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  1. #121
    Perhaps now people will have to make sure they stockpile their own mats and do some actual work.
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  2. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by fatgunn View Post
    A SERVICE?! Nice service when all the flasks on a server are priced so high as to be functionally unusable. When all the herbs are being bought by the people making flasks and are equally ridiculous in prices.
    Make a druid alt with herbalism/alchemy, fly around for half an hour and make your own flasks/pots? I never understood anyone complaining about high consumable prices when it is so easy to self supply. Heck fly around half an hour more and sell the stuff if it was so horrendously expensive on your realm.

  3. #123
    High Overlord Moi2003's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Djuntas View Post
    Bro, have you been on wow economy reddit. My 36 million is laughable small. I dont even sell lego's in SL.

    All the people who qouted me are just casuals who know nothing about wow economy, professions or much about the games history.
    Just out of curiosity, What's the point in having that much gold ?

  4. #124
    Quote Originally Posted by fatgunn View Post
    A SERVICE?! Nice service when all the flasks on a server are priced so high as to be functionally unusable. When all the herbs are being bought by the people making flasks and are equally ridiculous in prices. Not needing an alchemist? Most groups needed dedicated alchemists and herbers because otherwise there was no way for them to reasonably have flasks/pots. It shouldn't cost 15k+ gold for a night of raid consumables for ONE PERSON. That's 1-2 wow tokens a night for a guild to raid. That is ridiculous.


    Don't piss on me and call it rain.
    A lot of people don't want to farm herbs or play with tradeskills at all. I sure as heck don't find it riveting to afk for 40 minutes crafting potions. I do it because playing markets is fun, and it's fun enough for enough people that I've never had any issue having a guild where multiple people could potentially supply cauldrons.

    What is your solution? Fuck anyone ever being able to make real money through farming or crafting because you can't handle the idea of someone having more gold than you? You might as well be saying we should eliminate mom and pop operations because how dare someone move from lower to middle class off their own effort and ingenuity. No one should be allowed to run a profitable and successful business, that'll solve everything!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Moi2003 View Post
    Just out of curiosity, What's the point in having that much gold ?
    Buying tokens with change to spare for other things. Buying rare mounts and toys. Helping friends or supplying your guild. Making your own business venture more profitable to secure a reasonably steady income. Really the same shit that people do with money IRL. Fun, Charity, and Business.

  5. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by Goatfish View Post
    I don't think you understand what price gouging means. All I want is to be paid fairly for the time I spend. If we translate to real money value using tokens, it's as if I am making around $0.50 per hour. I could work one more hour of actual work and just buy a token and get way more value for my time. At least in a volatile market you have the ability to potentially make enough gold that the whole process doesn't feel like a waste of time.
    I do understand what price gouging means. It means you want set a unfairly high price due to greed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goatfish View Post
    Playing the WoW economy was a bit more than pressing two buttons. It's observing market trends, making projections, looking for sales. Now the whole game has changed and it's just making sure you don't list anything in the short amount of time it takes for some absolute tool to crash the market price. Forcibly resetting a price isn't even a viable option unless you're one of those nerds with multiple gold caps. As I've put it before, it effectively brought Walmart into the small town marketplace and now everyone gets to play on razor thin margins with the people getting screwed the hardest being the common farmer and the beginner business
    That isn't how this AH works. IN fact, you and the other prices gougers were controlling hte market and keeping prices high. Now that you have fare more people selling goods, it is a lot harder for you to control the market and keep prices up. This helps the consumer as they can now purchase good for far cheaper and it is far more a free market.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goatfish View Post
    Glad you agree with me on the McD's thing. You can indeed start at fast food and work your way up over 30 years, but the point is that you work your way up. Telling people to go do weeklies to make gold is pretending the burger flipper never moved into management and is still going to end his life with a comfortable nest egg. Sure, you can probably afford your regular bills doing that, but good fucking luck ever buying one of the expensive ass mounts or toys Bliz decided to put in the game.
    So you admit you are lazy and want gold handed to you? It's this form of entitlement that is ruining society. Everyone wants everything handed to them and do not want to put any of their own effort into it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Goatfish View Post
    I don't really understand what you're big issue is with people being able to avoid doing the same daily/weekly quests for eternity is. Shouldn't you be happy that people have found a way to avoid doing content they don't like and spend more time doing the content they actually want to do? Shouldn't you be happy that some people spend their time turning otherwise useless herbs into flasks for you to use so you don't need to have an alchemist unless you want one? Fuck man, only on these forums do I see people screeching at how just fucking awful it is that some people can be successful at providing a service to the community.
    What I want is fairly priced goods and as long as we have greedy whales like you being able to control the market, we don't get that. Thanks to these changes, we get those reasonable prices. We don't care that you are successful. We have a problem with you being excessively greedy while doing it and making it so less people can actually afford it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Djuntas View Post
    Bro, have you been on wow economy reddit. My 36 million is laughable small. I dont even sell lego's in SL.

