1. #20241
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    Have they said whether or not Amirdrassil raid will be Week One? Not that I think they really care about how that story ends, seeing as the related files aren't even encrypted, but I am wondering if they will spoil the tree's new model in the 11.0 reveal. I think it will pop into being when you clear the raid, similar to Silithus after you beat Argus.
    Season probably starts a week after patch release date like for the last few raids.

  2. #20242
    Quote Originally Posted by Murlocos View Post
    I think 1.15 will end up being SoM 2, a set of fresh servers that likely will have larger and more comprehensive changes than SoM did but ultimately still a refresh of vanilla. It'd be analogous to the gradual increase in changes they've been making with TBC and Wrath.

    If I was a Classic+ believer/hoper, I think the number one thing I'd be checking for is if the Classic team was hiring more artists.
    They could perhaps be testing the waters with something like a new dungeon, or a similar enough small content drop that isn't very expensive to make but that they can attach to another seasonal content ala SoM to drive up hype. But that's the most I expect. Anything close to expansion-scale content for Classic seems like a total pie in the sky dream to me, but hey I've been wrong before.

    And Cata Classic seems inevitable as well, albeit it may be the Classic expansion with the most changes to date considering its controversial aspects.
    It is all that is left unsaid upon which tragedies are built -Kreia

    The internet: where to every action is opposed an unequal overreaction.

  3. #20243
    On the topic of a world revamp (for retail) I’ve seen alot of people say wow is in maintenance mode so we wont get a revamp but in my mind wouldn’t graphicly updating ek, Kalimdor and mabye parts of northrend be the perfect way to set up maintenance mode, we would have 10 continents/realms/islands to have storylines set in (outlands excluded because its a little too dated, an draenor is basically modern out-lands anyway. plus lore wise its falling apart an theres a mass exodus).

    each season could be 4 classic-cata dungeon’s revamped with 4 mop-df dungeons, then a raid an story campaign all based on one theme just using existing instances and zones think very patch 8.3 but with alot more zones to work with

    Exsample we could have a necromancy patch with a story campaign spanning all the scourge expansion zones with 4 vanilla/wrath scourge dungeons revamped such as drak tharon keep, pit of saron an the stratholme dungeons then the other 4 dungeons could be shadowmoon burial grounds, maw of souls, waycrest manner and the necrotic wake, an obviously a new raid to go with the season

    Less man power way of making a thematically an graphically consistent season/patch

  4. #20244
    Quote Originally Posted by Terremer View Post
    where does it come from?
    The epilogue of Secrets of Azeorth:

    It is unsettling to see. After all, the Burning Legion has threatened Azeroth time and time again.
    That said, we believe this text predates the time when Sargeras ruled over the demons of the Burning Legion. Though the exact origin has yet to be discovered.
    https://www.wowhead.com/es/news/secr...t-chest-335076

  5. #20245
    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    They could perhaps be testing the waters with something like a new dungeon, or a similar enough small content drop that isn't very expensive to make but that they can attach to another seasonal content ala SoM to drive up hype. But that's the most I expect. Anything close to expansion-scale content for Classic seems like a total pie in the sky dream to me, but hey I've been wrong before.

    And Cata Classic seems inevitable as well, albeit it may be the Classic expansion with the most changes to date considering its controversial aspects.
    Because of Classic progressing at the same rate as retail, once they hit an expansion that was not popular, the playerbase is going to become a huge problem. Unpopular expansions have no classic appeal. I forsee two possible solutions to this:

    1.) Classic Realms become Progression Realms: They rotate through major content tiers, but at an accelerated rate, until the realm becomes a normal retail realm. More loot drops & Experience rates are hugely inflated allowing players to get through the content faster. They seemed to be playing with this idea when they introduced Season of Mastery.

    2.) Classic+: Not a new expansion but new content. The realms progress at the same rate, parallel with retail. But they introduce bits of new content, focusing on the expansions that were not received positively: They introduce a new raid tier between BRF and HFC during WoD Classic, They add a new warfront during BFA, etc. This turns an expansion people don't want to try into an expansion they do.

    I'm trying to meet the classic+ theorists halfway but I got the idea that it wouldnt be a waste of production time to complete content they left unfinished, like the Shattrath Raid in WoD. Or Turning Battle For Ardenweald into a Raid. Maybe even the Drakkari raid in Wotlk.
    Last edited by Ersula; 2023-09-27 at 03:54 PM.

