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  1. #81
    more is better than less...

  2. #82
    The Lightbringer Sanguinerd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    Shadowmoon is great, while court of stars is a bit odd I think it is fine, plus the profession bonuses are really cool.
    I suppose my dislike is also partly due to Court of Stars being part of the Legion timewalking thing for quite a while now.
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  3. #83
    It keeps things relatively fresh, rather than running the same 8 dungeons 100s of times each season.
    In the perfect world it would be brand new dungeons each season, but thats super unrealistic, so I am fine with it being half new and half old dungeons on rotation.

  4. #84
    While it's meh for people that ran them until their eyes bled in their respective expansions, it is slightly better than running the same 8 dungeons for the next 2 years, though not by much.

  5. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by Lolites View Post
    how the HELL is it laziness...
    in SL we get the 8 new dungeons and thats it, now we get 8 new AND 8+ (at least for s1 and s2) old, even if they just tune them it requires some work... so how is doing MORE laziness?!
    and sure, BFA had 10, Legion 9 (+vault which is rework so if you dont count reworks in DF you shouldnt in legion either), wod 8, mop actualy "only" 7+2...
    so its not like we are really getting less dungeons, with 7/8/9/10/8/8 seems like 8 new is kinda average...
    The comment makes sense because the solution they picked for M+ rotation is likely the easiest choice next to doing nothing.

    The content is created and ready to go but they are holding it back as a short-term solution to a bigger problem which is M+ is pretty shallow in design. As of now if you're able beat a dungeon at +15 in S1, then you'll probably be fine with it in any season because even the affixes don't change the dungeons that much. They need to develop a long-term solution that allows for more changes in the M+ seasons so it's not actually a pain to run the same dungeon for 2 seasons in a row.

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by Lolites View Post
    how the HELL is it laziness...
    in SL we get the 8 new dungeons and thats it, now we get 8 new AND 8+ (at least for s1 and s2) old, even if they just tune them it requires some work... so how is doing MORE laziness?!
    and sure, BFA had 10, Legion 9 (+vault which is rework so if you dont count reworks in DF you shouldnt in legion either), wod 8, mop actualy "only" 7+2...
    so its not like we are really getting less dungeons, with 7/8/9/10/8/8 seems like 8 new is kinda average...
    Lazy in that i expect more given the expertise when making a game for 18 years. Since you clearly read what i posted then you caught on to how they should remaster / remake dungeons not just tune up and call it BRAND NEW. It is also not 8 its 4 since 4 will be locked beyond the opening base mythic. Where is the 8 new dungeons for season 1? Oh yea its just 4.

    How about the same time and resources spent on raiding should be spent on dungeons.

  7. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by FelPlague View Post
    "1/2 older dungeons" that is what is is for dragonflight... This season it was all mega dungeons and then some sort dungeons we the players voted on, which is why it was mostly old dungeons.

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    I don't know what you are trying to say here.

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    So you want the exact same problem we have had since legion. 2 years of every new patch having to regrind the exact same dungeons for the exact same gear, cool, good thing they ain't listening to that and are giving us unique experiences each season by swapping out the dungeons and gear.

    Also idk what the fuck you are talking about when it comes to them designing dungeons for tournoment and not for players, what are you even talking about?

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    Bro, they can't make 8 new dungeons every single patch... Plus why make new dungeons, when some dungeons exist that lots of players literally have never ever done before, and the rest have never experienced in a m+ environment.

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    Yes, doing stuff you haven't done in 10 years is far more fresh then doing the same thing for 2 years in a row countless times.

    Cause yeah, eating a meal you had 10 weeks ago is far more fresh then eating that new recipe you found on tiktok 2 weeks ago and have been eating every single day since.

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    "Can't come up with more then 4 newly created dungeons" except they can.. they made 8... 4 willl be in m+ season 1, the other 4 in season 2 with both seasons also having 4 old dungeonsz so every season feels unique in the dungeons, and in the loot.

    So you really think they can pump out 8 dungeons a season to keep the dungeons and loot unique every season?

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    What do you mean they pick the worst ones so far? Grimrail and iron docks? Bro I fucking hate to dissapoinnt. But WE chose those.

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    They did this literally with legion timewalking and few if anyone touched them. People don't want that.

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    Dude, having to do atleast 16, +15s to complete the pool to get your ksm.is enough.
    I rather fucking now have it be 24 seperate runs. Meaning 12 runs every week atleast to try and get all of your seperate dungeon rankings up. Shadowlands with most of the expac having 10 was a massive drag.

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    Iits still the exact same dungeon with the exact same loot, just a slightly different path, if at all a different path.
    Which is why i said: "And adjusted ratings/KSM/etc. so that no one is disadvantaged by the additional 4 dungeons".

    The +15 thing is arbitrary anyway now thanks to gear scaling up to 2400 rating, lower it to +12 to account for there being more dungeons, or do some other shit to account for there being more dungeons. KSM is really a nonissue.
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  8. #88
    As a customer I don't like this at all.

    I don't appreciate paying new money for old content.

