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  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by Kehego View Post
    idk man cata tanking was braindead too, if you dps the caster first they usually die first.

    also avengers shield silences, death grip exists, didnt wars have gag order atp as well?
    actually, I can still remember cata heroics near launch...

    pre-xpac people said wotlk was too easy and asked for a challenge...well...they got more than they bargained for. cata heroics (before mythics were introduced) were overtuned which led to a large runt/cry, which in turn led to a massive nerf across the board to all dungeons.

    cata heroics at launch were HARD, but once they got nerfed it was a bigger faceroll than wotlk.

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by leorana View Post
    actually, I can still remember cata heroics near launch...

    pre-xpac people said wotlk was too easy and asked for a challenge...well...they got more than they bargained for. cata heroics (before mythics were introduced) were overtuned which led to a large runt/cry, which in turn led to a massive nerf across the board to all dungeons.

    cata heroics at launch were HARD, but once they got nerfed it was a bigger faceroll than wotlk.
    The problem is that most players need to feel as they are amazing not be shown they are terrible. I myself find WoW boring if i stick with 1 class / spec for the expansion so i have to change it up every single season but what i do not do is want to be a gatekeeper on content either. Cataclysm heroics were terrible but what blizzard should have done is have a competing end game progression system akin to M+ to take away from the raiding pool for end game activities to force them into a more niche audience like it is now so you can have set standards for what people are willing to do and since people really care about 6-10 item levels on a few pieces its why raiding as blossomed into the premier end game activity.

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by leorana View Post
    actually, I can still remember cata heroics near launch...

    pre-xpac people said wotlk was too easy and asked for a challenge...well...they got more than they bargained for. cata heroics (before mythics were introduced) were overtuned which led to a large runt/cry, which in turn led to a massive nerf across the board to all dungeons.

    cata heroics at launch were HARD, but once they got nerfed it was a bigger faceroll than wotlk.
    Three rounds of nerfs. People were whispering me offering gold to tank for them because of the severe lack of tanks. They started call to arms then too. People just forget and remember things after the massive 5x aggro buff, the CC change not to put mobs in combat, the added interrupts to classes who had none and the dungeon nerfs.

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by leorana View Post
    cata heroics at launch were HARD, but once they got nerfed it was a bigger faceroll than wotlk.
    No they weren't. It was literally just: Interrupt enemies and don't stand in the aoes. And sometimes you had to jump if there was an expanding circle! omg! But this was too much of a demand placed upon the useless idiots that the LFD tool had turned everyone into. The same guys who still stand in frontal cones from 100% to dead in instances at this very moment. DPS who didn't interrupt, healers who couldn't heal for shit, and tanks who suffered heart attacks when they had to move Karsh Steelbender into the lava stream and then back out of it again, their brains couldn't comprehend this super-sophisticated maneuver. Tanks would just leave when they reached that boss, then you'd wait minutes for another one, who'd queue in and immediately leave as soon as he saw the boss. It was tragic. You have no idea how much less shit people are at the game today, thanks to m+ teaching them to stop being braindead. Cata heroics on launch were a joke, it's just that the entire player base had been made retarded by previous expansions' 5-man content.
    "Quack, quack, Mr. Bond."

  5. #65
    Scarab Lord Polybius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Simulacrum View Post
    No they weren't. It was literally just: Interrupt enemies and don't stand in the aoes. And sometimes you had to jump if there was an expanding circle! omg! But this was too much of a demand placed upon the useless idiots that the LFD tool had turned everyone into. The same guys who still stand in frontal cones from 100% to dead in instances at this very moment. DPS who didn't interrupt, healers who couldn't heal for shit, and tanks who suffered heart attacks when they had to move Karsh Steelbender into the lava stream and then back out of it again, their brains couldn't comprehend this super-sophisticated maneuver. Tanks would just leave when they reached that boss, then you'd wait minutes for another one, who'd queue in and immediately leave as soon as he saw the boss. It was tragic. You have no idea how much less shit people are at the game today, thanks to m+ teaching them to stop being braindead. Cata heroics on launch were a joke, it's just that the entire player base had been made retarded by previous expansions' 5-man content.
    The mechanics weren't THAT simple for the first two weeks (pre-nerf). Unique mechanics existed for all trash packs, with some spells being two- or one-shots. We got a taste of it when they were re-scaled for DF where spiky damage could not be healed on time. It wasn't harder than TBC but certainly not on the level of any other xpac. WotLK was faceroll, but Pits, Forge, and Halls were closer to early Cata dungeons.