  6. #20246
    Quote Originally Posted by Marlamin View Post
    Artists have historically been shared between teams as was said in a Brian Birmingham interview at some point, but there have been positions for designers/programmers that have been largely filled for a while as well as some job descriptions with somewhat suspicious mentions of expansions for Classic, but that could just be a copy paste error from retail job descriptions.
    I wonder if that approach will continue to work if Classic does end up needing a full-scale content pipeline of its own though, at least without impacting retail. To be fair, I'm basing that off comparison to how Old School Runescape was handled, where they were bottlenecked by a lack of artists when they first committed to new content creation and were heavily reliant on existing asset reuse for the first year or so.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jastall View Post
    And Cata Classic seems inevitable as well, albeit it may be the Classic expansion with the most changes to date considering its controversial aspects.
    The slightly truncated patch cycle alone will probably help a fair amount by itself. Getting to 4.1 and Firelands faster and only letting Dragon Soul linger for a few months. I imagine 4.2 is going to be given the longest time in the sun similar to how Ulduar in Wrath Classic lasted longer than the original.

  7. #20247
    Quote Originally Posted by Ersula View Post
    Are you saying the investor's report is a lie? Because that would be a felony.
    You posted:
    The Quarterly Investors' call. They haven't given DF's exact numbers but every recent expansion has sold between 3 and 4 million copies.
    And considering the current playerbase cancels their respective subs after a month or two..o wait, you don't really expect anyone to believe that most stay subbed year around? Because that ship sailed years ago. Along with the millions of subscribers that Blizz used to publicly boast of. Monthly revenue they don't receive anymore.
    Quote Originally Posted by Makorus View Post
    Subscriber retention is also higher than previous expansions.
    That doesn't say anything. You have players that pay for a month or so, cancel sub, and return. Whether that means 50% or 80% that's monthly revenue that dips and steadies. anymore.
    Quote Originally Posted by Makorus View Post
    Saying that Retail is a "dead end" is batshit insane. Any other MMO can wish to even get a third of those sales, and that's following the worst received expansions that made a majority of the player base switch to another MMO.
    But this isn't about other MMOs. This is about an MMO that once bragged loud and proud of 12 million subscribers.

  8. #20248
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    And considering the current playerbase cancels their respective subs after a month or two..o wait, you don't really expect anyone to believe that most stay subbed year around? Because that ship sailed years ago. Along with the millions of subscribers that Blizz used to publicly boast of. Monthly revenue they don't receive anymore. That doesn't say anything. You have players that pay for a month or so, cancel sub, and return. Whether that means 50% or 80% that's monthly revenue that dips and steadies. anymore. But this isn't about other MMOs. This is about an MMO that once bragged loud and proud of 12 million subscribers.
    You were asking about copies of Dragonflight sold. And even then we know subscriber retention is good. Copies sold & subscriber retention are different things. You seem to be confused about what these terms mean. WoW still makes way more money than any other MMORPG & its not purely because of classic. If you logged into Retail once & a while you would know this.

  9. #20249
    Quote Originally Posted by Ersula View Post
    You were asking about copies of Dragonflight sold. And even then we know subscriber retention is good.
    None of which means anything rosy. (Retention of the diehards that come and go is neaningless.)
    Quote Originally Posted by Ersula View Post
    Copies sold & subscriber retention are different things. You seem to be confused about what these terms mean. WoW still makes way more money than any other MMORPG & its not purely because of classic.
    Again, comparison to other MMOs isn't meaningful. Compare WoW today to the business they once had.
    ...quite the fall.

  10. #20250
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    You posted:
    And considering the current playerbase cancels their respective subs after a month or two..o wait, you don't really expect anyone to believe that most stay subbed year around? Because that ship sailed years ago. Along with the millions of subscribers that Blizz used to publicly boast of. Monthly revenue they don't receive anymore. That doesn't say anything. You have players that pay for a month or so, cancel sub, and return. Whether that means 50% or 80% that's monthly revenue that dips and steadies. anymore. But this isn't about other MMOs. This is about an MMO that once bragged loud and proud of 12 million subscribers.
    Once again, please enlighten me:

    In what world is Retail WoW a dead end?

    You are arguing a point that no one else, which is that WoW has less players than it used to have, which is correct, but what's your argument?

  11. #20251
    Quote Originally Posted by Makorus View Post
    Once again, please enlighten me:

    In what world is Retail WoW a dead end?

    You are arguing a point that no one else, which is that WoW has less players than it used to have, which is correct, but what's your argument?
    Feels like half this forum is part of a group that strongly tied their personal identity to this game in the past (probably in their 20s), and they feel personally betrayed on a deep level by x y or z, so they need the game to fall apart to feel validated somehow. And the best part is that of course they'll eventually "win."