    I also worry about the precedent this sets. Is this a sign of things to come? New expansions just adds a paltry amount of new content, mixed in with a bunch of old content, that we pay full AAA price for?

  9. #89
    You're not getting less dungeons, you just don't have to grind the same m+ dungeons for 2 years, and farm the exact same bis items 3-4 times during the expansion. There's 8 dungeons at launch, same as Shadowlands, and they've said they'll add more later on. It's a matter of making the content less stale, while at the same time lowering the entry point for new and returning players, as they won't be lagging as much in dungeon knowledge and experience if they join in with season 2 or 3.

  10. #90
    Kinda split... I wouldn't mind three seasons with 4 new dungeons each season and 4 old ones.

  11. #91
    Scarab Lord Nymrohd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tentim View Post
    Kinda split... I wouldn't mind three seasons with 4 new dungeons each season and 4 old ones.
    I am honestly hoping to see two dungeons and a megadungeon (or TWO megadungeons!) added just like we had in Legion.

  12. #92
    I don't mind old dungeons being used as M+ content as long as tuning is right. The other issue I have with using old dungeons though, is that items that were ok back then can become game breaking and must have items in newer content due to system changes, in order for people to be the best. Most people will always strive towards the best gear especially when it is listed on Icy Veins and WoWhead as they are popular sites and easy to navigate.

    An example of this is are the rings in Mechagon. Everyone now wants to join Mechagon as the rings are quite powerful and if looking in the Dungeon finder tool there are more of the two available then anything else. Its especially more completed as there are four rings that can drop for anyone. I got my healing logic from a hunter. More thought about things like rings and trinkets need to be put in.

    This is again especailly noticable when legion timewalking comes up again for a couple of weeks when healers constantly want blackrook hold for the trinket and the dps ring from cout of stars I think it is. I think there are about five items that people farm.

    It always comes back to really the rings and trinkets. If they can be better targeted to specs it would help a lot. Weapons don't have such a big play at the moment, but when BfA dungeons are eventually put into the loop I can see all DPS who use two handers farming Geti'ikku, Cut of Death as the bleed effect was very powerful.
    Last edited by Bunta; 2022-10-16 at 09:50 AM.

  13. #93
    I’m not impressed by two more legion dungeons, especially considering that we have already revisited court of stars with tw. I’m fine, even excited by returning dungeons but they need to put more effort into adding more dungeons that we’ve never seen in keys.

  14. #94
    i think the only real L right now is that the new dungeons are split between two seasons instead of being in one season and the future seasons having a monthly rotation of one dungeon from each expac. it lets the players enjoy the new dungeons and then have a wide amount of variety of dungeons every month.

  15. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by matheney2k View Post
    Its proper planning so people don't feel burned out on the dungeons towards the latter half of the expansion.

    I agree with them and it gives us more ''new'' dungeons overall so win-win
    i mean if you rotate the dungeons every month with one from every expansion, the dungeons aren't really going to get stale feeling. i would think of the first season as "experience the new stuff!" and then the following seasons would have a lot more variety and once every dungeon has been adapted to the m+ system, it would just require a few tuning changes for every new season. the first season would give them time to get the first 10 or 20 dungeons prepared and ready and they should be able to get 10 more updated by the time the 2nd set of 10 would be out ideally. granted, one new dungeon would be included in the rotation so it's really 9 and not 10.

    i get what you're saying, i just think you're being a bit too conservative in this regard.

  16. #96
    Stood in the Fire Chilela's Avatar
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    On paper, I'm mostly fine with the system. Although IMO it should have been all the new dungeons in S1, then a combination of old and new for subsequent seasons. Otherwise, a chunk of new dungeons barely get any engagement by comparison for the first chunk of the expansion, which just comes off as all sorts of silly.

  17. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by Chilela View Post
    On paper, I'm mostly fine with the system. Although IMO it should have been all the new dungeons in S1, then a combination of old and new for subsequent seasons. Otherwise, a chunk of new dungeons barely get any engagement by comparison for the first chunk of the expansion, which just comes off as all sorts of silly.
    They'll still be there for M0s and leveling, I'd imagine. M+ isn't the only engagement metric that matters.

  18. #98
    Pit Lord Dristereau's Avatar
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    Would make much more sense to me for the Expansion to start with all eight DF Dungeons to show off a brand new Expansion. Then for Season 2/3 rotate four out each Season. Seems pretty daft to me that four of the Dragonflight Dungeons will be irrelevant and ignored after about two weeks when M0 loot is no longer useful.
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  19. #99
    Adding back banger dungeons and rebalancing them is only a good thing imo. Besides, playing them with a new seasonal affix is usually enough to keep them fresh for the season. Rotation is a good thing!

  20. #100
    Stood in the Fire Chilela's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Relapses View Post
    They'll still be there for M0s and leveling, I'd imagine. M+ isn't the only engagement metric that matters.
    I would presume as such as well, but once people start getting better gear, their engagement, again, is likely going to skid pretty hard. Not having all the new stuff at the start is really my only objection to how they're handling it. Otherwise, cycling older stuff in definitely keeps things a bit fresher overall.

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