    All the people who qouted me are just casuals who know nothing about wow economy, professions or much about the games history.
    LOL reddit. That is not a legit source. Your 36 million is not laughably small as the great majority of palyers have nowhere near that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Goatfish View Post
    A lot of people don't want to farm herbs or play with tradeskills at all. I sure as heck don't find it riveting to afk for 40 minutes crafting potions. I do it because playing markets is fun, and it's fun enough for enough people that I've never had any issue having a guild where multiple people could potentially supply cauldrons.

    What is your solution? Fuck anyone ever being able to make real money through farming or crafting because you can't handle the idea of someone having more gold than you? You might as well be saying we should eliminate mom and pop operations because how dare someone move from lower to middle class off their own effort and ingenuity. No one should be allowed to run a profitable and successful business, that'll solve everything!
    Ironic that you claim you are getting F'd over when you are F'ing over many consumers by keeping prices ridiculously high due to your own greed.

    Nobody gives a damn how much gold you have. What we do give a damn about is keeping prices fair for everyone. You just care about your greed and feeling superior to everyone else as if making the most gold in a game makes you special. It does not.

  6. #126
    Another pointless cross realm degeneracy, I mean feature.

    Merging the servers apparently is harder than creating all these things. Even though they recently merged them in Classic, but won't do it in Retail because?

    Nobody would need garbage like this if everybody played on a big, healthy server.

  7. #127
    Quote Originally Posted by Moi2003 View Post
    Just out of curiosity, What's the point in having that much gold ?
    Well in my case I need it to collect items in WoW. Prolly spend like 30-40 million since WOD on various things.
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  8. #128
    Quote Originally Posted by enigma77 View Post
    Another pointless cross realm degeneracy, I mean feature.

    Merging the servers apparently is harder than creating all these things. Even though they recently merged them in Classic, but won't do it in Retail because?

    Nobody would need garbage like this if everybody played on a big, healthy server.
    YOu have no idea what kind of a mess putting all players in retail on one server would cause would you?

    Also, Classic had FAR less servers that retail does .

    This change was fine. SOunds like someone who is salty they can't gouge people for easy gold anymore.

  9. #129
    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    YOu have no idea what kind of a mess putting all players in retail on one server would cause would you?

    Also, Classic had FAR less servers that retail does .

    This change was fine. SOunds like someone who is salty they can't gouge people for easy gold anymore.
    Obviously you wouldn't put all players on one server. You'd put them on as many servers as necessary, to ensure each one is a high/full server.

    And no I only have 40k gold, that does not factor into my opinion whatsoever.

  10. #130
    Quote Originally Posted by rrayy View Post
    <snip>

    Nobody gives a damn how much gold you have. What we do give a damn about is keeping prices fair for everyone. You just care about your greed and feeling superior to everyone else as if making the most gold in a game makes you special. It does not.
    Let's keep this real simple, just answer these 3 questions for me since you're so damn sure of yourself that you want to demonize anyone who wants to make any profit ever.

    What is the magical "fair price" that base goods should be sold for?

    What is the exact profit margin that you think people should be allowed to make?

    How did you decide to come up with the above 2 numbers that makes you so damn sure that it's better than a free market where people decide how much to buy and sell things for?

  11. #131
    Elemental Lord callipygoustp's Avatar
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    Man, I am rolling in the gold since this change had occurred!

  12. #132
    Quote Originally Posted by Goatfish View Post
    What is the magical "fair price" that base goods should be sold for?
    The fair price would be when there is a good balanced supply and demand. Not on smaller servers where you have a couple of mongoloids buying all of the supply to keep prices artificially high.

