexstraza in dragon form. See much armor on them? Now look at Saurfang, Varian, or Garrosh. See armor and weapons everywhere? I do.



You play an Evoker if you want to be a dragon, not a warrior.



Back items =\= physical attribute of the race.




Again, dragons don’t need to wear armor or wield weapons. Warriors and Rogues do.

Weapons vanishing aren't an issue that way you're describing it. Again, just all it magic.

The aspects aren't evokers my dude....

As far as we know the aspects aren't any classes.

Evokers are classes which is why people wanna see armor on dracthyr like any other playable race and class.

However, I'm on you're boat in NOT letting them have armor in dragon form as long as you have more freedom than worgen to fight in your human form. Play as you wish.

Not everyone wants to be a dracthyr evoker. You're projecting.

Some people wanna play a draconic warrior too.

You wanna play the FULL dragon experience then sure roll a drac evoker. But not everyone would want that.

Dude please, it's the same. Back pieces are just as real as physical attributes. If it's so immersive breaking them again blizz can make special magical sheathing animations like dematerializing you're 2 hander or shield.

Tell that to warriors in loin cloths. All that matters are weapons and dracthyr are more than capable to wield a sword.

[Ielenia]

Why does this keep getting brought up over and over again?

This is incredibly ironic coming from you. People like a concept and want to talk about it. This shouldn't be that alien an idea to you, Teriz, considering your behavior toward tech classes year after year after year.

Will it be for the final patch of DF or maybe at the start of 11.0? Who knows but it's more than certain.

It's not certain. It's possible, but nowhere near "certain".

That being said, what classes will dracthyr have, assuming blizzard doesn't open up all classes to all races....

I'd still keep the choices limited to the dragonflights' themes, so my picks would be:
• Warrior (because a 'perfect soldier army' needs frontline fighters);
• Mages (because dragons are masters of magic);
• Druids (because the green dragonflight is deeply connected with druidism).

Limited, yes, but the other classes don't really fit the dragons' themes, in my opinion. Shaman, paladin, rogue, hunter, warlock, priest... none really fit really well to the themes, but with my picks, at least we have two tank classes and two healer classes as options. I think it's decent enough. This is still 300% more classes for the race than what we're getting, too.

Also, fun useless fact I noticed after making this list, but this would also mean the dracthyr would get one class for each armor type. :P

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Again, the weapons disappearing when sheathed is a huge problem, as is the draconic Dracthyr form not being able to properly wear standard armor.

It's nowhere near the problem you think it is. In fact, it's not a problem at all, because that already exists in the game, in the form of the Covenants' special back transmogs. Look:



I clearly have a weapon equipped, a two-handed weapon, and yet it clearly doesn't show on my character's back, because of the back transmog.

And can you guess the number of people complaining their weapons don't show on their back because of their back transmog?

[Varx]

This is incredibly ironic coming from you. People like a concept and want to talk about it. This shouldn't be that alien an idea to you, Teriz, considering your behavior toward tech classes year after year after year.


It's not certain. It's possible, but nowhere near "certain".


I'd still keep the choices limited to the dragonflights' themes, so my picks would be:
• Warrior (because a 'perfect soldier army' needs frontline fighters);
• Mages (because dragons are masters of magic);
• Druids (because the green dragonflight is deeply connected with druidism).

Limited, yes, but the other classes don't really fit the dragons' themes, in my opinion. Shaman, paladin, rogue, hunter, warlock, priest... none really fit really well to the themes, but with my picks, at least we have two tank classes and two healer classes as options. I think it's decent enough. This is still 300% more classes for the race than what we're getting, too.

Also, fun useless fact I noticed after making this list, but this would also mean the dracthyr would get one class for each armor type. :P

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It's nowhere near the problem you think it is. In fact, it's not a problem at all, because that already exists in the game, in the form of the Covenants' special back transmogs. Look:



I clearly have a weapon equipped, a two-handed weapon, and yet it clearly doesn't show on my character's back, because of the back transmog.

And can you guess the number of people complaining their weapons don't show on their back because of their back transmog?

They have to be at least war, mage, priest, hunter and rouge since those are the classes that'll be available to everyone starting DF.

As for druid, yes due to the green flight.

Paladin must be one, because of of the dragon's reverence to Tyr. There's even multiple statues with a female Titan keeper holding up the Silver Hand around Tyrhold.

Shaman,I'd say yes but with the entire fiasco with the primalists then perhaps not.

Though, I'd say just open up all classes at this point. They did mention that was a goal anyway.

The only combo I have an issue for are warlock and DH maghar.

[Teriz]

Weapons vanishing aren't an issue that way you're describing it. Again, just all it magic.

It certainly is an issue. You’re simply ignoring it because it doesn’t bother YOU. You’re also ignoring the fact that Dracthyr can’t fully wear equippable armor, something else a Warrior or Rogue would want to display. Remember all those threads where people were whining about the Dracthyr not showing armor? No biggie since they’re dragons, huge issue if you make them other classes that are more gear dependent.

The aspects aren't evokers my dude....

They’re all dragons.

As far as we know the aspects aren't any classes.

Evokers have the powers and abilities of the aspects, so that should tell you something.

