Quote Originally Posted by sponge5307 View Post
I don't raid coz I don't have time to sit there for hours and hours and not even getting loot. I don't raid coz I don't want to be tie down to a schedule several hours a week to raid.
m+ was perfect I can do a few dungeons here and there and it doesn't take long. Now with the lower ilvl gear in m+ and the fact you need to get to m+20 for the max ilvl (which is more like a +23 on live). totally turn me off. I might just complete the story unsub and come back last season and see how things are.

For people who remember when in SL doing S1 to get +15 timed was terrible. It didn't get better till mid S2.
1) No one knows what the DragonFlight +20 difficult will be equivalent to in Shadowlands S4 [/I]. All you are reciting is the fact that the +% modifier of a DF +20 is the same as a +23 SL dungeon. Stop and think for a second.... what if a DF base mythic is 70% as hard a base mythic in SL. What if its 130% of the difficulty? Maybe its 50% as hard? The actual difficulty when it goes live is entirely dependent on what the base mythic is tuned like and how well our talents let us scale.

2) Worst case scenario you have to clear a 16 to get the exact same relative power (base mythic raid ilvl) to what you have now for clearing a 15. Why does that have you wanting to unsub? Is it really too much of an ask? A +15 was clearly easier than a final heroic raid boss, it needed to be knocked down a notch.

3) You were content to have sub-max ilvl gear by not doing mythic raiding -- but somehow you are not content to have sub-max ilvl gear by not pushing higher m+? If you don't want to do harder content, then don't do harder content. Its that simple. Don't pretend the system is holding you back. Envy is the only reason I can see someone complain about this. You must not like the idea of other players getting better gear than you for doing harder content that you could do, but apparently are unwilling to do for one reason or another.

4) So I actually agree with you a bit about SL s1, but I would clarify why it was harder ( and I would argue with calling a +15 hard even in S1). The first is that no one knew the dungeons. The second was that prideful could be very challenging to route. The difference between a well organized group and a pug was night and day. With DF the dungeons will be new each season, which means every season we will be going in more or less blind -- but if you look at how GRD and ID went in S4, I think the community will learn and overcome just fine. They have stated that they plan for the seasonal affix to be far less challenging, so I think may outright exclude the second problem from happening.

Not to say that DF won't have faults, it very likely will. I doubt the mythic plus changes will be one of them.