  13. #133
    Pit Lord Dristereau's Avatar
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    Still think this a bad feature even a few weeks on. Kind of makes some professions feel pretty pointless as there's next to no profit margin for Enchanting in Shadowlands and most other commodity based professions. In most cases now I'm mainly trying to get rid of mats as prices drop as more and more items flood the market and people keep undercutting, often despite items selling extremely quickly.

    I usually like to have an Enchanter/Alchemist to supply my main with Enchants/Consumables going into a new Expansion as I feel one of the best ways to profit in the past has been to be self-sufficient. Looking at Dragonflight I don't really know if it matters as the amount of Mats/Consumables being loaded onto the AH will quickly lower prices to reasonable and then cheap value. Using the larger servers I played Alts on (Silvermoon/Tarren-Mill) the profit margins on those Servers already was somewhat small with 9.2.5 and the merger of the Region just removed it.

    I'm not stressing for gold, I have enough to buy anything I really want. But that doesn't mean I feel that part of the game should be ruined when a much better fix would be additional realm connections. Then again Blizzard is profitting from letting Servers fall to a state of garbage, as our Guild is currently moving to Silvermoon because of how dead Shadowsong has become and a lack of support since Aszune connected to it back in 2014. It's quite obvious to me that connecting realms to a point of having a few mega servers with populations similar to Silvermoon, Kazzak and Tarren-Mill would be a much better solution of players, especially seeing their work with Classic and closing off most of the dead servers.
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  14. #134
    Quote Originally Posted by Smashfist View Post
    The fair price would be when there is a good balanced supply and demand. Not on smaller servers where you have a couple of mongoloids buying all of the supply to keep prices artificially high.
    So what number is that? What should farmers be getting paid for the mats they provide and other people buy to craft into usable items for other players? How much should those other players be allowed to upcharge their service of crafting?

    I can't speak for all the servers obviously, but the only time I saw people doing price resets (on both low and high pop servers) is when the finished product was selling for less than the cost of materials, or the price of materials dropped so low that it was no longer worth farming them for reasonable profit for your time. You people must have some number in mind of what peoples time is worth because ya'll are getting so offended at the idea of someone intelligently playing the market to make money.

    Novel idea, if the price is too high you can either make your own or just not buy it. We're talking very beginner level economics here, but some people who haven't even considered the very basics of running your own business and how supply chains work think they know better. Just a bunch of "eat the rich" and "How dare someone make money" buffoons that feel a sense of self-righteousness in wanting to ruin the economy.

  15. #135
    Quote Originally Posted by fatgunn View Post
    A SERVICE?! Nice service when all the flasks on a server are priced so high as to be functionally unusable. When all the herbs are being bought by the people making flasks and are equally ridiculous in prices. Not needing an alchemist? Most groups needed dedicated alchemists and herbers because otherwise there was no way for them to reasonably have flasks/pots. It shouldn't cost 15k+ gold for a night of raid consumables for ONE PERSON. That's 1-2 wow tokens a night for a guild to raid. That is ridiculous.


    Don't piss on me and call it rain.
    Verifiably false. Flask prices went down with the regional merger and are much more affordable now. Don't call it piss when it is most definitely not.

  16. #136
    Quote Originally Posted by Goatfish View Post
    Let's keep this real simple, just answer these 3 questions for me since you're so damn sure of yourself that you want to demonize anyone who wants to make any profit ever.

    What is the magical "fair price" that base goods should be sold for?

    What is the exact profit margin that you think people should be allowed to make?

    How did you decide to come up with the above 2 numbers that makes you so damn sure that it's better than a free market where people decide how much to buy and sell things for?
    Isn't an AH merge the ultimate in free market economy?

  17. #137
    Quote Originally Posted by Otimus View Post
    Isn't an AH merge the ultimate in free market economy?
    Yep. The auction house goblins just don't want to admit that within their servers they were able to operate monopolies and cartels to insure profits.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mardux View Post
    Verifiably false. Flask prices went down with the regional merger and are much more affordable now. Don't call it piss when it is most definitely not.
    I was clearly talking about the costs pre-merge...

    Quote Originally Posted by Goatfish View Post
    So what number is that? What should farmers be getting paid for the mats they provide and other people buy to craft into usable items for other players? How much should those other players be allowed to upcharge their service of crafting?