Evokers are classes which is why people wanna see armor on dracthyr like any other playable race and class.

Some people do. If you look at the “show your dracthyr” thread, many people have their Dracthyr not wearing armor at all. Why? Because you’re playing as a dragon, not a warrior, a rogue, a shaman, etc.

Not everyone wants to be a dracthyr evoker. You're projecting.

If you don’t want to be an Evoker, you don’t want to be a Dracthyr.

[Ielenia]

They have to be at least war, mage, priest, hunter and rouge since those are the classes that'll be available to everyone starting DF.

They don't have to. The simple fact that Evoker is restricted to a single class shows that is not a "mandatory requirement". New races don't "have to be" available to every class that is available to all the other races. Keep in mind that, back in TBC, blood elves couldn't be warriors, despite that class being available to all the other races.

Paladin must be one, because of of the dragon's reverence to Tyr. There's even multiple statues with a female Titan keeper holding up the Silver Hand around Tyrhold.

I don't think dragons revere Tyr. If it's something new in Dragonflight, it's something that's been retconned in, as far as I know.

Shaman,I'd say yes but with the entire fiasco with the primalists then perhaps not.

Dragons are no longer connected to the elemental plane, which is "one half" of the shaman concept, plus they have no connections with the spirits, which is the "other half".

[Teriz]

I clearly have a weapon equipped, a two-handed weapon, and yet it clearly doesn't show on my character's back, because of the back transmog.

And can you guess the number of people complaining their weapons don't show on their back because of their back transmog?

Once again, you’re comparing an optional customization to a mechanical limitation. You can always not use that item, and your weapons will show just fine. The Dracthyr cannot show sheathed weapons, shields, cloaks, etc. on their backs at all, ever.

[Ielenia]

Once again, you’re comparing an optional customization to a mechanical limitation. You can always not use that item, and your weapons will show just fine. The Dracthyr cannot show sheathed weapons, shields, cloaks, etc. on their backs at all, ever.

Irrelevant. Because if your claim was true, that "people want to see their weapons sheathed on heir dracthyr's backs", then people would be having that exact same complaint toward those back transmog pieces. "I want to see my weapon on my back with that transmog!" But no one is complaining.

There is also the fact we have many quests and world quests that force a back piece on you, such as backpacks (like in the Maldraxxus WQ "Further Gelatinous Research" and the Zereth-Mortis WQ "Save the Vombata") that makes your weapon disappear when sheathed onto your back. And, again: no one is complaining.

Which means your claims are meaningless. Because no one would complain. At least, not enough people to make it worth a fuss.

[Nightshade711]

Once again, you’re comparing an optional customization to a mechanical limitation. You can always not use that item, and your weapons will show just fine. The Dracthyr cannot show sheathed weapons, shields, cloaks, etc. on their backs at all, ever.

I fail to see your point, it’d also optional to be a Dracthyr warrior?

I don’t see why you think it’s so bad to hide weapons… which Dracthyr already do for their Evoker’s staves, 2H axes/swords/maces…

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Yeah, he literally never said that.

https://www.wowhead.com/news/dragonf...lessons-326775

Will the Dracthyr be able to become other classes in the future?

It's definitely possible down the line. I think it's exceedingly unlikely that any race other than Dracthyr could ever been an Evoker because you need wings, you need the ability to literally breath Draconic energy to perform any of the abilities. The Dracthyr that we're meeting are all Evokers because that's what they were created by Neltharion to be. That is their unique gift, they can channel the power of all the Dragonflights and this is who they are. Now as they emerge in Azeroth and integrate with the Alliance and Horde over time, could they learn to pick up an axe and be a great warrior, quite possibly, but that's not where their story is starting in Dragonflight.

[Teriz]

Irrelevant. Because if your claim was true, that "people want to see their weapons sheathed on heir dracthyr's backs", then people would be having that exact same complaint toward those back transmog pieces. "I want to see my weapon on my back with that transmog!" But no one is complaining.

Uh no. Again, it's an item that you can remove from your character at any time. If you get tired of not seeing your weapons, you can simply swap out the item. if you get tired of not seeing your weapons on your Dracthyr, you're stuck with it unless you want to reroll.

There is also the fact we have many quests and world quests that force a back piece on you, such as backpacks (like in the Maldraxxus WQ "Further Gelatinous Research" and the Zereth-Mortis WQ "Save the Vombata") that makes your weapon disappear when sheathed onto your back. And, again: no one is complaining.

Again, because it's temporary. You're comparing a temporary situation to a permanent one.

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I fail to see your point, it’d also optional to be a Dracthyr warrior?

Except choosing a Dracthyr Warrior would be far more consequential than you picking up an item.

I don’t see why you think it’s so bad to hide weapons… which Dracthyr already do for their Evoker’s staves, 2H axes/swords/maces…

Because the point of the Evoker is to be a dragon, or a monster without weapons or armor. So it's not a problem for them to not show weapons or armor, that's sort of the point. Warriors, Rogues, Shaman, etc. are a different matter entirely.

https://www.wowhead.com/news/dragonf...lessons-326775

"It's definitely possible" =/= "Its going to happen"