    The biggest disadvantage was going in blind and not giving players enough time to adjust before dropping a nerfbat.

  6. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by sponge5307 View Post
    https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wo...-13/1439702/47
    Good blizzard did the right thing. We as tanks need more nerf. 10% to damage reduction only comes out to be like 5% more damage at most. That's nothing ddA better change is 20% to damage reduction, 25% to self heals or absorb shield tanks put on themselves and 25% reduce damage. Monks can be skip since they are already doing poorly.

    Is not fun when tanks pulls the whole room to the boss leaving all the dps and heals behind and end up soloing the whole dungeons while the group is trying to play catch up. This is right direction so tank actually will actually wait for the group to catch up instead of being an one man army. Why do group content when you are not going to work as a group?
    Umm... what? Doesn't 10% damage reduction mean 10% more damage taken? And when factoring in other mitigation/self healing, it likely means a significant increase to total external healing needed.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Loveliest View Post
    Three rounds of nerfs. People were whispering me offering gold to tank for them because of the severe lack of tanks. They started call to arms then too. People just forget and remember things after the massive 5x aggro buff, the CC change not to put mobs in combat, the added interrupts to classes who had none and the dungeon nerfs.
    dont worry. people will start crying for tanks again already this week. the tuning of instances is absolutely brutal compared even to S1 in SL .

    will be glorious whining fest on forums

  8. #68
    Bloodsail Admiral kosajk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    dont worry. people will start crying for tanks again already this week. the tuning of instances is absolutely brutal compared even to S1 in SL .

    will be glorious whining fest on forums
    yea had hard reality check on preapatch where before i could semi afk 30% of time and after i was been barely doing +15 with 100% focus and almost constant spam of heals ;P

    "Hope for the best and prepare for the worst"

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by SpaghettiMonk View Post
    Umm... what? Doesn't 10% damage reduction mean 10% more damage taken? And when factoring in other mitigation/self healing, it likely means a significant increase to total external healing needed.
    You also have active mitigation and other defense CD that can be use like Ironfur, SoTR, IP, Shield block, Ironbark etc etc. There are also Major def CD or even abilitiles that help reduce damage when you talent into them like Scintillating moonlight on the guardian druid when a target have moonfire on them they deal 10% less damage to you, Got some guildmate dgoing +9 and +10 already. VDH and he was clearing +9 with no issue on ilvl 378 to 380. Only started having issue +10 but it seems more like a dps fault since dps wasn't there. Dps seems a bit low.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by kamuimac View Post
    dont worry. people will start crying for tanks again already this week. the tuning of instances is absolutely brutal compared even to S1 in SL .

    will be glorious whining fest on forums
    The tank seems fine so far when doing normal on the fury warrior that just ding last night, and on hunter doing heroic, doesn't seem to take longer than usual for a tank. I myself tank a few heroic on my druid just to test things out. Going to tank some m+ later tonight or gear up my warrior. People are just complaining for nothing.

  10. #70
    Modern healing design in dungeons is quite a lot different compared to early M+ iterations like Legion.

    Tanks are predominately self-contained in terms of threat and self-healing. The healer's job is to recognise and memorise damage patterns that will require their intervention to protect the tank (either through an external CD or direct healing), triage the group, and provide as much damage as possibe.
    “You can never get a cup of tea large enough or a book long enough to suit me.”
    – C.S. Lewis

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