    Novel idea, if the price is too high you can either make your own or just not buy it. We're talking very beginner level economics here, but some people who haven't even considered the very basics of running your own business and how supply chains work think they know better. Just a bunch of "eat the rich" and "How dare someone make money" buffoons that feel a sense of self-righteousness in wanting to ruin the economy.
    The number is what the market settles on. More competition = lower prices. Don't like it, oh well. The only people crying over the changes are the poor goblins who read an intro to macroeconomics book and decided they were the Jeff Bezos of Moonguard.
    Last edited by fatgunn; 2022-09-04 at 06:16 AM.

  18. #138
    Quote Originally Posted by Goatfish View Post
    Also if you're advice to people is to do weekly and daily quests to make money... I mean... that's like telling someone that getting a job at McDonalds is the path to becoming a millionaire. At some point you want to invest, either in stocks/trade goods (buy low, sell high) or in a personal business with outside suppliers (trade skill flipping). It is possible to make some decent money in supply side, but really only in limited markets. By opening the markets up globally, Bliz has shit all over farmers as well, they really got the worst of it even if things sell fast.
    Flipping (both WoW and IRL) is one of the scummiest ways to get rich. People who do that are literal leeches on the economy. At the very best, they bring no added value, but more often than not, their added value is negative (removing goods from the market in order to create artificial scarcity to drive the price up).

  19. #139
    Quote Originally Posted by h4rr0d View Post
    Flipping (both WoW and IRL) is one of the scummiest ways to get rich. People who do that are literal leeches on the economy. At the very best, they bring no added value, but more often than not, their added value is negative (removing goods from the market in order to create artificial scarcity to drive the price up).
    What do you think stock trading is?

    Quote Originally Posted by Otimus View Post
    Isn't an AH merge the ultimate in free market economy?
    When did I argue for a free market economy? I'm not a globalist, and think markets should be limited by region for regulation and management purposes. We currently do this to a degree by country, but I even think some of our stronger economies should fragment.

    Quote Originally Posted by fatgunn View Post
    The number is what the market settles on. More competition = lower prices. Don't like it, oh well. The only people crying over the changes are the poor goblins who read an intro to macroeconomics book and decided they were the Jeff Bezos of Moonguard.
    "Welp, that's just the market setting prices" is a pretty rich argument coming from someone who was just complaining about the market setting prices. You pretty clearly understand that this change fucked people over, but you enjoy it. No need to hide your sadistic glee in seeing people lose economic freedom and class mobility in the game. In the end, all that matters is that you get to buy cheap shit, I get it.

  20. #140
    The Unstoppable Force Kaleredar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goatfish View Post
    What do you think stock trading is?



    When did I argue for a free market economy? I'm not a globalist, and think markets should be limited by region for regulation and management purposes. We currently do this to a degree by country, but I even think some of our stronger economies should fragment.



    "Welp, that's just the market setting prices" is a pretty rich argument coming from someone who was just complaining about the market setting prices. You pretty clearly understand that this change fucked people over, but you enjoy it. No need to hide your sadistic glee in seeing people lose economic freedom and class mobility in the game. In the end, all that matters is that you get to buy cheap shit, I get it.
    The “fair” price of goods is such that most anyone can easily afford the necessary items to function at the level they wish to play the game at without much extra effort expended beyond them playing the game in that method. The market basically bottoming out allows more people to afford more things.

    And don’t give me some nonsense about the cost of labor or a man being entitled to the sweat of his brow or somesuch non-applicable tripe. This is a fantasy wizard game. You have no bills to pay in WoW or children to feed or mortgages to pay off. The only remotely equivocal expenditure is if you buy game time with gold via the WoW token, but… if you can no longer afford to do that, guess you’ll have to go back to shelling out 15 cold hard dollars… just like was necessary for most of WoW’s life.


    If I were still interested in making gold (I ground up the five million for the brutosaur in the final patch of bfa and stopped caring after that) then I’d simply shift my focus to the more obscure materials that are largely underexploited. I checked, and my old sources for gold when people would undercut the prices on osmenite or end-game bfa fish when I was doing the brutosaur farm are still selling for hundreds of gold each. So maybe try thinking outside the box.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Kaleredar is right...
    Words to live by.

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