    2030, WoW shuts down - told ya, losers! That one story beat I hated in 2016 ruined everything!

    Never mind the 40,000 forum posts in between instead of just moving on lol
    “Every great cause begins as a movement, becomes a business, and eventually degenerates into a racket.” -Eric Hoffer

  12. #20252
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    None of which means anything rosy. (Retention of the diehards that come and go is neaningless.)
    You seem to think player retention means resubs and it doesn't: Retention means uninterrupted subscriptions. It's better than during the same point in Shadowlands and its where they make the majority of their money. That's not meaningless.
    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowferal View Post
    Compare WoW today to the business they once had.
    ...quite the fall.
    Compared to the mass graveyard of dead mmos? WoW is still king. You're hyperfixated on details that don't matter. Cable TV and Streaming also radically devolved but that doesn't mean they're not enormous industires or they're going to stop producing it.

  13. #20253
    Scarab Lord Polybius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by snewo View Post
    Errr, not really?

    "Executive Creative Director of the 'Warcraft Universe'."

    Hearthstone isn't canon so it won't be utilizing Chris Metzen, which leaves just WoW Classic and Retail, or some unannounced Warcraft game containing story.

    However, it then goes on to state "right now he's supporting World of Warcraft leadership in crafting the next generation of adventures". That implies, at the very least, that he isn't hands on for retail development. He's supporting others who lead that.

    So either he's heading up some unannounced project, OR, he's hands on working on Classic+.

    Either way, it's clearly worded in a way that is ambiguous and undoubtedly wider in scope than just working on existing Warcraft games.
    I’m sorry, but how does ‘next generation’ and ‘future of World of Warcraft’ imply an expansion on Classic?

    Why would Classic get priority for revamp/development when the assets existed before Classic’s announcement?

  14. #20254
    Quote Originally Posted by Ersula View Post
    You seem to think player retention means resubs and it doesn't: Retention means uninterrupted subscriptions. It's better than during the same point in Shadowlands and its where they make the majority of their money. That's not meaningless.
    To be fair: the fewer people you have left, the more of those are likely to be part of the iron core that wouldn't unsub if Ion came and beat up their grandmother. More people = more potential transient players who are more willing to quit if they don't like it. Fewer people = bigger likelihood that the ones remaining are die-hards whose entire identity and life is intertwined with it.

  15. #20255
    Can we PLEASE get another megathread to contain the endless "WOW is dead" "no it isnt" back and forth?

  16. #20256
    Quote Originally Posted by Yarathir View Post
    To be fair: the fewer people you have left, the more of those are likely to be part of the iron core that wouldn't unsub if Ion came and beat up their grandmother. More people = more potential transient players who are more willing to quit if they don't like it. Fewer people = bigger likelihood that the ones remaining are die-hards whose entire identity and life is intertwined with it.
    I'm like 90% that my grandmother could have taken ion in a fight, so honestly that's just free entertainment.

  17. #20257
    Quote Originally Posted by Ferlion View Post
    I'm like 90% that my grandmother could have taken ion in a fight, so honestly that's just free entertainment.
    I like your grandmother already.

  18. #20258
    Scarab Lord Polybius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pheraz View Post
    Kinda weird some classic+ bros keep coming to this thread recently. I don't know where this idea got cooked but this will definitely not happen.
    They introduced classic to recapture the initial game and expansions. The majority of classic fans expressed they don't want the game to be touched. And now some people come up with this classic+ idea.
    I guess maybe those people should just stick to their weird incarnations of wow on those illegal private servers instead of trying to fake a majority of people that want whatever classic+ is, that doesn't exist. It's starting to become a little bit annoying IMO
    Quote Originally Posted by Cheezits View Post
    Can we PLEASE get another megathread to contain the endless "WOW is dead" "no it isnt" back and forth?
    Second this. It has no place here and it’s bordering malice.

  19. #20259
    Quote Originally Posted by Yarathir View Post
    I like your grandmother already.
    Honestly, haven't talked to her in a long while due to family dynamics, but last I heard?

    Dating an Elvis impersonator in her 80s.

  20. #20260
    Quote Originally Posted by Polybius View Post
    Second this. It has no place here and it’s bordering malice.
    I'm fine with Classic+ discussion as notable hint dropper is building up to it, and there are some hints in the files. It's also future Warcraft speculation so it kind of fits this thread, though a separate megathread would be better.

    "Lol WoW is doing badly, cope" has no real relation to the thread.

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