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  1. #81
    Personal loot was the best thing ever and I'm not looking forward to this change esp need/greed rolls. I hope they have more staff/a better process for complaints.
    Member: Dragon Flight Alpha Club, Member since 7/20/22

  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by Agall View Post
    More BoEs means the whales are more likely to buy WoW tokens to purchase them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Echo of Soul View Post
    Bingo! You win
    More BoEs? Because for me it looks like an attempt to stop BoE farming raids and if the minibosses are locked behind some bosses in a raid that means there will be much less BoEs on the market.

  3. #83
    Epic!
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
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    Unda da bridge, mon
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    1,637
    PL is probably the best thing for a pug, honestly.
    No looting system will ever appease everyone, but at least all the rolls and such happened under the hood, so if someone got a thing, they just got it.
    Maybe there was someone asking for a trade if it was lower than current equip or whatever, but overall it wasn't much of a hassle.

    With rolling need/greed, it creates an extra layer of visible contention because, while PL was under the hood, need/greed is up front.
    Maybe some pugs will be friendly and truly not roll need on things they can't use, but I would venture a guess a fair bit of people will just click Need if it lights up, regardless of the drop in question, mainly because this was fairly common back in the day.

    The good thing is, no one can roll need on everything; it's restricted to class gear at least, so a mage isn't rolling on plate or anything.
    I hope they add class restrictions to loot with rolls as well, like how PL works, or you may have that ugly situation where a boss drops nothing useful, which is never fun.
    I'm sure everyone can recall the time a bow dropped when there were no hunters, or you got 2 of the same plate boots without a plate wearer in sight.

  4. #84
    People need to start actually reading the blue posts before saying the world is going to end.
    Group Loot only, is just for the coming test, not that it will be the only option when the game goes live. The expansion is in Beta, you know, the phase used for testing purposes?
    And they have been doing testing a slightly different way this time around. They focus on one specific thing at a time.

    Speculating a bit now... Since BoEs will function like currency from lieutenants work right now - the same reward, and only one time per week, regardless of dificulty cleared first, does this mean that BoE will all have the same ilvl regardless of what difficulty it drops from?

  5. #85
    Ilvl changes seem good.

    New BoEs seem fair.

    Group loot for everyone sounds good for most guilds, terrible for some other guilds, pugs and guild+pug groups. There's a reason raid loot was forced into personal for non-guild groups since Legion. The drama isn't fun for anyone, and this WILL cause lots of dramas when those high-ilvl unique items drop for example.
    It is all that is left unsaid upon which tragedies are built -Kreia

    The internet: where to every action is opposed an unequal overreaction.

  6. #86
    i'm assuming you won't be able to roll on items you can't use, if you can god help you if you're not in a guild.

  7. #87
    Couldn't be happier. Great move, Blizz.

  8. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by Othraerir View Post
    i'm assuming you won't be able to roll on items you can't use, if you can god help you if you're not in a guild.
    I'm also assuming that LFR is still personal loot as well?

    If they try to shoe-horn group loot in LFR I gotta go grab myself a few bags of popcorn. The shenanigans will be glorious.
    It is all that is left unsaid upon which tragedies are built -Kreia

    The internet: where to every action is opposed an unequal overreaction.

  9. #89
    A special bow from the Storm Incarnate herself, Raszageth
    Oh come the f**k on. Hunters just had a legendary bow as a drop and now they get another special drop?

  10. #90
    Mechagnome
    Join Date
    Apr 2022
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    North America
    Posts
    538
    Quote Originally Posted by Mamut View Post
    More BoEs? Because for me it looks like an attempt to stop BoE farming raids and if the minibosses are locked behind some bosses in a raid that means there will be much less BoEs on the market.
    "Lastly, we’d be placing more important items into the BoE pool. This could be anything from weapons to higher item-level pieces to make them more worthwhile to raiders."

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by SinR View Post
    Its possible there's actually less as people can't just go in and farm trash. They're only going to drop off mobs that are possibly locked after a boss or two, maybe in the trash on the way to the wing bosses.
    "Lastly, we’d be placing more important items into the BoE pool. This could be anything from weapons to higher item-level pieces to make them more worthwhile to raiders." More slots to fill with BoEs that are bis. More in this case has a double meaning, of variety and likely quantity as they're likely to be less rare and more deterministic in acquisition from this change.

  11. #91
    Once again, they don't get it. Personal loot was good for PUGs. The issue with it was that they forced everyone to use it, including organized guilds. It was a pain in the ass for guild runs, because the whole "hey I got this who wants it" "oh I can't trade it" routine was cumbersome and way less simple than a window to roll for crap. But that doesn't mean personal loot should be removed entirely! Just let guild groups choose to turn group loot on. Keep personal loot elsewhere. It's not a hard concept!

  12. #92
    This is horrendous.

    I can't wait to go on raids on end without loot cause of bad RNG and the lucky guys hoovering all the loot. As a raid, this will cause more drama and more headaches sorting loot.

    Why? Cause you are again making changes to address concerns of the 0.01% of top guild raiders while ignoring the other 99.9%. DO NOT do this. You just admitted how wrong it was to balance the game towards the top guilds on the last raid and here you are again, one raid later, making changes to suit them instead of the rest of the people who play this game.

    Stop right now. Screw that they can't sort their loot and can't have people trade. You don't have to screw everyone over because there is one case in which people can't trade something cause it's an ilvl upgrade. You solve that by having a range of ilvl that allows trading. You don't flip the table and bring back all the bad problems previous loot systems had.
    Stop... like seriously, stop this right now. It's not worth it. You will create a s**t storm for dragonflight and it's not what you need in your game right now.
    Last edited by Swnem; 2022-09-29 at 06:45 PM.

  13. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by Gasparde View Post

    PL got you your stuff and if you were lucky, you could get more. GL doesn't guarantee you your stuff. You can go an entire raid and not get a single item if you have unlucky rolls. This isn't even just remotely the same. This can and probably will easily bring GDKP into retail's PuG raiding scene again - because now there's 50 items per raid and you can probably roll on like 30 of them, whereas with PL you got 2 items... and that was it - so why the hell not abuse the hell out of that.
    I've gone entire raids only to receive a single item that was useless to me. And if my raid group had no other person that was eligible for the loot I wanted then that meant I wouldn't be able to receive loot from other people that didn't need loot. I think the new GL is better. Degens rolling need on stuff they don't need has always been a thing in this game.

  14. #94
    I can see a major exploit on the BoE lieutenants:
    - Clear the raid until the lieutenant (kill any bosses needed)
    - Switch to alts and kill lieutenant and get BoE:s
    - Reset the raid
    - Switch to new set of alts and kill lieutenant and get BoE:s
    ... repeat until out of alts and then clear with mains. Shouldn't be too hard since lieutenants so far have been pretty easy trash?

  15. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by cLax0n View Post
    I've gone entire raids only to receive a single item that was useless to me. And if my raid group had no other person that was eligible for the loot I wanted then that meant I wouldn't be able to receive loot from other people that didn't need loot. I think the new GL is better. Degens rolling need on stuff they don't need has always been a thing in this game.
    But it hasn't been a thing with PL.
    Keep PL, remove trading restrictions and you immediately circumvent all problems that GL in PuGs could ever bring with it.

  16. #96
    Isn't this just ML but with extra steps? (not counting pugs) Everyone who is not allowed to loot passes and the designated player needs. In short, loot council is back on again.

  17. #97
    I have to assume this doesnt apply to lfr, because that would be catastrophe.

  18. #98
    I really like the vault system in Shadowland.
    To bad, Blizzard changed the loot system again.

    The bonus roll doesn't help me much because I don't do enough daily to have enough tokens.

  19. #99
    Quote Originally Posted by jla View Post
    I can see a major exploit on the BoE lieutenants:
    - Clear the raid until the lieutenant (kill any bosses needed)
    - Switch to alts and kill lieutenant and get BoE:s
    - Reset the raid
    - Switch to new set of alts and kill lieutenant and get BoE:s
    ... repeat until out of alts and then clear with mains. Shouldn't be too hard since lieutenants so far have been pretty easy trash?
    This would only be possible on Heroic/Normal, but yeah. We've already seen BoE farms in the past so this will likely be a lucrative form of income creation early in the Tier, especially with Weapons potentially being on the BoE loot table. Later in the Tier they'll be near-worthless though.

    edit: New blue post says they're not gonna do BoE weapons.
    Last edited by Relapses; 2022-09-29 at 11:42 PM.

  20. #100
    Not forcing personal loot is good, but forcing group loot instead is the absolute wrong decision. Give players choices. Let the group choose if they want personal loot, group loot or master looter. I don't know why this is so difficult.

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